In Texas, the most effective group fighting vouchers is Pastors for Texas Children. They understand that the state must support all public schools equitably. They also understand that separation of church and state protects religious liberty. They don’t think that churches should become intertwined with politicians.
Peter Greene agrees with Pastors for Texas Children. Churches, he says, should hate vouchers.
“It seems clear that the wall between church and state, particularly when it comes to educational voucher programs, is collapsing like a stack of cheerios in a stiff wind. This is not good for a variety of reasons, but those reasons do not all belong to supporters of public education. Even before I was a cranky blogger, I was telling folks that religious institutions should be right out there resisting vouchers, and that if school vouchers with no regard for the church and state wall ever became law, churches would rue the day just as much as anyone, if not more.
“So what’s my point? Why should churches want to get that stack of cheerios back up and fortified?
“It’s important to remember that the separation of church and state is not just for the state’s benefit– it protects churches as well. Once Betsy DeVos and Mike Pence get their way (I’m not convinced that Trump either knows or understands any of the issues here), here’s how things are going to go south.
“First, tax dollars for education will still be directed by the politicians in capitals. That means that churches will have to become experienced in the business of political pandering. And this is not my prediction for the future– it is happening right now.Caitlin Emma at Politico is reporting today on the Catholic Church’s are meeting with GOP lawmakers and administration officials to see if the Trump-DeVos voucher plan can be implemented in such a way as the be financially beneficial for parochial schools.
“Let that sink in. Church officials are going to try to cut a deal, with politicians, for money. In a no-walls voucher world, churches and other religious groups financially dependent on the good will of politicians will have to make sure they stay on the good side of politicians. Church leaders will have to consider “This guy is odious and spits in the face of everything we believe, but we need him to keep the money flowing to us.” Did I mention that Catholic Church officials are meeting with Trump administration officials? Once several different religions and denominations get involved, just how much religious lobbying will be required to argue how the education dollar pie is sliced up?…
“Where government money goes, politics follow, and when you mix religion and politics, you get politics.* Will a church that wants those public dollars mute its religious character to avoid problems? A study of Catholic schools in voucherfied Milwaukee suggests the answer is yes. Will taxpayers rise up when they think their dollars are being spent on a religious group they object to? That looks like a yes, too.
“That’s before we even start to talk about regulations and laws and rules that may or may not contradict religious beliefs.
“Vouchers are a bad policy idea for so many reasons, but many of those reasons have to do with protecting the very religious institutions that, in some cases, hope to profit from them. And reconsidering the church tax exemption is already being brought up– what does a church do when a politician says, “I can keep that tax thing off your back as long as your political activity is political activity I like.”
“Religious institutions and church-related schools should beware. Vouchers are a trap, and bad news for everyone involved.”

The public school here has always had a good relationship with the Catholic school. It’s partly because the Catholic school is only K-8 and they lose kids as they go up in grade level so they all end up at the public school eventually- in high school at the latest.
I’ve had a lot of interaction with the private school parents over the years though and I have to say they make apples and oranges comparisons. They insist the Catholic school operates more cheaply than the public school but that’s deceptive because Ohio already funds private schools- they are publicly-funded for materials (textbooks and the like), transportation and many extracurriculars. The schools cost less to operate because the public system picks up a fairly large share of their costs. Too, they pay teachers about 10k a year less. They aren’t going to convince me paying teachers 15 dollars an hour is the direction public schools should go in. That’s not a “plus” in my book.
I’ve had kids in public schools here for more than 25 years and the truth is newer teachers start at the Catholic school and then switch to the public school, because it pays better. I sometimes think national pundits still believe Catholic schools are staffed by nuns and obviously staffing your school with what is essentially a free workforce cuts costs, but I haven’t seen a nun teaching at that school in 20 years. What I see are younger teachers – the exact same group of potential employees the public schools use.
I think setting them up as competitors is a mistake. These working relationships in communities are compromises- there’s a lot of diplomacy involved. To blow up fragile bonds like that in pursuit of some private sector cut-throat system will damage communities and what are really norms of decent behavior. It’s really NOT McDonalds versus Burger King. That’s a fundamental error.
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I also think there’s some denial from private school parents that the exclusivity is a draw.
I have been told more times than I can count that the Catholic school expels students who misbehave. I’m a higher income parent and this is presented to me as a “plus”- my kids won’t pick up “bad habits”.
That’s not the role of public schools. It’s okay if it’s the role of private schools but to say that public schools should be blamed for serving a public role, their specific designated role, is ludicrous. That’s the point. It’s why the state of Ohio established a public system in the first place. It doesn’t make them lesser schools. They serve a completely different role. There should be a recognition that if you have a group of publicly-funded schools who choose students there has to be a group of schools who don’t, or we are going to have serious problems. For all that ed reformers blather on about “systems thinking” they seem to miss this giant elephant in the room.
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“There is an urgent need for investments into new educational models with proven efficacy that address the nation’s achievement and skills gaps,” said Mark Grovic, general partner and founder of New Markets Venture Partners. “Given ACT’s long history of leadership and innovation in assessment and college and career readiness, New Markets is excited to work with them to identify and support the nation’s best education entrepreneurs working to remove the obstacles that prevent students from reaching their full potential. ACT will be a great partner both for us and for our portfolio companies.”
I feel like one could safely write an op ed about “schools over-investing in technology” right now, and be 5 years ahead of what is the inevitable crash 🙂
Why do they do this? Why do they over-promise and behave like lemmings? Why not be the school administrator who says “we’ll just wait and see if this has any value”
You don’t get points for taking all the risk. There’s no trophy for that. In fact, the public will REWARD schools that make good investment decisions and don’t fall for a sales pitch. They saw what happened in LA when they over-sold the Ipads. They learned nothing from that? They’re not gonna sink billions into “personalized learning” and all volunteer to suffer all the downside risk?
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Religious institutions of higher learning, have accepted students with BEOG’s, federal student loans, and GI Bill students for many years. You can get federal tax money, and attend an Islamic university, where sharia law is taught. There is no church-state issue at the university level, and no church-state issue at the K-12 level.
This has been settled constitutional law for over 15 years.
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Charles,
Which university in the US teaches Sharia law?
Is there a Wiccan University too?
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Here is one, The Islamic University of Minnesota:
http://www.iuminnesota.com/
It is a “hotbed of extremism” see
https://www.investigativeproject.org/5288/islamic-university-of-minnesota-a-hotbed
Students attend this institution, using BEOG’s and other federal tax money.
There are other Islamic universities in the USA, which teach Sharia law. see
https://www.internationalstudent.com/study_usa/religious-schools/us-islamic-schools/
These colleges teach Islamic concepts, including the subjugation of women, Female Genital Mutilation, physical abuse of women, whim divorce, all homosexuals should be killed (the only debate is how are they to be killed, favorite method is pushing them off buildings),destruction of Israel, etc.
Your tax dollars at work.
There are Wiccan and Witchcraft schools in the USA:
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perfect response
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You do realize that federal student loans have to be repaid, don’t you? With interest? So that’s not really government money being used to pay for religious institutions, any more than if you get a loan from Chase or Bank of America.
As for the G.I. Bill, that’s part of service members’ compensation, so, again, that’s their money. It’s the same as the silly Hobby Lobby kerfuffle about not wanting to provide their employees with health coverage that covers birth control. Health coverage is part of an employee’s compensation, so it is his/her money to spend in accordance with his/her morals, not the company’s.
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Did you see that the “holier than thou” Hobby Lobby so conflicted about birth control was recently fined $3 million for smuggling Iraqi artifacts that were most likely bought from Isis to fund their campaign? No charges were made. If a private citizen had done this, he would have gone to jail or maybe even charged with treason.
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I went to college using a federal student loan. I know the procedure. I also received BEOG’s. A person can receive a BEOG, and attend a religious institution. The student gets public (tax) money, and uses the money to pay for education at Holy Cross, catholic university of America, Yeshiva, Texas Methodist, Notre Dame, etc.
There is no constitutional issue at the university level, and no constitutional issue about using tax money to pay for education at K-12 either.
Government money flows in rivers to religious institutions all over this land.
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The SCOTUS’s 2002 Zelman ruling was bad law. I reversed a long history of correct rulings from 1947 to the late 1980s. Limited tax aid to church colleges is different because, as the SCOTUS held in the 1970s, the students are not as impressionable and indoctrinatable as K-12 kids. — Edd Doerr
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The Zelman decision was excellent. States/municipalities can assist parents in making informed school choices, as long as the parochial school choice is part of an overall school choice program. The recent Trinity School District v. Pauley (2017) decision went 7-2. States/municipalities can now provide secular assistance (like shredded tire chips) to religiously-operated schools.
When parents make the conscious decision to enroll their children in religiously-operated schools, the parents want their children to be “indoctrinated”, that is the object of the exercise of the choice.
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What Zelman approved was Ohio’s right to force taxpayers to support religious institutions that they would not support voluntarily. Thus Zelman poked its finger in the eye of every citizen’s religious freedom and also weakened our public schools.
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The Catholic bishops are on one side, but most ordinary Catholics are on the other side. We can understand why Catholics in the 19th century were not happy with public schools with Protestant prayers and Bible readings and so created parochial schools. However, after the Supreme Court’s early 1960s rulings against Protestant hegemony Catholic school enrollment declined from 5.5 million to today’s 1.8 million. Pro-voucher Nixon had studies done by Catholic universities, but was disappointed when they showed that the decline had little or nothing to do with costs. Public schools had simply become acceptable to Catholics. (I am an honors grad of Indiana’s leading Catholic hich school.) — Edd Doerr
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What about vouchers for another public school that’s 5 minutes away which spends less per student than the school I’m districted for?
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