Sam Husseini of the Institute for Public Accuracy invited me and several others to submit questions for John King’s press conference at the National Press Club. I was interested in knowing what he thought about the NAACP’s call for a moratorium on new charter schools until there were assurances of accountability and unless they stopped diverting resources from public schools. You will note that Secretary King continued his full-throated advocacy for more charters and said that it was up to states to make the rules. Not only does he completely ignore the existence of the nation’s public schools, not only does he disregard the NAACP, he intends to keep shoveling hundreds of millions of federal dollars to new charter schools with no expectation of accountability or transparency.
Husseini wrote:
Some of the questions I got from folks were asked at the “news maker” event with Education Secretary John King at the National Press Club yesterday. Here are those questions — as asked by the moderator, which may be slightly different than how they were submitted — along with King’s responses. Here’s full PDF. Here’s full video. (Part of the first question here was from Diane Ravitch, as was the last question, below. The middle question was from my partner, Emily Prater, who is a third grade teacher at a Title I school in Washington, D.C.
MR. BALLOU: Charter Schools. You’ve said, “What I worry most about is we have some states that have done a really great job with charter authorizing and so have generally high quality charters and have been willing to close ones that are underperforming. On the other hand, you have states who’ve not done as good a job, 17 places like Michigan. We have a history of a low bar for getting a charter and an unwillingness to hold charters to high standards. What’s your view on where charter authorizing should be by the time you leave office, and how do you plan to get there? As someone who cites your own education in New York for saving your life and trajectory, and what of non-charter public schools? For some time, one of the arguments against charters was over resources about charters getting better resources than public education.
And there’s actually a second question sort of tied to this. A few days ago, the NAACP’s national; board called for a moratorium on new charter schools until laws are revised to make charters as accountable and as transparent as public schools. Do you agree with them, that charter schools should meet the same standards of accountability as public schools? And if you do, will you stop funding new charter schools as they recommend?
SECRETARY KING: So, let me start with this. We are fortunate, I think, as a country to have some high performing charters that are doing a great job and providing great opportunities to students. Charters that are helping students not only perform at higher levels academically, but go on to college at much higher rates than demographically similar students and succeed there. That’s good, we should have more schools like that and I think any arbitrary gap on the growth of high performing charters is a mistake in terms of our goal of trying to improve opportunity for all kids.
That said, where states are doing a bad job on charter authorizing, that has to change. You know, I’ve talked about the example of Michigan. We have states that have set a low bar for getting a charter, and then when charters perform poorly, they fail to take action to either improve them or close them, which is the essence of the charter school compact. Charter schools were supposed to be a compact, more autonomy in exchange for greater accountability. And yet, some states have not followed through on that compact. That is a problem.
Now, those decisions are made at the state level, they’re made based on state law. What we’ve done in the administration over the last eight years is two things. One is we’ve provided resources to improve charter authorizing in states and worked with states to strengthen their practices around reviewing the quality of charters, reviewing the quality of charter applications.
And two, we’ve invested in increasing the supply of great high performing charters. But, to the extent that what folks are saying is they want states to do a better job on charter authorizing, I agree. But where we have states that are doing a good job on charter authorizing and we have charters that are doing great jobs for kids that want to grow, they should be able to. And I think this is an issue where we’ve got to put kids first. We’ve got to ask what’s best for the students and parents.
As Arne would often point out, students and parents aren’t as concerned about the governance model as they are about is my child getting a quality education? We’ve got to be focused on that, which is one of the reasons why I think arbitrary caps don’t make sense, is we shouldn’t limit kids’ access to great opportunities.
MR. BALLOU: A lot of teachers have been writing. (Laughter) What do you propose to do about the equality of pay between teachers and administrators, for example, like yourself? One teacher says, “I worked 12 hours yesterday, I didn’t have time for lunch. Did you have time for lunch? I make $47,000 a year. How much do you make,” which of course is public record. “I can’t go to the bathroom when I need to. Can you go to the bathroom when you need to? And please don’t talk about how great teachers are. We don’t need empty rhetoric. We need resources, we need policies that actually help us teach, not help profiteers.” How do you– a pretty upset teacher there.
SECRETARY KING: Yeah, look. I think we see across the country, we see states that have not made the investment they should in their education system. We did a report earlier this year, the department, looking at the difference in state investment in prisons versus K-12 education. And what we found is that we see over the last 30 years rate of increase in investment spending on prisons that is three times as high as the rate of increase in spending on K-12 education.
That suggests to me that as a society, we haven’t put our resources where we should. So, are there states that should be spending significantly more on teacher salaries? Absolutely. And should we be paying more to teachers, especially teachers who are willing to serve in the highest needs communities and the highest needs fields where we have real demand? Absolutely. And the President’s proposed that. The President proposed a billion dollars for an initiative called Best Job in the World that would support professional development, incentives, career ladders for teachers who teach in the highest needs communities.
So we agree about the need for more resources and focusing those resources on teachers. One of the places I worry most about is in early leaning. We did a study on preK pay and found that in many communities around the country, pre-K teachers are making half what they would be making if they were working in an elementary school, which again suggests that our priorities are not right.
So this is a place where I agree with the questioner, we need to invest more resources in educators. We should pay our teachers very well because we know that teachers are essential to the future of our country. And we need to make sure the working conditions are good. It’s not just a question of teacher pay. I think of a place like Detroit, you know. If the water is leaking from the ceiling and there are rodents running across the floor, those working conditions are not ones that are going to make teaching a profession that people want or a profession people will want to stay in over the long term. And so we’ve got to make sure that working conditions are strong.
And the final point I’d make, is this is one of the reasons that supplement, not supplant, is so important because if you consistently under-resource the highest needs schools, the result will be poor working conditions in those schools and the inability to retain the great teachers that our highest needs students need.
MR. BALLOU: We’re running quickly out of time. Had an issue with one of your senior staff who had to resign over waste fraud and financial abuse. Have you been able to clean up the issues in the Inspector General’s office?
SECRETARY KING: So, this is about an employee in our IT department who made mistakes and was accountable for those mistakes, chose ultimately to resign. He’s no longer with the department. We have a very strong team around our IT and we are very focused, as folks are across the administration, on continuously strengthening cyber security. This is actually cyber security awareness month. Just came from a cyber security convening at the department this morning. We’re very focused on making sure that our IT systems are as strong as possible, that we protect the security of data. And that we insure that we’re providing good services.
So for example, Collegescorecard.ed.gov is a tool that we’ve built and through our investment in the strength of our IT systems, and work across the administration to leverage technology on behalf of taxpayers and students, Collegescorecad.ed.gov allows students to find information about every college, to find out about their graduation rates, how much people make who’ve graduated from that school, how able folks who’ve graduated from that school are able to repay their loans. It’s a great tool that we’ve made available and that is continuously evolving to try to provide services.
So IT is really a strength now of the department. But as is true across– for any employer, there are sometimes employees who make mistakes and we have systems in place to insure that that’s dealt with.

The federal government through the USDOE should not be in the charter school business in any way. Providing federal funds for charters schools that come under the authority of the US Secretary of Education violates the US Constitution. This needs to be challenged.
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OMG, then WHY is he Secretary of the USDoE? Oh forgot. To CLOSE public schools. Where is King’s ethics and courage? Answer: GONE and never had any. Sad.
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While King blames the states for the failure to fully fund and support public schools, he has little to say about how his office is responsible for creating the climate in which it is accepted to denigrate public schools and teachers. The secretary of the DOE is responsible to setting the stage for the public school witch hunt of the last eight years. It is much easier for him to promote his new tool for getting the value out of college. Let me guess the results. Attendees of the Ivy League earn the most, and community college attendees earn the least. They should have spent the money on something more meaningful.
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I saw the press conference with all lovey dovey concern for the state of CIVIC education. Wants all teachers to address it , every subject, every grade, etc. etc. etc. All a sideways response to questions about bullying. Not a hint that USDE policies are wrong. Not a hint that his discipline polices while a charter operartor were extreme. That whole charade was just before the debates.
Still in recovery from those.
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Laura,
I thought the presidential debates should come with a warning. Not for children! Adult supervision necessary!
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Really consistent throughout the Obama Administration:
https://twitter.com/edu_post?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
Try to find a positive mention of a public school. It’s literally 90% charter cheerleading.
Completely arbitrary charter cheerleading, too. They cheer unlimited expansion of charter schools in Michigan and Ohio with the same single-minded zeal they use in Massachusetts and NYC.
They don’t have a clue what’s going on with Ohio charters, but they’re pushing them constantly. The President travels to Cleveland and promotes increased funding for Cleveland charters while completely ignoring Cleveland public schools. Apparently those kids don’t rate advocacy for their schools. Someone should tell them their schools have fallen out of fashion in DC circles. They probably don’t know.
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Do I really want to subject myself to watching this video??
When I know that what I will see will be 100% Pure Grade AA Bovine Excrement.
Am I that insane and/or masochistic?
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Regarding caps on charters, here’s something interesting I just found (that also happened two days ago):
The Mayor and city council of an entire city, Huntington Park, California — whose schools (both public and charter) are within LAUSD’s geographic area and governance / charter oversight — just voted to impose a 1-year moratorium on authorizing any new charter schools, as well as any expansion of existing charter schools.
This was met with resistance from the California Charter Schools Association — who threatened to sue — and charteristas at the meeting where the vote took place:
http://www.latimes.com/local/education/la-me-edu-huntington-park-charter-moratorium-20161014-snap-story.html
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Ed reformers themselves say this at echo chamber events.
Here’s Chris Cerf at one of the tens of charter promotion events they hold in DC:
“In a speech delivered at the right-leaning American Enterprise Institute in Washington, D.C., Cerf said there is a widespread perception that education reform attempted by public school systems cannot work.
“The evidence of this sentiment is everywhere,” he said. “Reform has taken on a pejorative connotation.”
They don’t invest in public schools anymore. Public schools “cannot work”. That’s the consensus in DC, among the people we pay to make policy for public schools.
Boy, you won’t hear an ed reform politician admit THAT at a rally, huh? That they’ve completely abandoned public schools in favor of their preferred privatized system.
https://twitter.com/The74?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
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If DC has already determined that public schools “can’t work” when were they planning on letting the public in on this belief?
My Senators never say that publicly. Why not? Then we’d know not to vote for them.
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These comments from Secretary King would seem to reflect concern about district public schools, the students who attend them and the teachers who work in them:
“I think we see across the country, we see states that have not made the investment they should in their education system. We did a report earlier this year, the department, looking at the difference in state investment in prisons versus K-12 education. And what we found is that we see over the last 30 years rate of increase in investment spending on prisons that is three times as high as the rate of increase in spending on K-12 education.
That suggests to me that as a society, we haven’t put our resources where we should. So, are there states that should be spending significantly more on teacher salaries? Absolutely. And should we be paying more to teachers, especially teachers who are willing to serve in the highest needs communities and the highest needs fields where we have real demand? Absolutely. And the President’s proposed that. The President proposed a billion dollars for an initiative called Best Job in the World that would support professional development, incentives, career ladders for teachers who teach in the highest needs communities.
So we agree about the need for more resources and focusing those resources on teachers. One of the places I worry most about is in early leaning. We did a study on preK pay and found that in many communities around the country, pre-K teachers are making half what they would be making if they were working in an elementary school, which again suggests that our priorities are not right.
So this is a place where I agree with the questioner, we need to invest more resources in educators. We should pay our teachers very well because we know that teachers are essential to the future of our country. And we need to make sure the working conditions are good. It’s not just a question of teacher pay. I think of a place like Detroit, you know. If the water is leaking from the ceiling and there are rodents running across the floor, those working conditions are not ones that are going to make teaching a profession that people want or a profession people will want to stay in over the long term. And so we’ve got to make sure that working conditions are strong.
And the final point I’d make, is this is one of the reasons that supplement, not supplant, is so important because if you consistently under-resource the highest needs schools, the result will be poor working conditions in those schools and the inability to retain the great teachers that our highest needs students need.”
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“We haven’t put our resources where we should…” so I will continue to direct as many federal dollars as possible to charter schools in states like Ohio where the hundreds of millions in state and federal dollars directed to charters has made operators rich while bankrupting school systems and not delivering the great results promised?
King controls exactly where federal resources go. Furthermore, as far as I can tell based on the rest of his speech about “good” charters, in order for him to have more good ones, he needs to make sure public schools exist so they can dump any difficult or expensive kids there, period. That seems to be their highest value to him.
I can only imagine how much of this Best Job in the World Initiative funding is planned to go right to those Relay Graduate Schools to support that professional development.
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Congress decides how to allocate funds.
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JOHN King has wide discretion over how to allocate federal funds. Congress determines how much.
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Congress and the Obama Administration made a deal. Congress would get their policy preference for privatized schools and huge increases in charter promotion and funding in return for a (slight) increase in pre-k funding.
That’s the deal they made. That satisfied Democrats and Republicans. Republicans advance privatization and Democrats get to claim they expanded pre-k.
You’ll notice what was left out of that deal. Public schools. Not a high priority, clearly. Last on the list in DC.
Here’s what public schools got out of 24 months of Administration and Congressional wrangling- state mandates for testing and ranking instead of federal mandates for testing and ranking. Woopee! Pop the champagne corks! More testing schemes for public school kids!
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Joseph Nathan, you’ve got to be one of the only people reading this blog who believes a word John King says.
The man is an utter fraud and incompetent, as amply demonstrated by his serial failures in NY and Washington.
So, is it gullibility or disingenuousness on your part?
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A third option – willingness to acknowledge some things he says are facts. For example, in some places public school teachers work in absolutely awful conditions, and that must be changed. As he explained,
“We need to make sure the working conditions are good. It’s not just a question of teacher pay. I think of a place like Detroit, you know. If the water is leaking from the ceiling and there are rodents running across the floor, those working conditions are not ones that are going to make teaching a profession that people want or a profession people will want to stay in over the long term. And so we’ve got to make sure that working conditions are strong.”
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Really, really consistent in ed reform, ignoring public schools.
Here’s the Broad Foundation. Try to find a public school among the constant promotion of specific, named charter schools:
https://twitter.com/BroadFoundation?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
Pick any ed reform leader or person or group.
Compare public school versus charter school coverage and approach. It is WILDLY skewed towards charter schools.
I think it’s such a closed circle they don’t even see the bias.
The biggest debate in ed reform circles isn’t about public schools versus charter schools. It is about whether public schools should continue to exist at all.
These people run for office. They present themselves as “supporters” of public schools. They’re not though. Many of them are wholly convinced the best thing to do with public schools is convert all of them to charter schools. This is important for voters to know! It’s not a policy detail. They have a duty to tell people the goal of this “movement” is to wind down public schools and eventually replace all of them. That’s essential information.
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“I think we see across the country, we see states that have not made the investment they should in their education system. We did a report earlier this year, the department, looking at the difference in state investment in prisons versus K-12 education. And what we found is that we see over the last 30 years rate of increase in investment spending on prisons that is three times as high as the rate of increase in spending on K-12 education.”
Why doesn’t he list the states that have stopped investing in public schools? He’s willing to call out public schools for deficiencies and does it constantly. Why isn’t he willing to go after lawmakers in these states?
Is it because many of the lawmakers who are cutting public school funding agree with the Obama Administration on expanding charters and vouchers and testing? Is it because they’re not willing to call out their allies in “the movement” because then charters and vouchers and testing schemes might be threatened?
This is a political alliance. Public schools can go under the ed reform bus as long as they get cooperation on the things they value, which are charters, vouchers and testing schemes. We get such weak, mushy “advocacy” for public schools from ed reformers because they don’t want to offend their allies on the Right – fellow “movement” members.
It’s horse trading and what they’re trading is existing public schools.
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Pre-k expansion worries me in the current hostile political climate for public schools. My fear is they’ll simply transfer funding from public schools to pre-k.
People on the local level will have to really dive into the pre-k funding details to determine if this is simply a funds transfer from one set of schools to a new set of schools. State lawmakers are really sophisticated at this bait and switch. They’re good at robbing Peter to pay Paul. It’ll be buried in layers of committees and transfers. Don’t let them get away with it.
Look at BOTH k-12 funding AND pre-k funding in your state and see if there’s a net increase. If there isn’t they’re lying to you.
Any time any of them mentions pre-k funding this cycle ask them to split that out for you- what happened to K-12 funding when pre-k funding went up? If K-12 went down you have your answer- they’re funding pre-K by pulling from existing public schools.
Schools are SYSTEMS. What happens in one part of the system affects another. Be wary of politicians who fragment and silo. That’s not the reality of budgeting in any given system.
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“some high performing charters”
What percent constitutes some? 10% 20% 25%….what percent. If I had to guess i would say that it is well below 50% that are high performing.
It is a lovely double standard, public schools are held to the standard of 100% high performing but yet charters schools are held to a much lower standard if any at all.
Pathetic.
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