John Thompson is a historian and retired teacher in Oklahoma. He keeps watch over the Red state politics of Oklahoma and follows the national education scene closely, He writes here about author Robert Pondiscio. I was at one time good friends with Pondiscio. We were on the same wave-length. But things changed. Curiously, as I moved from right to left in my views, he moved in the other direction.
John Thompson writes about him and his ideological journey here:
Since the American Enterprise Institute’s (AEI) Robert Pondiscio agreed to join the Oklahoma State Superintendent Ryan Walters’ Executive Review Committee, I’ve wondered how he could collaborate with Russell Vought and the founders of Project 2025 in order to turn Oklahoma’s teaching standards into rightwing propaganda. (I should note that because of a scheduling problem, he wasn’t able to remain on the committee.)
Years ago, when I first met Pondiscio, he was focused on high quality curricula; the person I knew would have been horrified by Walters’ silently imposed standards, that, for instance:
Would require that high school students “identify discrepancies in 2020 elections results’ including”‘ sudden halting of ballot-counting in select cities in key battleground states, sudden batch dumps, an unforeseen record number of voters and the unprecedented contradiction of ‘bellwether county’ trends.’”
After reading Pondiscio’s “The Last Days of Public School,” I’ve wondered what corporate school reformers would have thought if, in 2010, he had written the same things about the “Risks and Rewards” of school privatization. My reading of it is that Pondiscio now makes mostly the same statements about test-driven school privatization, as he did back then. But he’s switched sides, allying with both the Billionaires Boys Club and MAGAs in order to advance his personal agenda.
Pondiscio has long supported Core Knowledge, but he and E.D. Hirsch sought tests for diagnostic purposes, not reward-and-punish. Pondiscio agreed with Hirsch that high-stakes tests “are fundamentally unfair to disadvantaged children, particularly low-income children of color.”
When being interviewed by Larry Ferlazzo, Pondiscio denounced the corporate reformers, who were non-educators, who believed that improving teacher quality and lifting charter school caps was a simple solution. They believed their “reforms” could overcome the extreme poverty and multiple traumas that his and my students endured. Moreover, he was repelled by stories about “Rubber Rooms” in order to engage in “bashing teachers.”
And, rather than blame public schools for wasting money, he pointed out the huge amounts of money spent for implementing the hunches of corporate reformers seeking disruptive and transformative change.
By 2018, however, Pondiscio seemed fully committed to his new test-driven, competition-driven allies. For instance, he enthusiastically supported New Orleans’ Superintendent John White, who was a true-believer in school privatization, Teach for America, and high-stakes testing. When debating Diane Ravitch about school choice, he “retorted that school choice was not a ‘rightwing agenda,’ it was a ‘moral agenda.’”
Even today, when explaining how public schools (which he confusingly calls the “legacy system”) are doomed, Pondiscio seems to acknowledge that punitive, market-driven policies have failed in the ways we defenders of public schools predicted. He acknowledges that student outcomes were declining before Covid hit. But it contributed to “mounting challenges: historic declines in student achievement, chronic absenteeism, discipline crises, and plummeting teacher morale. Even as schools return to normal, confidence in public education has suffered hammer blows.”
To his credit, Pondiscio also cites the challenges of the “baby bust”—a decline in the birth rate that will reduce the number of school-age children by an estimated two to three million over the next decade.
It is to his discredit, I believe, that he doesn’t mention the damage done by the Trump administrations, and the extreme anti-public school propaganda funded by the “Billionaires Boys Club.”
Pondiscio now writes that “the zip code–driven default mode of educating our children is unlikely to disappear entirely. It will remain a common mode for a significant number of children if only because of habit and inertia. But we have hit and passed peak public education. Its influence and dominance can only wane.”
While remaining on the AEI team and being open to working with the Heritage Foundation effort to dismantle public education, Pondiscio writes, “In practice, this means almost any parent can opt out of public education and redirect funds to offset the cost of private school, pay for tutoring, and purchase textbooks, technology, and almost any conceivable service they deem necessary to meet the educational needs of their child.”
While supporting this outcome, Pondiscio writes:
While public schools have largely failed to be the “great equalizer of the conditions of men” Mann envisioned, they have at least aspired to provide a shared foundation of civic knowledge and literacy. In a world where education is fully customizable, we risk losing the common civic framework that binds a diverse nation together. Schools transmit not just knowledge but shared values, norms, and narratives.
Moreover:
School choice does not guarantee better schools—only different ones. The same market forces that produce elite private schools could also create a “long tail” of low-quality options. Moreover, as more middle-class and engaged families exit public schools, the legacy system risks becoming the school of last resort for the most disadvantaged students—further intensifying educational inequality.
Why would Pondiscio, who makes such acknowledgements, seem to go along with the destruction of public education in order to defeat educators who disagree with him on curriculum and other aspects of instruction?
Reading his AEI posts, I’m struck by the anger he spews about educators who “worship to excess at the altar of student engagement.” I’m struck by his repeatedly blaming “Wokism.” Why does he invest so much in attacking schools as “Ideological Boot Camps?” At a time when Elon Musk and President Trump are trying to destroy the Education Department, why is Pondiscio doubling down on its administrators who he says order schools to “Comply with our enlightened vision or risk a civil rights probe that could cost you your federal funding?”
In other words, why is Pondiscio focusing more on defeating advocates for hands-on learning and civil rights, than defending the poor children of color that he and I taught?

In this modern climate of school privatization, one is forced to consider that most, if not all the rhetoric spewed by the privatization crowd is a smoke screen for a scam.
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Roy: Yes–everything needs to be interpreted through an Orwellian screen. Also, I am becoming paranoid–so many of my notes go to moderation. CBK
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CBK,
Some of your comments go to moderation.
But ALL the comments by “And in Missouri” go to moderation. I don’t know why.
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Hi Diane: I said “so many” but I wonder why about Missouri. If it’s not some sort of political thing (I doubt it) it’s probably some sort of algorithm thing gone off the rails. It IS annoying but I do appreciate your monitoring so quickly–sometimes, notes lose their import because the context changes.
On your other question, one thing that occurs to me is that never before have changes in history occurred and been understood by so many SO QUICKLY.
In all the hairball causes of our present situation, I think the quick access to all sorts of news and information is just overwhelming to the normative movements of mind and psyche–fear, and then the seeking of security and certainty, even if it’s false. In that climate, it’s easy to find some sort of refuge in the (albeit false) security and certainty of a carnival barker. CBK
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Diane: If you ever find the answer to that question, please write about it here.
Having long-thought about it, I am still only dealing with guesswork, which is in some sense rightly rooted in the basic fact that people and their motivations differ, one from the other, so one must get into the “weeds” of a person’s development and experience to really understand it, for that person, and leave with the sense that, for the larger concerns, it is a very complex issue.
On the other hand, what might be some common threads that can be teased out of especially our current situation where so many seem to have undergone a kind of character and even spiritual lobotomy? You are left to ask: Who are you, and what have you done with my friend and colleague?
My guesswork and watching of several of these cases of change also leads me to understand that the change occurs not only as surface behaviors but at the deeply formative and across-the-board foundational level of a person’s way of life . . . not only psychological and social, but also ethical, political, and spiritual–and philosophical insofar as the problem always has the suppression of hard won truth and the disregard of evidence we used to call facts and reality circling around, and where lies and snarling attitudes have taken the place of reasonable discourse and a warranted trust in others’ intentions.
We pretty much know WHAT has occurred, but to answer the question of WHY, and WHY NOW, we would need a serious cultural analysis, to include the cultural drifts that have occurred even in public education. And even then, we are still up against the question WHAT DO WE DO NOW?
I think however, your ex-friend and so many others (like Pam Bondi–an excellent example of the zombi consciousness that has taken over so many) are in need of a huge transformation or insight or conversion of sorts that is like shutting down and resetting one’s computer so that the general and good order is restored. But foundational corruption is something that commonly has historical roots and where, when “infected” by it, one’s logic follows its patterns like a cat follows a mouse.
In the meantime, and hoping such movements of mind actually do occur, and that events happen that inspire them, we all need to step up and do what we can when we can do it. I am sorry about your friend–I have several similar situations of my own. It’s like talking with people in that movie about the pod people. CBK
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I imagine a large part of the motivation for this stuff involves how one can best make a living.
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It’s hard, if not impossible, to make a living as an advocate for public schools, except as a teacher or principal.
It’s easy to earn six figures advocating for charters and vouchers. Lots of organizations do that and are well-funded.
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I have never met a person with integrity or principle who uses words like “wokism” – as a shortcut to demonstrate their allegiance to the right wing billionaires who underwrite his overly generous compensation who think there’s nothing wrong with white supremacy.
But one thing is true – those folks like Pondiscio who have aligned themselves with authoritarians will always make excuses for Trump shooting people on Fifth Avenue or burning down public schools or rounding up people who disagree and make them disappear.
Public education doesn’t make all kids equal? That’s his criticism? He hates “wokism” that recognizes the barriers that many kids raised in poverty have?
Truly, it’s time to start recognizing these MAGA apologists for what they are.
He and Diane Ravitch went different ways because one of them acted with integrity and the other one acted with greed. And the more Pondiscio needed to bend the knee to keep his gravy train flowing, the quicker he did it.
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^^sorry thought this was a new comment, not a reply on this thread.
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Pondiscio has drunk the Kool Aid of deform and reaps its benefits, $$$. Nobody ever claimed public education would be the great equalizer. Poverty is the great beast that is difficult to slay. Having worked with disadvantaged ELLs for so many years, I know that well-funded and supported public schools can provide students with access and opportunities that would have been impossible for these young people to access within the scope of their family’s poverty. So many young people discover their talents and potential in math, science, the arts, sports, rhetoric, writing, mechanical talent, etc. With out a doubt a good public school can open doors, and many of my former students walked through those doors to a far better life than they would have had otherwise.
I am sick of the baseless “woke” accusations from politicians and greedy deformers. I worked in public education for more than three decades in two states, and I never experienced teachers trying to promote any political agenda. I have witnessed the fact based teaching of our motley history, which is our shared past, not some degree of “woke.” I have also witnessed the patriotism and respect that our public educators have for this country from the morning “Pledge of Alliance” to the celebration of those that serve us in the the police, fire departments and military. I doubt as many private schools make a similar amount of effort celebrating public servants as typical public schools do.
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cx: Allegiance
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I can’t comment on why Pondiscio has gone completely over the top. But I have always found his writing to be exasperating: he raises interesting issues and then tackles them in a problematic way, mixing an insight or two with a bucketful of wrong-headedness. His 6/12/24 article linked in penultimate paragraph is a good example.
The issue: teachers pull their lesson plans from all over the internet, using material no one is vetting. Hence, too many instances of… Pondiscio then predictably lists a few examples known to public because the school was sued, or media exploded over something already swiftly resolved at building-level, or was covered only by Fox/ National Review/ NYPost, etc. He tries to bolster these with some old and arguably irrelevant stats on how teachers were implementing CCSS. Concludes “Absent regulations specifically requiring teachers to post all lesson plans and materials online on a daily basis, including material they create or find on the internet, it’s nearly impossible to say with any certainty what occurs inside the black box of the public school classroom.”
I maintain it’s an interesting issue that could benefit from reasonable exploration, but you won’t get that from Pondiscio.
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That’s crazy. Were it to happen, who would read that mountain range of lesson plans?
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