The massacre in Highland Park, Illinois, was sickening. And to think that only days ago, our reactionary Supreme Court ruled against gun control. The legislation recently passed by Congress would not have prevented this bloodbath. It will not stop until the ownership and possession of assault weapons are banned, and all are recalled and criminalized.
The Daily Mail in the UK has the best coverage.
On a personal note: as this awful event happened, I was driving my 2004 red convertible decked in American flags in the Southold Town July 4 parade. It was the first time that the VFW had allowed a contingent from North Fork Women for Women to participate. The large crowd lining Main Street was warm and welcoming.
After Highland Park, it seems that no crowd is safe unless they pass through metal detectors. Since the killer fired from a rooftop, there was no safety.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
Diane That’s what we get when we don’t arm our children. CBK
“It will not stop until the ownership and possession of assault weapons are banned, and all are recalled and criminalized”
Amen.
A gun should be harder to get than a drivers license and regulated more. Just like we need to visit the DMV every 4 years – anyone who owns a gun (not an assault rifle – no one should own those) – should have to be relicensed every several years. I feel like a contingent of the right would gladly change the pledge of allegiance to “One Nation Under Guns.”
It’s time for a billion dollar class action lawsuit agains the marketing of weapons of war to citizens. It’s intentional proliferation of weaponizing citizenry for mass murder.
https://www.npr.org/2022/06/05/1103144998/daniel-defense-the-maker-of-the-gun-used-in-uvalde-is-accused-of-marketing-to-te
beachteach It won’t stop until all three branches of government go back to working for The People. I hate to say it, but if capitalism is to survive and not “kill its golden goose,” it will need to be reined in by those who are elected, but who actually work for the good of the country and its people.
IOW, get the gun lobby out of Congress and the Supreme Court. CBK
Sorry Catherine – I hadn’t meant to comment as a reply to your comment. Not sure how that happened.
And yes – what you said makes sense.
Or teachers, CBK. Because there were many teachers there, & we know they could have stopped this.
Same here, beachteach. The above (if it is, in fact, under my 4:12 am comment) should have been under CBK’s 7/5 11:02 AM comment.
retired That’s why I always wanted to be a teacher, so I could carry a gun in my classrooms. CBK
— My Facebook Post Yesterday
The justices of the “six-alarm fire” brigade should wear red robes in honor of their ideological blood fest.
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10222375420594238&set=a.3638177032932
Sirota’s interesting perspective in a time when we should not be honoring normalization of anti-democratic decisions. https://jacobin.com/2022/07/john-roberts-supreme-court-judicial-coup-epa-abortion
Thanks for the photo. It raises awareness. Raw Story’s recent article about Christian nationalism quotes the author of Power Worshippers. She describes the plot to get public money.
Sirota has chutzpah, I’ll give him that.
We have six far right Justices elected by Republicans. Those who don’t support those can join together to defeat a Republican party that has become the enemy of democracy.
Or we can join David Sirota and blame the Democrats! Because there’s no difference.
There was an open seat in 2016, and the Court was tied 4-4. Anyone who tried to undermine the message of how important it was to vote for the Democrat to fill that open seat in the general election in 2016 has a lot of chutzpah trying to blame the Dems for what the Republicans did after they won the election in 2016 — turn what would have been a 5-4 progressive majority led by RBG into this 6-3 far right six alarm fire.
This article normalizes what the Republicans did — after all, the Dems “helped them do it” — because Sirota wouldn’t want the Supreme Court’s awful decisions to motivate the base or hurt Republicans for the midterms. Wouldn’t want the Dems to have a Senate majority so large that Manchin and Sinema don’t matter.
Wouldn’t want people angry at the Republicans for the Justices that are a direct result of having Republicans win elections! Better to explain that the Dems are also to blame so voters don’t get too mad at Republicans without getting equally mad at Democrats!
FYI, yesterday in the Guardian, Sirota “mainsplained” that the Republicans are this right wing because they “fear their base”. We are supposed to believe that their base wants the rich to get richer and to privatize Social Security and Medicare. It’s “the base” that is telling Trump and the Republican party he adores to repress democracy and voting rights and say nasty racist things. Sirota absolves the Republicans of intentionally appealing to the most hateful feelings of folks struggling and give them useful scapegoats for their rage and violence. Nope, the Republicans aren’t so bad – they are just giving their people want they want, according to Sirota.
Just like the Nazis were just doing what “their base” wanted?
I am so sick of Sirota. He gives progressives a bad name. Fight for progressive ideas. Don’t scapegoat the Dems for the horrible things the Republicans are doing. I get that there were Germans who didn’t like Jews in 1920s Germany, but my stomach would turn at anyone who said that the Nazis were just giving their base what they wanted. They were teaching their base that it was acceptable to want those things — normalizing what wasn’t normal before. Sirota is so twisted with anger that he does exactly what he accuses the Democrats of doing to the progressives. He would rather destroy the Dems than the Republicans, even after seeing what the Supreme Court is capable of. He has become a parody of himself, a parody of a useful idiot.
NYC public Nicely written. Two thoughts: (1) Mitch McConnell should have been careful about what he (and the Federalist Society) wished for . . . they are painting themselves into an untenable corner; and
(2) putting 1940’s German anti-Semitism aside, or in our case now, that and many other biases, what’s missing so far here is the gut-fear that regular Germans must have felt as they “looked the other way,” just for their personal and family safety.
As others here say, we are taking steps towards a full-fledged fascism, but we’re not quite there yet; though with Charlottesville, “stand-by,” the threats to election workers, with the scaffolding outside of Congress, and the Proud Boys’ chants, etc., we are being conditioned to expect violence, blood, and killing. And the more violence, the more fear, the fewer people will be comfortable speaking up, even here on sites like this one. CBK
“ideological,” is that the correct description or, is a better description- a marriage of Koch’s predatory economics and antiquated religious beliefs based on men’s Biblical interpretations?
While there isn’t a lot of reliable info. about pregnancies in Jesus’ time, researchers have concluded a mortality rate of females in child bearing ages greatly exceeding males in the same age bracket. Pregnancy was risky then. Conservative religious men want to make it risky again.
Apparently abortion was quite common at the time of the writing of the Constitution.
https://www.commondreams.org/views/2022/07/04/right-wing-us-supreme-court-new-king-george-iii
So much for claims of adhering to Originalism, which is really whatever the Antiabortion Hitmen* want it to mean.
*Striking down Roe is tantamount to encouraging State “hitmen” (and probably real hitmen like abortion clinic bomber Eric Rudolph) to go after abortion providers like Planned Parenthood.
be three-
My thank you for the link is tempered by the author’s broad “evangelical” brush. The politically well-organized, major driving force for ant-abortion in the U.S was and is conservative Catholics. Their doctrine on the issue should have been included in the article.
I have an opinion that if Covid only killed women, the vaccines developed through fetus research would be opposed by the Catholic hierarchy.
NYC public school parent
Yes, their base thrives on the cruelty. Owning the Libs, Women , Minorities and Gays is more important to their self esteem than even their economic well being or their health. And I am betting I unfortunately have more contact with the Trumpanzee than you do . The base at this point drives the party. As long as you feed them red meat. Johnson called that in the early 60s no need to quote his remark to Bill Moyers again. The hate has been nurtured by Republicans for 60 years and it is now self perpetuating .
.
Keep in mind I heeded Chomsky’s warning . But try to imagine an election where Democrats actually did deliver to their base. Is it just Manchin and Sinema? How many others have done far more to sabotage the Biden Agenda. We had Manchin sign on to the PRO Act
when he realized like everything else, he would block it by not changing the filibuster. Warner in Tech Heavy Virginia never did, nor did Sinema or Kelly. Was Manchin alone in his assessment?
We have Tim Ryan a ” moderate ” (who I may yet donate to) avoiding the most pro labor President in 80 years , while running as a Pro labor working mans candidate . Who is doing harm to whom. How is that going to work in November when Democrats run from Biden rather than with him.
And who was it that sabotaged his Presidency over the Afghan withdrawal . Have those moderate Democrats wearing their service medals or the supposedly Liberal media stood up to say; thank you Joe no American boy has died in combat for almost a year . And we saved 300 million a day a 100 billion +- so far .
Here in New York we had Tom Suozzi run against an incumbent moderate Governor from Western NY as a sensible moderate Democrat. Running like a Republican on cutting Taxes and Crime. Because crime affects so many NYers that he would appeal to. He probably got 2% of the vote in communities affected by crime. Poetic license I don’t actually have that stat.
He only got 12% of the vote but he probably handed the unrepentant insurrectionist Lee Zeldin a few good campaign talking points.
You may know who Sirota is. I certainly know who he is . But I bet very few of the voting Public ever reads the Guardian on line and certainly not Jacobin .
exactly
We will always have nut cases. In this case, thankfully, it is a white guy. On the other hand, we do not need military (or hand) guns. They are not ‘tools’ needed for agriculture, nor to they ‘protect’ us.
That being said, I went out to ‘tend’ my garden this morning, and there was the same rabbit eating my bean plants. Also, squirrels are beginning to devour my Asian pears. I hate to do it, but perhaps I must (with my 410 single-shot shotgun, not a military assault rifle, which would (in fact) be far less effective).
https://www.liquidfence.com/
“We will always have nut cases. In this case, thankfully, it is a white guy.”
Not sure I understand what you mean here.
Meaning he could be taken alive?
It’s an asinine comment that should be ignored.
With an assault weapon, you could blow away the rabbits the squirrels, and your vegetables too!
It could be a whole new market for assault weapons manufacturers
“Get our new AR25 Meat and Vegetable Processor. Kill those pesky little garden marauders (squirrels, rabbits , chipmunks
gophers, deer, elephants) dead while simultaneously chopping your cabbage, squashing your squash, creaming your corn and mashing your potatoes. And if you act now, we will throw in a free AR Ginzu bayonet for those who enjoy hand to paw combat with the garden critters”
As well as any passers-by, neighbors, etc. So much range.
Excessive range…meant as a weapon of war & unspeakable bodily damage. (In case this is misplaced, a response to Diane’s 7/5 3:23 PM comment.)
I have used low chicken wire fences to keep rabbits out of my vegetable patch.
I could never grow a good vegetable patch. All animals predisposed to raid vegetable gardens are adorable to me. I never could stand Mr. McGregor in the Tale of Peter Rabbit.
So in today’s GQP funhouse of mirrors any young man can post/broadcast/rap graphic mass-murder fantasies and then legally purchase a semi-automatic tissue shredder to wreak havoc on innocent parade goers. Was this in Federalist 74? I missed that one.
LOL. Exactly.
Movie Magic Highland Park IL. Risky Business/Weird Science/Ferris Bueller’s Day Off/Sixteen Candles” All of these were filmed in Highland Park. Ravinia Music Festival is cultured Highland Park destination.
Street-Smart Rabbi Yosef Schanowitz kicked the KILLER out of Passover synagogue back in April ‘22. The Mad MAGA Man Was Doing Recon and the Rabbi’s astute, awake training taught him to eject the homegrown terrorist.
Anti-American and Anti-Semetic attack. We can now pray for RIP Jacki Sundheim.
A mother/wife/teacher at North Shore Congregation Israel synagogue school.
Highland Park IL.
The Times Of Israel
I looked up Rabbi Yosef Schanowitz after reading your post. During the shooting he helped some teenage boys shelter in place and immediately went to the hospital. This is from one of the 17 year old boys who were in the synagogue: Yarmove said it made him recall a lesson he learned when he was younger, about how to care for trees, and how they must grow straight when they’re small, because flaws will only be magnified when they get bigger. “It’s the same with people who turn to violence”, he said.
“If you teach kids that their real mission in life is to bring loving, kindness and happiness into the world,” he said, “you won’t come to this.”
I agree that this is a horrific atrocity, but how exactly will this happen– “the ownership and possession of assault weapons are banned, and all are recalled?” In 2013, Connecticut required all owners of “assault weapons” and “high capacity magazines” to register them with the state police. Ultimately, noncompliance rates were estimated to be 90-95%. A similar California law in 1990 resulted in over 95% noncompliance. Politicians recognized that trying to go door-to-door to confiscate we be a disaster. So I ask again, how would such confiscation be effected?
With buybacks, which is what the Australians did a few decades ago.
From voxdotcom: quote – Australia solved this problem by introducing a mandatory buyback: Australia’s states would take away all guns that had just been declared illegal. In exchange, they’d pay the guns’ owners a fair price, set by a national committee using market value as a benchmark, to compensate for the loss of their property. The NFA also offered legal amnesty for anyone who handed in illegally owned guns, though they weren’t compensated.
There were fears that the mandatory buyback would provoke resistance: During one address to a crowd of gun rights supporters, Howard wore a bulletproof vest. Thankfully, fears of violence turned out to be unfounded. About 650,000 legally owned guns were peacefully seized, then destroyed, as part of the buyback. According to one academic estimate, this amounted to about 20 percent of all privately owned guns in Australia. end quote
https://www.vox.com/2015/8/27/9212725/australia-buyback
Interesting in theory, but would not work in practice. First, one cannot buy back something one never owned. Second, what commission would know the difference between a $1000 Colt .357 and a $20,000 Colt Python? Where will the approximately $200 billion come from? I know of no one who will voluntarily sell his/her firearms without the ability to replace them. Noncompliance will be the norm. Then what? Door to door confiscation? Who’s going to do that? Local cops, state cops, Federal cops, troops? The bloodshed would be historic and probably lead to a true civil war. Even if this were possible, it would take many years and short of a constitutional amendment, for which there is no current appetite, courts would overrule the practice. We need to focus on things that are realistic.
Other nations have implemented buybacks with great success.
We are the only modern industrialized nation that accepts gun violence as inevitable.
I don’t know. What I do know is that if we don’t get guns controlled, we will live in fear of the next one. And the next one.
Key words above: “other nations.” Unfortunately, the Untied States are NOT “other nations.” We are not even “one nation, under G-d.”
We are one nation, under guns.
Thoughts and Prayers .
Again …………………………………………………………………………………………………
My hometown, just down the road, cancelled their fireworks out of respect for the tragedy in Highland Park. Each incident makes the Republicans and the reactionary Supreme Court justices look more and more craven and ridiculous. They can shove their thoughts and prayers where the sun don’t shine.
My sentiments exactly, Speduktr!
I live in the suburb just down the road, as well. I was in that suburb’s parade, which started at the same time as Highland Park’s. No one in our parade knew what was happening “just down the road.” Near the end of our parade, down a main street connecting all these suburbs, an ambulance–sirens blaring–was traveling north to Highland Park. No one even mentioned it as we walked back from the parade, & families/friends were gathered outside of their homes (which were on the parade route), celebrating & enjoying the day (no one knew what had happened). When a fellow marcher & I approached a friend’s house, my phone rang: it was my daughter, calling w/the news–from San Francisco. As the suspect was still at-large, North Shore residents were being told to stay indoors. Slowly, we noticed, people retreated into their homes. My car was parked 5 blocks away from my friend’s &, worried for my safety, she drove me back.
Illinois has an A- for gun violence prevention laws from the Giffords Law Center (at the time of the grade, IL had not yet banned ghost guns, & that ban was just signed into law.
Seven states–+ D.C.–have a law banning assault weapons. We will be working to make sure that IL becomes the eighth.
And let’s not let Hollywood and video game makers off the hook. They are active participants in marketing gun culture. It’s all part of the problem – with the number one solution being to ban assault rifles and gun control. But as long as guns are mass marketed as a sign of strength and power – there will be a demand for these types of weapons.
This is a start:
https://www.npr.org/2022/06/13/1104594849/hollywood-pledge-onscreen-guns
People all over the world play violent video games and watch violent movies. Only America among first-world nations has regular mass shootings. This isn’t about movies or games.
Agree, Japan, for example has much more violent, prurient and bloody video games and yet Japan has a very low crime rate and almost non-existent gun slaughters. The problem is that the US is saturated with guns and especially the semi-automatic guns with oversized magazines.
My point was the marketing of gun culture and gun sales. The “I’m strong and powerful” with a gun in my hand – creates more of a demand for guns.
Marketing and advertising works or companies wouldn’t spend so much on it.
There are movies etc that serve are powerful mediums for increasing gun sales.
More guns in hands….. more potential for gun violence.
Flerp, Joe Jersey, beachteach– you all make good points. My guess is that bloody gun-violence-video games/ movies do make a difference here, although perhaps none at all in other cultures. That’s because we have a “gun culture.” Guns/ ammo are available to ordinary citizens in quantity; armed self-defense is normed and approved in a large segment of our culture [and ‘stand your ground,’ increasingly]. Plus we have daily mass shooting incidents– this lends a real-life frisson to imaginary gun violence that activates those with mental states making them vulnerable to it.
I don’t know, bethree. One could make the argument that a country with this many guns would be even more violent if violent video games didn’t exist for catharsis. We’re awash in pornography like never before and apparently people are having less sex than ever.
“And let’s not let Hollywood and video game makers off the hook. They are active participants in marketing gun culture.”
And the various other comments assigning blame/reasons for the sick gun culture in which we live are nothing more than smoke screens for the fact that the US is the largest, greatest purveyor of death and destruction in the world.
Until we get the totally unaccountable and unaccounted for MIC under control in order to stop the death and destruction that we cause, I see no reason why anything done with supposed gun control will have any effect on much of anything.
America is Death!
Good morning Diane and everyone,
On Saturday when I was shopping for food to celebrate the 4th, I came across napkins that said, “Land of the free.” What is freedom? Who in this country is free? What does it all mean? That’s what ran through my mind. I couldn’t bring myself to buy anything of a patriotic nature. So, I bought plates and napkins with a beach theme instead. Some of my family members, too, didn’t really feel like hyping the holiday. I guess we were all more introspective and we were thinking about what is going on in this country. Patriotic feelings felt far away. My father in law, who is 97 and a WW2 vet, lamented that nobody on the street had an American flag hanging outside their houses. Later my sister in law remarked that Trump stole her flag. So, lots of reflection going on for this 4th of July.
Thanks, Mamie. Your introspective comments are always poignant.
Ironically, a hyper conservative friend of mine feels the same let down. He views the presidency of Biden as an illegal power grab and the recent Supreme Court decisions as too little to hold back the tide of the libertine masses.
This is what you get when political discourse is only to make you fear the other.
Yes – because that is what makes the money $$$ in the news industry – controversy, fear, anger – strong emotions.
A lot of this comes down to unbridled capitalism along with not making sure the “tree is going straight” in the beginning of life [see my post above – quote from 17 year old].
Mamie– I really relate. I had a set of stars&stripes ppr-plates/ napkins on hand for a planned Memorial Day bbq with sons/gfs, which got postponed more than once due to covid exposures. By the time we managed it [Father’s Day], I was still OK with them, but we used barely half (gfs were with their own fathers that day). I threw the rest out in disgust at the end of the week 6/20-6/24. July 4th? blecch.
Dear Diane,
Hi Jim,
I watched “Truman Capote” the other night. His best-selling 1965 novel “In Cold Blood” catapulted him to a remarkable level of national fame as an author. One is led to wonder if his story about the killing of four family members in Kansas would come close to best seller status with today’s seemingly regular mass murders in cold blood.
Frank
Sent from my iPhone
>
I think In Cold Blood still does the job. [As do accounts of Leopold & Loeb.] Mainly because the killers spent long enough with their victims to get a sense of who they were, and to murder them after victims had had plenty of time to think about what might be coming, & murderers to decide what they were going to do. The garden-variety mass shootings, so frequent in recent decades, are essentially drive-by killings of strangers. Neither hot-blooded nor cold-blooded.
Like drive-by killings, mass shootings are “coward blooded”
It takes a certain amount of courage (albeit, twisted) to kill someone up close and personal.
So lovely to hear you are still going to Southold— where my mother grew up & my father & I grew up in Greenport! Was there to see cousins last summer, but haven’t been back this year. I miss it. Maybe we can meet up there next year.
So as not to confuse you, Jim Slusher is the editor of the opinion page of the Daily Herald.
Sent from my iPhone
>
The July 4th BLOODBATH in Highland Park IL marked the 309th mass shooting in the United States 2022.
Established in Fall of 2013 GVA is an independent research and data collection organization. Gun Violence Archive.Org
https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/methodology
I’ll make my usual note — handguns were the weapon of choice in the vast majority of the mass shootings that make up the “more than 300” that Diane references.
Flerp– can I assume we’re talking semi-automatic handguns?
Safe to assume so.
Diane actually referred to banning ” assault weapons”, which covers semi-auto handguns.But apparently FLERP doesn’t know this.
Or maybe he does and is just pretending otherwise.
From wikipedia
“The term assault weapon is used in the United States to define various types of firearms.[1] The definition varies among regulating jurisdictions, but usually includes semi-automatic firearms with a detachable magazine, a pistol grip, and sometimes other features, such as a vertical forward grip, flash suppressor, or barrel shroud.[1][2] Certain firearms are specified by name in some laws that restrict assault weapons.[3] When the now-defunct Federal Assault Weapons Ban was passed in 1994, the U.S. Department of Justice said, “In general, assault weapons are semiautomatic firearms with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use.”[3] The commonly used definitions of assault weapons are under frequent debate, and have changed over time.[1]
The assault weapon (including semi auto handguns with a large magazine) is the weapon of choice specifically because it facilitates getting off a large number of rounds in a short period of time inflicting mass casualties.
Perhaps next time FLERP wants to make his standard statement about most mass shootings being done with handguns, he will give us a breakdown of how many of those were done with six-shooter revolvers.
Ha ha ha
And, no “assault weapons” would undoubtedly not include ALL semi auto handguns, but I think what I quoted ( “with a large magazine of ammunition that were designed and configured for rapid fire and combat use”) should make clear precisely which ones (to anyone, but a lawyer, that is)
So, do give us the detailed breakdown of the particular type of handguns used in “mass” shootings (killing four or more people)
Also give us a detailed breakdown of how many of the mass shootings like the one at the July 4th parade and the ones in schools involved the use of a weapon that would NOT be considered an “assault weapon”.
The handgun category is so large as to be nearly vacuous and simply repeating (robotically?) the statement (though technically true) that “most mass shootings are done with handguns” means very little on it’s face.
So give us the details.
The vast majority of handguns sold are semi-automatic.
I thought my comment made this super clear, but Diane’s post recess to “more than 300” shootings. The vast majority of those shootings were done with handguns. It may annoy you that I point that out, but it is true.
SDP, you’re correct that I was assuming the reference to “assault weapons” did not include handguns. That’s not a common meaning of the term in my experience. If you look at the “pistol-grip” weapons that were included in the assault weapons ban, you’ll see that they do not look like semiautomatic handguns.
Separately, I can’t stop you, but I don’t know why you need to include insults in so many of your comments to and about me. I don’t do that to you.
As I have pointed out several times now simply repeating the same fact that most mass shootings are done with handguns doesn’t necessarily say anything at all about the kinds of mass shootings Diane is quite clearly focussed on in her posts: school shootings and shootings like the 4th of July one and the Buffalo shopping center one a while ago.
That’s why I asked for the breakdown.
But to no avail. You would obviously rather just repeat what I already know and already acknowledged long ago.
That’s not an insult. It’s the truth.
SDP, I don’t really follow what you’re trying to say. If Diane is only concerned with “school shootings and shootings like the 4th of July one and the Buffalo shopping center one a while ago,” then she shouldn’t use statistics like “more than 300 mass shootings,” because, as you know, that statistic refers to any shooting in which at least four people are injured.
Also, handguns are “assault weapons” in any reasonable construction of the word. The reference in the assault weapons ban law to “pistol grips” is not a reference to “pistols.” It essentially means semi-automatic rifles with pistol-type grips. Google “rifle pistol grip” and you’ll see what kind of weapons this is referring to. It’s not handguns. I raise this as a purely academic point because I don’t see what relevance it has.
If we are only concerned about “school shootings and shootings like the 4th of July one and the Buffalo shopping center one a while ago,” then we shouldn’t go around claiming that “more than 300” of this type of shooting has happened this year, because that is simply not true. Here’s a research project if you’re interested: find out how many “school shootings and shootings like the 4th of July one and the Buffalo shopping center one a while ago” have happened this year.
I find it very odd how much a couple of commenters get riled up when I say this, but I will say it again, because it’s both important information and it should be totally uncontroversial. The vast majority of gun violence, including the more-than-300 mass shootings that Diane referred to in this post, are done by handgun.
We should ban assault rifles and high-capacity magazines. We should implement buyback programs for those weapons. If those weapons didn’t exist, or if far fewer of them existed, we would have far fewer atrocities like what happened in Uvalde and Buffalo and Highland Park and many other places.
But we should know that an assault weapons ban will address only a small sliver of the gun homicides that happen each year in the U.S.
Finally, by “insults,” I meant stuff like this.
I never include statements like that — statements insinuating that you’re unintelligent, or dishonest, or insulting your profession — when I address you. I don’t know why you always feel the need to do it when you address me. But don’t worry, I’ll be ok.
Correction, meant to type “handguns are NOT assault weapons in any reasonable construction . . . “
FLERP!
I’ll respond by saying I would ban almost all fire arms . With the exception of a limited few for hunting or for use in employment ie. a Brinks Guard a Diamond Dealer… With those being allowed only with strict regulation similar to Australia.
That said: The crime I think that most Americans worry about is random crime . Be that an attack by a stranger in or outside the home. Or being an innocent victim in a shooting involving others .
Now how does your statistic hold up. I didn’t care if a Mafia Don was found rubbed out. Nor if two drug dealers blow each others brains out as no long as no other person becomes collateral damage or is subject to becoming an innocent victim. Like in a wild shoot out . The family member that kills another the same. It may be terrible but one could argue the the Mother pushing a stroller in NYC last week would have been killed with a knife or strangled had her sick boyfriend not had a gun.
Now FLERP how many of those mass shootings with a handgun targeted innocent strangers or hit bystanders. In fact how many murders in NYC and there were 488 of them in 2021 fit the category of random stranger violence.
How does that compare with assaults with a military style assault weapon .
I agree that random violence is the most concerning type of violence to most people, including me.
That said, you’ve just described a huge portion of the gun violence in this country. I’m not comfortable saying I “don’t care” about that violence because it has a lot of collateral damage on communities. I don’t know if you’ve ever lived in a neighborhood where you can hear gunshots daily. It’s not good.
I don’t have the statistics to answer your questions.
FLERP!
I said unless it has collateral damage. I also said that I would make firearms hard to obtain. As for living in those neighborhoods, shootings are not a frequent occurrence heard by residents even when limited to high incident neighborhoods . The City is a very noisy place.And also rather large one , Even Precincts are rather large. So again having worked through the terrible 80s, 90s and 2000s in all these neighborhood. I can certainly count the number of shootings I heard or crime scene investigations I saw on my fingers. Perhaps I needed a hearing aid and glasses.
But it would be nice to actually have the statistics on who was being shot and motives with which weapons . If anyone even tracks them .
I used to teach inner city kids, here in Brooklyn. Special Ed in an inner city school.
Was on my way to the deli for lunch. Across the street was a very angry man with a blood stained white t-shirt, carrying a 357 magnum. Screaming at the world. I did not establish eye contact or run. I kept walking.
Was doing an afternoon parent teacher conference. Nobody signed up for the night shifts for fear of coming home after dark. Lovely family. I told them their son was very athletic and asked about him getting outside for exercise. No such luck. Gang territory for blocks. He had a nerf basketball setup in the hall. And at night; they’d sit on the floor for dinner, tv, or whatever, for fear of stray bullets..which was commonplace.
Poverty breeds violence. There’s a lot of both where I used to work.
I hear gunshots once every few weeks, I’d guess. I awoke in the middle of the night about a month ago to gunshots from a homicide on my block. When I was in college many years ago, I lived in a neighborhood where I would hear gunshots probably every other day (or night). It was terrible.
While I definitely take your point that there is a big difference between random mass shootings and the “normal, everyday” gun violence that is endemic to certain neighborhoods, I really do not like minimizing how awful the latter is. “Collateral damage” is not limited to “innocents” getting shot by stray bullets. Gun violence has a terrible impact on entire communities.
But if we’re of the view that random mass shootings are so different from other types of gun violence that we should not discuss them in the same breath, then we should stop using statistics about “mass shootings” that have nothing to do with random mass shootings. To wit, if we want to talk only about random mass shootings, we should stop repeating the point that there have been “more than 300 mass shootings” — a number from the Gun Violence Archive that is based on a methodology that counts any incident where “four or more people are shot or killed in a single incident, not including the shooter” as a “mass shooting.”
I don’t understand your point, FLERP.
It seems that you are saying “relax about death by assault weapons because more people are killed by handguns.”
So what?
I hate guns of all kinds.
A niece committed suicide with a handgun.
My dearest brother died by suicide, committed with a handgun.
If I were in charge, I would ban them all. Handguns, assault weapons, all of them.
But I’m not in charge.
Need to crack down on all firearms. The damage from a single bullet can be extreme.
Extensive background checks. Hard earned license. Limited ammunition sales.
I’m not saying relax about assault weapons. I’m saying handguns are the bigger problem by a large margin and too many people aren’t aware of that. I didn’t intend to spend this many words on that point—the length is due to my responding to the many other responses by two commenters.
gitapik
So I don’t know how long you taught there . But you kind of made my point. Again I would ban firearms with limited exception . As Diane pointed out even suicide is a problem . “Dying of Whiteness” details the dramatic increase in suicide that accompanied the relaxation of hand gun laws in States like Missouri.
But back to your point. You had one personal experience to document. And one families experience related back to you . I am sure that if you tried really hard you could come up with a few more .
Hell I can do better than that . While working on the Metro North Viaduct at 135 street in Spanish Harlem in 86 someone took a pot shot at one of our unoccupied Trucks on the tracks. Then in 94 working on the J line in Bushwick some kids (I assume ,too far away to see ) were shooting a pistol into the air off one of the roofs of the Bushwick Houses .
And the third was my direct supervisor who when he reached in his car for the Payroll checks for me to hand to my employees discovered they were stolen from his vehicle. Half loaded he pulled out his 22 and fired a shot in the Air Outside Columbia Presbyterian Hospital on 168st . I am certain he would pass a background check . Nothing like a drunk good guy with a gun to prove there are not many good guys with guns.
But the point is; for the better part of 30 years and through what were the bad old days of the 80s,90s and 2000s in NYC I can only recall 3 to your 1 . A far cry from nightly.
Joel: I taught at that site for 5 years. Then on to another site in a similar neighborhood for another few. Then on to “safer” areas.
There were other stories from personal off the schoolyard encounters to in-school findings in kid’s pockets/lockers, to parent teacher conferences. My two examples were not isolated instances by any means.
I worked for Metro-North for 11 years, btw. Conrail/Amtrak before that. I know that Viaduct and am more than familiar of the neighborhood. Especially in the ’80s.
False fire alarms in Washington Heights followed by pot shots at the firemen who showed up was no joke, either.
I get your point. The assault rifles are a good starting point. It’s so obvious. But it can’t stop there. This is a sickness that needs to be dealt with.
FLERP!
Between 14th street and 54thst from River to River are 5 police precincts who reported a total of 11 shootings incidents in the first 6 months of the year and you hear gunshots at night every few weeks . If I were you I would complain to the landlord. With walls that thin in the noisy City that never sleeps “Your rent is too damn high”.
Yes hand guns kill more but you are the one who made the distinction.
And you certainly did not add ban them all.
Joel, sure, ban all handguns. It won’t bother me, I don’t own any. And I take all gun violence very seriously.
Surely you must concede that there is a certain irony in arguing that, on the one hand, the type of gun violence that makes up more than 99% of all gun homicides is very rare and not much of a concern to regular law-abiding people, but, on the other hand, regular law-abiding people should be terrified about the type of gun violence that makes up less than 1% of all gun homicides.
Two bullets extracted from different corpses meet in an aluminum dish in a coroner’s office.
“What are you in for?”
“Right in the head, took out bone and soft tissue! He hit the ground before I stoped moving.”
“That’s pretty good. It took longer with mine. I just hit a vein. It took my buddies to do the rest. Good thing 60 of ’em got an award. The other 30 are hanging their heads. I’m sure my buddies will be joining us soon, as soon as the slow coroner gets up to speed.”
“And to think, I was one shot from one handgun and got the job done. You guys in the police force are such lightweights. You get the best guns, the best clip, shooters with training, and you still can’t hit the target without your friends!”
“Yeah, but we came from automatic weapons, so that makes us better. You’re just jealous. I’d be too if I came from some illegal handgun!”
And…Scene.
A thoughtful thread here on Twitter from a law professor at Georgetown; here’s a connection to why our public schools are painted as dangerous and out of control.
(cont.) Our public spaces and accommodations- streets, shopping areas, sports venues, schools, parks, buses, etc. – are where we ordinarily come together, interacting in small ways with people unlike ourselves, learning how to share civic life.
“I was driving my 2004 red convertible decked in American flags in the Southold Town July 4 parade.”
Why would anyone who reads this blog regularly ever celebrate anything about the United States? Dozens of times every week there are postings and comments here about what an awful, racist, sexist, transphobic, greedy, unequal, etc. place this country is, how its wealth is all a consequence of genocide and slavery. Wouldn’t it be better if the hundreds of millions of non-Americans who desire to come here were instead moved to utopias like those that the left-wing intelligentsia has swooned over for many decades: Cuba, Venezuela, China, Stalinist Russia, etc.?
Brenda Waters “Why would anyone who reads this blog regularly ever celebrate anything about the United States?. . . “
. . . because self-reflection and critique, both personal and political, is how we improve and grow, as in “up.” It’s a proper celebration of a U.S. Constitution that breathes, instead of a dictator or corporate entity that rules by fists and fear.
But my guess is that you probably know that already. If so, then my question to you is, why do you raise such questions? Please enlighten us all with your wisdom? CBK
I agree about the need for honest self-criticism and not whitewashing our flaws. But we read here every week that the U.S. is rapidly becoming indistinguishable from Nazi Germany or something similar. Recently from Bob Shepherd:
“What we are seeing is the beginning of a Judeo-Christian fascist state. It’s ironic that it was the U.S. that played the decisive role in stopping fascism in the middle of the last century but will be the place where the Fourth Reich arises.” And later: “This is quite the drama we are seeing unfold. At the very time when we are finding out whether this is a country of law that can be used to prevent a fascist coup, the Extreme Court is revisiting whole bodies of law to prepare the ground for the fascist state to come.” This way over the top, ahistorical nonsense from one of the few commenters who even occasionally writes sensible things on this blog.
Brenda Waters This is arguable, of course, but what used to be “over the top,” in my view and many others who are not known for overdoing it, is no longer so. What used to be hyperbole, even accepted hyperbole, now references some real concerns. HOW normative, we’ll have to see. But I think, still, way too many (perhaps you? but me no longer?) are ignoring the real danger we are in as a democracy. Thank you for responding. CBK
Brenda– you ask good questions. Periodically I too have to distance myself from the regularly-doomful predictions of Bob, Lloyd, Greg, SDP, and others. But these are people who study history, and current politics. They are dismayed (if not terrified) at the familiarity of what we’re seeing in US political patterns over the last 4 decades. This is not just about Germany/ Italy/ WWII. The machinations taking place in today’s state legislation and federal SCOTUS decisions are all too familiar for those who have studied post-WWII [& post-1989 fall of Iron Curtain] developments in Latin America, Russia, Poland, Hungary, Turkey. None of them is exactly like us– we can take hope from that.
The thing I find frightening is the similarity to other nations which have morphed from democracy into autocracy in recent decades– often still presenting with democratic trappings such as courts, elected representatives, elections. But all hollowed out from within: everything is fixed and corrupted by big money [&/or military] enforcement of outcomes desired by source of power. What’s got every one of us crazy is the last 10 days of SCOTUS decisions. Because countries like the ones I mentioned? #2 goal [after getting the population polarized by populism us-vs-them politics] is– control of the courts.
Ms Waters: after Jan 6, Robert O Paxton wrote an oped in which he decided that Trump fit the fascist label. Bob Shepherd might be an extremist, but to argue that Robert O Paxton is an extremist given his long history of solid writing since the 70s would be ludicrous.
With whom will you agree? Scholars or sycophants? If Stephen Miller and his buddy OBannon do not qualify as right wing, who does? How close do you have to get to Mussolini to be Stalin or Hitler. Almost all writers on this blog put these two, along with Mobutu, la Penn, Bolsonaro, and Putin in the same dictatorial pot.
Brenda Waters’s comment: an example of selective outrage based on her distortions, misinformation and a slanted reading of this blog and its regular commenters. So we are not allowed to criticize the US or point out its failings such as regular mass shootings or privatization of our public school system. According to Brenda, we are not allowed to talk about slavery, lynchings, segregation, etc., unless we give equal time to how terrific this country is. Baloney. Yes, it’s a great country but with that greatness comes a big responsibility.
If alive then, on June 4, 1919, Brenda would have been in opposition to the 19th amendment, “owning the libs”.
Brenda Waters,
Why would any Republican not hate the USA when the Republicans keep telling them how awful this country is?
No wonder a Trump supporter mowed down children and families after listening to the nasty rhetoric by people like Brenda Waters who believe that speaking hatred about “libs” and hearing that violence at the Capitol is patriotic.
What is wrong with Republicans these days?
The folks on this blog believe in democracy, while Brenda Waters worships the folks who keep talking about how only having a liar like Trump who foments violence will make our country great.
Why are you surprised that I rode in the July 4 parade in a car decked in American flags? I love this country. I wish it lived up to its ideals. I’m sorry we has a president who was hateful, racist, sexist, homophobic, greedy, and obsessed with money. I don’t understand how anyone could vote for such a bitter, stupid man. My America believes in kindness, justice, decency, equality, and freedom. Freedom to teach, freedom to learn, freedom to read. Which America do you support, Brenda?
“My America believes in kindness, justice, decency, equality, and freedom. Freedom to teach, freedom to learn, freedom to read.”
❤️
Diane, was the parade filled with first responder vehicles blaring their sirens and horns? That’s what the parade is like in the town I usually spend the Fourth. People seem to love it. Took me a few years before I wised up and made sure I had enough earplugs for the whole family.
Magnificently said, Diane! Bless you!
I view most of the posters here as being passionately concerned with preserving our democracy. I guess we are looking at it through different lenses.
Have you been paying close attention to the Jan. 6th hearings. If you have you would see that fascism is not an extreme word for what happened that day.
Thank you for reading my comments, Brenda. I stand by what I wrote. We are Germany in 1932.
Bingo !
Only they had better writers, art and strudel.
I make a fine strudel, Greg. This is art. Not easy.
John Pavlovitz:
“Whatever you wish more good people in Germany would have done in 1931, do it now.”
NYCpsp,
I’ve seen that quote by Pavlovitz in a number of places in the last few weeks. It doesn’t make sense to me.
We don’t want people now to do what the “good people in Germany would have done in 1931” because those “good people” were the ones who didn’t do anything about what was going on around them at the time.
Are you saying that we should be ignoring the basic fascism that is growing now?
I doubt it but that quote sure makes it seem like that is what you are saying.
Re: quote. The only thing that might have prevented the ascension of fascism in 1931 was a clear recognition by the various players on the Left and Center that the greatest threat was from the Nazis and not each other. Germany had no well-developed secular center. It was largely religion-based with the Catholic Center Party (which was dissolved during Gleichschaltung when Hitler assured privileges for the Church) and various Lutherans. Remember, the oft-(and mis-)quoted Martin Niemöller was a Lutheran paster who, in the early day, was untroubled by the persecution of Leftists and Jews.
And strudel is an art. I feel so sorry for Americans who think it’s a soggy dish.
I make it from scratch. None of that store-bought stuff! I don’t make it often because it’s an enormous undertaking. Same with croissants. Takes a couple full days to make.
Duane E. Swacker,
I think GregB’s explanation probably covered what I meant, but to be clear:
There were “good” Germans in 1931 – those were the ones whose voices were ignored. You seem to be referring to the ones who didn’t support Hitler and the Nazis but insisted Hitler and the Nazis were no different than any typical politician and normalized them.
It is still astonishing to me that folks in this country basically did that to the neo-fasciast Republican party in 2016. How could they not see what was happening from 2012-2016? They insisted the Republicans were no more dangerous than the Dems. They normalized the truly anti-Democratic actions of the Republicans.
I only wish those “good” people now do what I wish they had done in 2016. Recognize that the Republicans have to be defeated to protect democracy. Not sure it isn’t already too late.
Duane –
Can the “good people” be categorized into demographic groups so as to better understand them?
The conservative religious still defend Trump as having done more for their religion than any other President e.g. Rusty Bower and I assume the category includes people like Pat Cipilone.
The Evangelicals can gloat now that their faith in Trump (that imperfect vessel, by their characterization) was justified because he delivered the “justices” who overturned Roe (and will overturn Engel v. Vitale, Obergefell, and other cases that the fundies really care about.
A common belief among evangelicals is the Rapture. Do the conservative religious on SCOTUS believe in the Rapture?
Interesting story in the news this week about Bill Bennett recommending exorcisms as a cure for mass murders. He said it on Fox.
I wish Jesus or somebody else would Rapture up the six justices on our Supreme Court who are destroying our freedoms. Time for them to go and I can’t think of any other way.
Well…if that were to actually happen; we’d have a lot more to worry about than the SCOTUS, POTUS, Congress, Trump/Putin combined.
But I’m skeptical (sorry Bill…but exorcism?). Maybe there’s a “Reverse Rapture” that might be available.
🛸 To The Rapture Rap Artists 🛸
Beam Your Own Selves Up, SCOTUS !
We’re sick and tired of your Fantasy !
Leave us on Earth to live in Reality !
Bill Bennett spent too many years getting high on his own supply. Clearly.
“Rapture up…”
You can take the girl out of Texas, but can’t take the Texas out of the girl.
Damn straight.
I can think of a few people who should get raptured up.
Starting with The Former Guy.
It would be nice if this Rolling Stone article made enough waves to put a halt to this (and other SCOTUS rulings. But how many investigations can we endure.
Somewhat like the “if you tell a lie enough times” tactic:
If you break many laws and ignore ethics, the resulting chaos will numb the public and take away the will to investigate and prosecute.
LOL, Jon. Hilarious!
Huh. — Funny, I don’t remember swooning over Joseph Stalin. I do remember being opposed to fascism as was Stalin, but that doesn’t make me want to grow a big Stalin mustache and start murdering people.
Brenda, do you oppose fascism like I do? We fought a war to preserve democracy, you know. I am for the preservation of democracy. We the People, you know. Public officials, public schools, public land, apple pie, that sort of thing. That’s a big reason why I’m a regular here at this all American blog site, you know.
Patriotic Americans look out for their fellow Americans, so let’s get people able to vote and get people something for which to vote.
If you had seen his abs when he was young, you would have swooned!
I don’t want to see Lindsey Graham’s abs.
Stalin had a great head of hair.
There are various stances and motivations that all lead to the same end: enabling the emergence of fascism right under our noses. There’s the boiled frog phenomenon, aka the slow creep, the slippery slope. There’s willful blindness. There’s Pollyanna “it can’t happen here” stuff. There’s reinterpretation and perversion of previously held values and beliefs of the “but some are more equal than others” variety. There’s just plain ignorance of what’s happening and it’s similarities to what happened in the past. And then there’s all the stuff that has always motivated a rabble to get behind nascent fascist leaders: fear of social change, nostalgia for a nonexistent past, racism, authoritarianism, tribalism, toxic notions about what constitutes masculinity/virility and fear of their own failure to achieve that. Especially frightening are the appeasers–the ones who think that the fascists really aren’t fascists at all, really aren’t all that bad, can be controlled. Then there are the opportunists, often but not always of the useful idiot variety, who will hop about whatever train that will deliver them, personally, where they want to go. And finally, there are the motivations of the wannabe fascist leaders themselves: profound insecurity, pathological malignant narcissism, desire for power, command, control, sadism.
cx: its similarities, not it’s similarities. Obviously.
cx: And then there’s all the stuff that has always motivated a rabble to get behind nascent fascist leaders: fear of social change, nostalgia for a nonexistent past, racism, authoritarianism, tribalism, economic challenges, toxic notions about what constitutes masculinity/virility and fear of their own failure to achieve that.
This rough taxonomy could be refined, ofc.
But it’s no longer a question of whether it could happen here. It is happening here.
I left a really important group out of the taxonomy above. Sorry. This was done in haste.
The Tillers–those who lay subvert existing law to prepare the ground from which fascism can rise
The tillers = the legal enablers
Recommended reading:
Albright, Madeleine. Fascism: A Warning. Harper, 2018.
Ben-Ghiat, Ruth. Strongment: Mussoline to the Present. Norton, 2020.
Greenblatt, Stephen. Tyrant: Shakespeare on Politics. Norton, 2018.
The Republican Party Platform, 2020 (OK, this is a trick; there wasn’t one because the platform was WHATEVER GLORIOUS LEADER SAYS.)
cx: Strongmen: Mussolini to the Present
Let’s see. Donald Trump
Has long been the object of a cult of personality
Has long called for an exceptionalist, nationalist curriculum
Supported armed citizens’ militias in the streets (for example, the folks who raided the Michigan capitol) and called on citizens’ militia groups to stand back and stand by
Continually scapegoats immigrants
Continually scapegoats enemies within (Socialists)
Continually uses racist dogwhistles
Continually promises a return to a mythical Golden Age (Make America Great Again)
Espouses a doctrine of national exceptionalism
Uses the massive rally as his primary means of communication with his base–rallies where there is lots of iconography and chanting
Attempted to use the military to quell protest and dissent (and was only stopped from doing this because Milley and Esper refused to go along)
Ordered his head of Homeland Security to have Border Patrol Officers SHOOT unarmed asylum seekers (and was only stopped from doing this because that head, Kirstjen Nielsen, refused to do so
Claimed in speeches that the Constitution gave him the power, as president, to do whatever he wanted
Refused to accept election outcomes that did not favor him and attempted to effect a coup
Has a thing for monumental fascist architecture and military parades
Supports autocratic, fascist dictators around the globe
Wields such power in his party that few will stand up to him on anything
In other words, Trump is a CLASSIC fascist, and the Trump cult is a fascist cult.
One has to be incredibly blind not to see this. And that blindness, as I detailed above, can take lots of different forms.
The only differences between Trump and, say, Mussolini and Hitler, are that a. Trump was too stupid and ignorant to realize his goals (The next guy, having assumed Trump’s mantle, won’t be; he will have the right yes men in place.) and that Trump didn’t have the legal framework in place to implement fascism here (Our current Extreme Court is working on that).
Well stated, Robert!
Recently, Lindsay Graham said he liked Trump because everybody was scared of him, including Graham himself.
Graham is scared of whatever it is that Russian intelligence has on him that cause him to do a 180 on Trump.
Read the brilliant article by Mark Leibovich in The Atlantic called “The Most Pathetic Men in America,” about Kevin McCarthy and Lindsey Graham. Kevin is a mediocrity who longs for power. Lindsey is a sycophant who attaches himself to powerful men. He was John McCain’s puppy until Trump was elected. Then he became Trump’s lapdog.
Thanks for the suggestion, Diane.
A great piece, Diane. Thanks for the suggestion!
There is research about people who like to attach themselves to bullies.
I just read it after seeing it on your twitter account. Thank you.
“Democrats and Republicans kept coming to Washington, vowing change, only to get co-opted, get richer, and never leave.”
Worth reading. Here is the link:
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/07/kevin-mccarthy-lindsey-graham-trump-devotion-2024-election/661508/
Diane, Ginny, this was a great article. However, I stand by my original comment. I have a strong suspicion that Graham is a victim of kompromat.
We used to worry about “anniversary” and specific dates for school shootings and threats and everyone was on higher alert to student comments, absences, and encouraging it’s ok to tell if something bad is going to go down. April 19 & 20 – Hitler’s birthday, Columbine, WACO, Oklahoma City… Valentines Day. The mass shootings on those dates and others were tragic, deadly isolated events
Heinous – but singleton events – not weekly.
What’s different?
The internet now provides an addictive online presence with 24/7 encouragement for violence and hate, obsessing, and spewing of evil and rationalizing shootings.
A major national tv network spews hate, blindly rationalizes anything hateful leaders say, and advocates the targets as … targets.
Access to weapons. Period.
The result?
The American culture is now a gun culture.
Breaking laws is no big deal (thank you exPres and your silent defenders)
No registration or waiting periods imposed
No humanly rationale reason why any citizen needs an AK-47to protect their home or shoot Bambi – but an 18 year old can buy one in minutes.
Gun distributors – legal and not – who advertise and validate the culture everywhere
Online purchases and make your own weapon for anonymity not addressed by lawmakers
Complicit senate, house, and governor candidates whose Christmas cards of the family all holding automatic weapons and campaigning, armed, threatening “rinos.”
There is no “magic pill” or silver solution to this. Every politician and pundit should acknowledge the answer is not a or b or c – it’s “all of the above”
You don’t change a culture with an isolated law here or a speech there.
“There is no “magic pill” or silver solution to this. Every politician and pundit should acknowledge the answer is not a or b or c – it’s “all of the above”
You don’t change a culture with an isolated law here or a speech there.”
We have a lot of work to do.
“You don’t change a culture with an isolated law here or a speech there.”
Again, if I may repeat myself, until America overcomes it’s lust for death and destruction as carried out by the greatest and unaccountable death and destruction machine in the world today, the US Military, and the politicians and policy wonks who sell that death and destruction as something good this country will continue to have the blowback that manifests itself in these deadly shootings.
Sadly, reining in that death and destruction machine, the US Military and the defense industry along with the politicos who monetarily benefit from that death and destruction machine, will not occur in my lifetime and probably will not happen until the US is destroyed in a nuclear confrontation.
Axios reports that the man arrested in the parade murders had a posted YouTube video of himself cheering on a Donald Trump motorcade,
More important, is he Catholic?
More important, how many women will die as a result of state responses to Roe v Wade’s overturn? How many 10-year-old abuse victims will be mothers at 11?
Speaking of the Pope, he invokes the analogy of a paid assassin to describe abortion. Is the juxtaposition funny – women portrayed as hiring killers when the Bible doesn’t even acknowledge rape as a crime? The men who translated God’s word (women weren’t afforded educations so they couldn’t translate) knew pregnancies could lead to the death of a woman (or, a 10-year-old girl). The Torah recognized the risk of unviable fetuses and took a reasonable approach unlike the Pope’s church.
All Linda is a great arbiter of Biblical scholarship. CBK
According to polls, most Catholics did not want Roe VS Wade overturned. Many polls show similar results to the general public – about 70%.
Beachteach
Do you agree with many at this blog that the enemy is too abstract to be named?
The author of Power Worshippers wrote in a recent Raw Story article about conservative religious leadership (the article’s title includes “Christian nationalism”), “They are exploiting their base as a means of exploiting the rest of us.” The state Catholic Conferences, the political arm of the bishops, certainly propagandized for the overturn of Roe. It was conservative Catholic SCOTUS judges who overturned Roe. Those jurists gained their positions through the work of Leonard Leo who has close ties to Koch. Koch funded Paul Weyrich’s theocratic efforts.
At the site, Catholics For Choice, Jamie Manson reports about Catholic hospitals and reproductive care in a 2019 article which can be found on the internet with the key words, Nun Excommunication Bishops Attack on Biden.
You are absolutely correct that individual, liberal congregants in the pews like Biden, Pelosi and Ted Lieu oppose abortion bans. We’re waiting… waiting,… waiting …. for them to have the same success that the right wing Catholic Conferences have had.
Linda My thought is that, though many are working towards change (see the recent articles and comments in Commonweal, and apparently the polls as with both gun control and the formally religious among us, the progressives far outweigh the not) the hard right in the Catholic Church are also digging their own graves. And though they have kidnapped the flag, the loud, violent, and crazy are not the only ones who harbor a very old but lively “American spirit.”
The larger and longer movements of change are not straight-line but are more like history breathing, or like spandex. I take the below as an analogy for our present situation where the changing voting blocks are concerned:
“Causes, and accordingly all Experience hath shewn, that Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long Train of Abuses and Usurpations, pursing invariably the same Object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism . . . ”
(From the beginning paragraphs of the American Colonies’ Declaration of Independence.)
This post is not about abortion, it’s about gun control.
Pope Francis has a clear stance on gun control. In fact he is very clear and upset: “I am praying for the children and adults who were killed, and for their families. It is time to say enough to the indiscriminate trafficking of arms,” Francis said
And from one of the bishops (and I am sure all would agree)
“The Second Amendment did not come down from Sinai,” Cupich said via Twitter. “The right to bear arms will never be more important than human life. Our children have rights too. And our elected officials have a moral duty to protect them.”
I can not speak to every sect of every religion – or the motives of the Supreme Court Justices as related to their religious affiliations, but I found this piece on NPR to be rational discourse: https://www.npr.org/2018/07/07/626711777/religion-the-supreme-court-and-why-it-matters
That much rubbish in one article- sets a high bar. Evangelicals haven’t valued the life of the mind, where as Thomas, Alito, Barrett, Kavanaugh and Gorsuch have. So, that’s what People of Praise was all about, not handmaidens. The article pre-dated Ilya Shapiro’s hiring at Georgetown but, I’m sure the article’s author could spin that to look like something other than a defender of economic predation who tweets about the inadequacy of Black women, favoring a man for Ketanji Brown’s spot.
“Pope Francis has a clear stance on gun control. In fact he is very clear and upset: ‘I am praying for the children and adults who were killed, and for their families. It is time to say enough to the indiscriminate trafficking of arms,’ Francis said.”
Why do we ridicule gun nuts for thoughts and prayers and then have someone cite “prayers” from Francis the talking pope. What’s so “clear” about that? What’s he doing? What are Catholics doing? Where is the legislative proposal submitted by the US Conference of Bishops to stop “the indiscriminate trafficking of arms”? Following the edicts of their leader and praying? For Catholic administrations, proselytizing and converting (see Mother Theresa for further proof) always Trumps human rights. Always.
Greg….. the prayers part isn’t the strong stance…. the
“It is time to say enough to the indiscriminate trafficking of arms,”
is. He acknowledges and condemns the “trafficking of arms” – not just gun ownership.
Catholics in America are “Americans” are doing what similarly minded Americans are doing related to this situation.
My reply was in response to Linda who brought up abortion related to the Catholic Church. I was responding to that point and bringing the conversation back to guns – and for Linda’s benefit made the point about the Catholic Church stance on guns – which is is strong gun control laws.
We need to do something about x is not my idea of leadership and courage. The aura of Francis has also worn off. Just what has changed since he’s been pope? Anything? Bueller? It seems to me that the Church has doctrinely-speaking is as conservative as it ever was and we will soon see a reactionary pope. If and when that happens, what will the exceptionalists do?
For those who haven’t recognized the phenomenon, I’ll identify it. If the right wing American church likes what the Pope says, we will hear his words accompanying political action. If the right wing church doesn’t like what he says, the Pope’s words will be absent political action.
Linda You obviously do not understand how a centuries-old religious institution, e.g., the Catholic Church, operates and how diverse it is, then take up a study of it. CBK
Check the names of the article’s authors at the NPR site that Beachteach linked and place a bet on their religion. If you’d like a bit more info before speculating, the NPR story provides gold-plated protection for political Catholics.
It’s annoying that Beachteach missed the irony in the article – spin about anti-Catholic bias in an article that disparages evangelicals.
About the absurdity of claims of “anti-Catholic bias”- the President, formerly V.P., is Catholic. The Speaker of the House is Catholic. Seven of the 9 SCOTUS justices are Catholic. How many governors are Catholic? How many House members? How many Senators including DINO Manchin?
Toto, you’ve left the time machine and are in 2022.
Linda You are channeling McCarthy again with his communists and blacklisting.
Please tell me why I shouldn’t be embarrassed for you . . . and your willful ignorance of what you are implying? You never did answer my earlier question, which I asked twice in different threads:
Why is it so important to you that so many people in our culture (not to mention the world) have Catholic backgrounds? Is there something to be ashamed of in having such a background that I’m not aware of? That I know of, there is no such thing as a political disease that Catholics pick up at church and carry around, as you seem to imply. And as far as I know, we still have freedom of religion in this country. And how is your constant diatribe here NOT anti-Catholic? Are we to root out Catholics as we used to root out gays or deny qualified Catholics to jobs like we used (and still do) deny the same for women?
Again, your thought rings of how Hitler thought about the Jews. Maybe I should change my name to “Catholic Zombie”? Please enlighten us.
Also, would you please criticize the arguments as they are given rather than whether its resources are “Catholic Writers”? SO WHAT . . . ?
And btw, though its evangelical efforts differ from Protestant churches, the Catholic Church also is evangelical. CBK
It is odd, isn’t it Linda, how so many Catholics are in no way catholic.
Greg- I liked your quip. From a prior thread I understood the context. Other commenters have told Catherine that I don’t listen to what she says and they’re correct. Jefferson described the people like Catherine in his day as gnat-like.
One of my comments about Beachteach’s linked article went into moderation. I wrote that the article measured Catholics against evangelicals and made the claim, Catholics were better because they focused on the life of the mind. My added comment was, “So that was what People of Praise was about, not handmaidens?”
If the Catholic hierarchy hadn’t got my government to issue a death sentence for women like my daughter in child-bearing ages, I’d…
But, I sure as hell am not going to shut up now when the Church hierarchy and Steve Bannon are bedfellows.
Diane and All In this blog, Linda has turned what is often a good critique of the present and, yes, dangerous political “leadership” in the Catholic Church into regular, almost daily, harping of anyone who happens to be a member of the Church.
I appreciate Linda, however, for revealing to all here just how deep and recalcitrant bias can be. CBK
Now Rolling Stone is in on the church and politics thing:
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/roe-supreme-court-justices-1378046/
GregB Interesting reading . . . I hope the press puts the present majority at SCOTUS through the ringer.
However, here are a couple of clips from your Rolling Stone citation which MAY reveal some other sorts of “magical thinking” going on besides “rapture.” We can always hope someone up there will say: “Beam them up, Scotty.” The whole article makes for excellent reading.
” . . .but added with a chortle, “Some of them don’t!” (Some Justices don’t pray with her.)
THEN: “The Supreme Court did not respond to a request for comment. Liberty Counsel’s founder, Mat Staver, strenuously denied that the in-person ministering to justices that Nienaber bragged about exists. ‘It’s entirely untrue,’ Staver tells Rolling Stone. ‘There is just no way that has happened.’ He adds: ‘She has prayer meetings for them, not with them.’ Asked if he had an explanation for Nienaber’s direct comments to the contrary, Staver says, ‘I don’t.’” . . .
“But the founder of the ministry, who surrendered its operations to Liberty Counsel in 2018, tells Rolling Stone that he hosted prayer sessions with conservative justices in their chambers from the late-1990s through when he left the group in the mid-2010s. Rob Schenck, who launched the ministry under the name Faith and Action in the Nation’s Capital, described how the organization forged ministry relationships with Samuel Alito, Clarence Thomas, and the late Antonin Scalia, saying he would pray with them inside the high court. Nienaber was Schenk’s close associate in that era, and continued with the ministry after it came under the umbrella of Liberty Counsel. (CBK: my emphasis on 2018) . . . .
“Louis Virelli is a professor at Stetson University College of Law who wrote a book about Supreme Court recusals. He’s blunt in his assessment: ‘Praying with a group that filed an amicus brief with a court,’ he says, ‘is a problem.'”
I would call it TOTALLY CORRODED. But great article, thanks for posting. CBK
Heard a good one worth remembering while listening to episode of Harry Shearer’s LeShow today: Francis the talking pope. Now that’s a good one. For people of a certain generation.
Greg Your earlier note is right . . . about so many who belong to the Catholic Church are not Catholic . . . <–insofar as the latter means so many do not ascribe to the old Absolutist thinking that is at present undergoing great and, for some, unwanted change. Like all Churches around the world, the Catholic Church and its people are in transition.
The problem for many is the old “baggage” that the term “Catholic” brings up in people’s minds–it’s uncritical, to say the least, precisely because the Church has so many historical threads, good and bad, that weave through not only the USA but the history of Europe, Africa, South America . . . and the world. It’s been in a divisive mode since before King Henry VIII split away from Rome and as an institution, in my view, it has lagged behind the more remote but spiritual movements of that history. People stay with it for many reasons; or leave for many more reasons.
Linda, however, has turned what is often a good critique of the present and, yes, dangerous political “leadership” in the Church into regular, almost daily, harping of anyone who happens to be a member of the Church.
And so, I think your comment has legs. CBK
It isn’t surprising that there are so many Catholics who aren’t Catholic. This is true of Christians generally. As people have become more educated and less provincial, they have found it more difficult to believe in virgins giving birth, wafers that become god, demons, hell, Satan, Original Sin inherited by babies, pie in the sky when you die, and so on. So, throw a stick at an American or European today, and you are as likely to hit someone who believes in astrology or reincarnation as someone who professes to be a Christian, and throw a stick at an average group of Jews and Christians, and you will find that your chances are about even that the one you hit will ALSO believe in astrology or reincarnation AND not believe in a long list of traditional beliefs on his or her religion. In other words, because they are better educated, less superstitious, less credulous but still cling to the cultural phenomenon of their religions, they are now practicing a religion that I call Vaguism. It’s sort of like traditional Judeo-Christian belief, but it’s not.
Most people are indoctrinated into this stuff when they are very little and extremely impressionable, and they are taught that it’s VERY BAD and VERY DANGEROUS not to believe it, and so they grow up and even when they know better, they find it hard to throw off. They cling to it. And they rationalize. Well, the text didn’t really mean that we should seek out witches and burn them. It didn’t really mean that this great guy slept with his daughters. It didn’t really mean that the universe was created in six days. It didn’t really mean that a guy commanded the sun to stop in the sky and it did. It didn’t really mean that a man was full of a bunch of demons and those were driven out of him into pigs. LOL. Well, news flash: Yeah, it did mean that stuff. That’s the kind of stuff that people in those times believed. Superstitious people who lived in an era before scientific understanding and attributed phenomena to religious agency.
At any rate, the reason why we have so many Vaguists now is that it is really, really scary and hard to give up ideas that you were indoctrinated into when you were just a child. And the reason why we have this resurgence of fundamentalism is that the non-Vaguists feel themselves, correctly, under attack by those who have thrown off the manacles of religious belief AND by the Vaguists.
The main difference between Christians and those who believe in reincarnation is that the former believe in the afterlife and the latter believe in the afterbirth.
True that
The current assassin zombie is reminiscent of the murderous psychopath who killed 26 people, mostly young kids, at Sandy Hook Elementary School in CT. It’s staggering, monstrous, like being hit in the head with a baseball bat repeatedly and regularly. When do we, as a nation, say enough is enough and really mean it?! The Highland Park killer bought the guns legally, he wasn’t working, where did he get the money for the purchases. He was living in the same house as his father and uncle, didn’t they notice that this young man was totally off his nut and armed?
Have you seen photos of this guy? He’s the physical embodiment of a red flag.
Yes, because first impressions are always infallible. They tell us everything we need to know about anyone.
I wouldn’t go that far.
Also, from the NYTimes:
“Police officials in suburban Chicago said they had seized 16 knives, a dagger and a sword in 2019 from man who was taken into custody on Monday in connection with the deaths of seven people at a Fourth of July parade in Highland Park, Ill.
Deputy Chief Christopher Covelli of the Lake County Sheriff’s Office said officials had seized the weapons from Robert E. Crimo III after a family member told officers that he had planned to “kill everyone.”
Mr. Crimo was not charged in connection with that incident and, as of late Tuesday afternoon, had not been charged in connection with the attack on the parade. But the details of that seizure, as well as an incident earlier in 2019 in which someone reported to the police that Mr. Crimo had attempted suicide, raised questions about how and why Mr. Crimo was able to legally purchase several guns in the years since.“
“raised questions about how and why Mr. Crimo was able to legally purchase several guns in the years since.“
Questioned answered: His Republican father vouched for his 20 year old son being good to go to own guns.
No, they didn’t notice it after he dropped out of school after TWO days as a sophomore. They didn’t notice it when he threatened suicide. They didn’t notice it when he threatened to kill his entire family. They didn’t notice it when police took the 16 knives & some swords. They didn’t notice it when he made gruesome art & videos. They didn’t notice it when he (asked?) his father to co-sign for a FOID card AFTER threatening to kill his entire family.They didn’t notice that he was a minor & that it was the wrong thing to enable the minor to get a gun. They didn’t notice, “homeschooling” him, that he was never able to earn a GED.They didn’t notice that he had lost a minimum wage (@ Panera) job quite awhile ago & wasn’t working.
They just DIDN’T NOTICE their son.
& now, of course, their public statement is, “We are heartbroken.” & the meaningless, “our thoughts & prayers go out to the victims & their families.”
They couldn’t spend any money/their insurance* on obtaining what are possibly the best mental health services in the country–for their son. (Highland Park Hospital has a renowned adolescent in-patient psychiatric ward), but he had his own car & 5 guns. And now, they are lawyered up…w/no less than the lawyer who once represented R. Kelly. Many of us here are hoping that the father will face charges, just as Ethan Crumbly’s parents have, & have been jailed.
Yes, the similarities are obvious–Sandy Hook killer, Ethan Crumbly, probably Uvalde killer (so many layers RE: that recent tragedy that-could-have-been-prevented that we haven’t even gotten into the backstory of that) & the Parkland killer (“With the power of my AR, you will know who I am. My life is nothing & I am meaningless.I live in seclusion & solitude. I hate everyone & everything”) & all the way back to, ironically, Laurie Dann, who ran around Winnetka, IL (right next door to Highland Park) in 1988 w/a gun (bought by her parents, who knew she was depressed & mentally ill), attempted to poison pre-school children, got into a school & shot several children, killing one, ran into a house & shot a young man & then killed herself.
So, yes, of course we educators & parents & people w/common sense, here, understand that mental illness is a problem & must be treated, & that is the clue to what really is common sense, & that’s give a kid TREATMENT,
NEVER, EVER a gun.
Because guns do, indeed, kill people. Many, many people.
Have you seen what he painted in the backyard?
I wonder if the father and mother also shared Bobby Crimo’s Trumpanzeeism.
A sweet little boy was found bloodied and alone during the Highland Park July 4th Parade Massacre. He was lifted from underneath his father who was shot in the leg during the attack. Good Samaritans cleaned out his scrapes and washed off blood. He was wearing 1 shoe & a very bloody sock. He told everyone that he just wanted his Mom & Dad.
Highland Park actually banned military-style rifles nearly a decade ago. No surprise that the 2013 ban was challenged. The case made its way to the Supreme Court. The then SCOTUS refused to hear it. But DISSENTING Clarence Thomas wrote, “An overwhelming majority use such weapons lawfully.”
Dr. David Baum was on scene and treated July 4th Parade shooting victims. “The people who were gone/deceased were blown up by a high-powered rifle. It sounded like machine guns. A physician’s instinct is to do something. I saw Horrific body injuries and an Unspeakable head injury.”
Wounds from these weapons are catastrophic. Limb shattering and severing.
This is that child. Both parents were murdered yesterday. His grandparents, Soviet Jews, immigrated for a “better life”.
Just too much to take in and process. So heartbreaking.
So horrific
“American Freedom”
Freedom to die
At freedom parade?
Freedom’s a lie
A Freedom charade
“Died on the Fourth of July”
Died on the Fourth
As matter of course
Died from a shot
From gunman’s crazed plot
Died for a “Right”
That ain’t even real
Such is the plight
Americans feel
“American Freedom (2)”
The freedom to be shot
By gunmen in the streets
Is all that we have got
The “Freedom of Decease”
”Freedom of decease” (sometimes shortened to just “Free decease”) is an unenumerated Constitutional right guaranteed by the Second Amendment
Original Intent
They hate us for our freedoms:
Majority Supremes
They want us for their fiefdom
Their old enslaver dreams
I honestly could care less about shootings in the US. Nothing will be done and there will be many, many more to come, one probably as soon as within the next week. I just hope I’m lucky enough to not have it happen to a loved one or a friend. But it will affect one of us sometime, maybe soon. I’d like to have the president and other elected officials who favor gun control just ignore them. With a statement like:
“Today is the last mass shooting I’ll comment on. As tragic as it is, it wasn’t the first and it certainly won’t be the last. Let’s be honest. Mass shootings will continue be a regular part of American life and nothing will be done about it. And there’s really nothing I or anyone who wants to do something effectively actually can do. The Supreme Court’s ideology is the law of the land and no changes are in the offing. So since I can’t do anything about it, I’ll focus on things where I may have an impact to improve the lives of ordinary Americans. And it’s ultimately their responsibility. As long as they get suckered by NRA ad campaigns and elect obstructionist, they get what they deserve. I really don’t care about their families’ crocodile tears. Elect some people who support change and then get back to me if I’m still here. Otherwise, the best I can do is wish that it won’t impact you personally. And that’s actually not too good.”
This is not a civilized country.
That would be an honest and sobering statement for all to hear. If there is going to be change – we have to start with honesty.
Shots and Prayers
Shots and prayers
Prayers and shots
Lots of swears
But nothing clots
Guns and Rights
Rights and guns
Tons of fights
But nothing comes
If had my filling of shots and prayers when I was young, I might have gotten into theology. Sounds like fun. Great tenure if you can get it.
I think I’m going to have a shot or two. Pray for me.
One more thing, just read this in an article:
“But at the time, conservative Justice Clarence Thomas — who joined the nation’s highest court in 1991 — opposed Highland Park’s prohibition on assault weapons and large-capacity magazines, writing in a dissent that the ‘overwhelming majority’ who use such weapons use them lawfully.”
I can’t think of another issue for which that argument can be used (not that it was used effectively here); that the reason something dangerous to society should be legal is because an “‘overwhelming majority’ use them lawfully.” When examined for logic, that’s some nuttiness.
Insanity.
The overwhelming majority of judges use the laws and Constitution lawfully.
The mere fact that the Supreme Majority use them unlawfully is not reason for concern.
One of your best, SDP! BTW–where’s your H-?!
As I’d written before, can’t fit mine in, but still hysterical.
Excellent analogy, Poet.
Beautifully said, someDAM
I’m glad to see you’re not hysterical anymore. Or at least for now.
What Mayor Lori Lightfoot said.
Also unapologetic.
A survivor who we had speak at our school emphatically argued that the Holocaust should be viewed as an atrocity NOT as a tragedy since the former is intentional while a tragedy is not (eg. being struck by lightning). Similarly, since weapons of war now flood our streets compliments of the GQP, NRA and SCOTUS, these assault rifle murder sprees should be viewed as a RepubliQan atrocity NOT as a national tragedy.
Thanks for bringing the correct wording to the discussion.
Perfectly said, Callisto. I am going to be repeating this and crediting you. Exactly.
The next massacre?
An article at Vice (7-5-2022, “Christian Fascist Propaganda Is All Over Tik Tok”) examines
platform presences with “shared visual language …(which) exists close to explicitly White nationalist content.” The imagery uses 4 Chan memes, scripture, orthodox and Catholic iconography, imagery of holy wars,…The largest presence in the category (2,000,000 views) is out of Ireland- Caitliceach_r. The article makes the point that SCOTUS’ conservative religious majority have normalized Christian nationalism. One of the supporters of the fascist propaganda on Tik Tok was interviewed for the Vice article, he said, ” We are the Christian Taliban and we will not stop until Handmaid’s tale is a reality- even worse than that -to be honest.”
The crutch some women use- conservative religion- may cost all American women, their rights.
I hear a lot about how impossible it would be to collect the millions of firearms that are already in circulation. Even with legislation to make them illegal or with buy back programs.
So stop making/selling the ammo. Choke off the supply of what’s really killing people. Or at the very least, severely limit how much ammo any one person can buy and have a record of past purchases.
Unlimited access to ammunition is just asking for trouble. NRA needs to be reined in in a very big way.
The massacres will increase until the
Republican Party lies in the dustbin of history.
They have cast their fate in lead.
They have left no other course.
NYCpsp: The quote from John Pavlovitz (sp.–? Your comment too far up & can’t find now)
is one of the best comments here. Act or be acted upon.
I can’t agree that it is “one of the best comments here.”
I’ll repost what I responded to NYCpsp: I’ve seen that quote by Pavlovitz in a number of places in the last few weeks. It doesn’t make sense to me.
We don’t want people now to do what the “good people in Germany would have done in 1931” because those “good people” were the ones who didn’t do anything about what was going on around them at the time.
Are you saying that we should be ignoring the basic fascism that is growing now?
I doubt it but that quote sure makes it seem like that is what you are saying.
He didn’t say. “Do what the good people did,” Duane. He said, “Do what you wish the good people had done.” Big difference.
What I read Pavlovitz to be saying/ IS saying, Duane, is what it is that we WANTED (WISHED) more good people in Germany to have done, meaning, what we WANTED them to do (that they SHOULD have NOT joined & embraced the SS–thus growing it into the monster it became; they SHOULD have resisted & criticized the violent machinations of the Nazi Party). He isn’t saying we WANT people to do now what the people in Germany ACTUALLY did (which was to do nothing–you’re right on that), he’s saying that “Whatever we WISH more good people…WOULD have done (& that would have ben to act against), & that is what we should do now–“do it now.” Resist, speak out, protest, refuse to go gently into that bad night.
Thanks for the clarification!
What should the Pope have done about the Nazi atrocities committed against Jews?
Kertzer’s “The Secret History of Pius XII, Mussolini, and Hitler”, a thoroughly researched book that relied on newly released documents from the Vatican archives, tells us what he did.
I don’t expect supposed religious leaders to be any more moral or ethical than politicians.
Worth your time and consideration:
I’ve been warning of American collapse for a long time now. And so I want to put this gently. Did you think I was kidding?
A lot of people did. My peers and colleagues attacked me and turned on me. They called me everything from a fantasist to a charlatan and much, much worse. They’re still making fun of me on Twitter. But I wasn’t playing around, and I wasn’t doing it to scare anyone. I was doing it because that’s what the numbers said, and that’s what my training as an economist had taught me. I could see history repeating itself, in the stunning implosion of the American middle class — and I knew that was the road to social collapse, paved with fascism…
America is now beginning to cross a line. The line where fascist street violence is normalized. How did that line get crossed? Well, the crucial threshold appears to have been Jan 6th. There, the far right’s idol, father figure, and Lord Protector — Trump — finally did what he’d been practically salivating over for years at that point: incited a far right mob, made of organized, armed militants, to storm Congress. We now know, thanks to the J6C hearings, that he wanted to personally lead them down Constitution Avenue himself.
https://eand.co/wake-up-america-this-is-collapse-fe4a8317f939
This video helps us weave conservative religious crap, “women who aren’t docile are bad” with causation for 18-21 year-old- white male Trump supporters committing mass murders!
The mainstream media keeps saying that the killer in Highland Park had no known political views but Twitter and British media show many photos of him at Trump rallies.
The bias is pronounced. If the guy had been part of BLM, pro choice or pro-Muslim rallies, it would be extensively reported.
Greg-
The Liberal Redneck can add religious exorcisms to his segment courtesy of Bill Bennett. Uvalde-type atrocities wouldn’t happen if there were more exorcisms.
Thanks for the Rolling Stone link. It should cease to surprise me that an entire article can be written about religion and SCOTUS judges and the word Catholic never makes it to print.
Linda Maybe the writers at Rolling Stone don’t share your bias. CBK
I made a very long comment, above, that was SUPPOSED to be a reply to Joe Jersey’s 3:45 PM 7/5 comment.
Wow, Bob Shepherd up there at 5:27 PM on 7/6–I entirely missed your comment/reply to Duane RE: John Pavlovitz–which briefly (& better!) said what I said to explain…& would have saved me a lot of time.
Thanks, anyway!!
&, you know what, I think most of us are doing,right now, in whatever way we can, what we WISHED “the good people of Germany would have done.”
Perhaps the Republicans are right arm every Public School teacher in Amerika with AR15s and Semi automatic hand guns . We won’t even need to do much training these weapons don’t require much to be lethal . Teachers being predominantly Center to Left; watch how quickly the Right again redefines the meaning of the slave patrol amendment .
Linda writes “I sure as hell am not going to shut up now when the Church hierarchy and Steve Bannon are bedfellows.”
No one I know wants Linda to “shut up” about such liaisons.
Just don’t fear-monger and smear every person with a Catholic background, or even all “church hierarchy,” as if we all are pod-people who merely “follow along” or somehow by nature fit your version of anti-Catholic/religious bias.
BTW, it’s fascists and those who are either closet fascists themselves or taken in by their gaslighting tactics. As Linda keeps telling us: fascists are chameleons, wrapped in the flag and carrying a prop-Bible.
Put Linda’s methods and extremities on the other side and exchange a few words, and she would be the enemy of democracy. CBK
Diane and All Food for thought: This from the Boston Globe: this am.
“As school violence returns to prepandemic levels, frustrated law enforcement officials say Boston Public Schools is leaving them in the dark.
“The MBTA police needed a little help investigating the May 11 stabbing of a student at the Nubian Square T Station. They knew the suspect’s name but needed to confirm that he attended Dearborn Stem Academy and where he lived.
“School officials wouldn’t tell them.
“So, the MBTA police took an extraordinary step: They filed a child abuse complaint against a school department official. The action reflected law enforcement’s mounting frustration at what they see as greatly diminished cooperation from Boston Public Schools in reporting and helping investigate crimes involving students.”
“Read the full story/Related: After police officers were phased out of Boston’s public schools, violent incidents raise public safety concerns. . . . Laptops were used in three Boston school assaults, raising concerns about student safety . . .Teens allegedly take over PA system on MBTA Orange Line train and then assault a passenger, officials say.” CBK
The Republican Party glorifies an obnoxious bully of the crudest, rudest, most vindictive sort, a man who led a violent insurrection against the very government he was sworn to uphold — that’s the role model they hold up for youngsters to emulate — and we’re supposed to believe it’s video games leading kids astray …
Is any wonder impressionable youth are driven insane trying to figure out what to believe and how to behave?
exactly
I’ve hesitated to add fuel to the fire in regards to violent video games and their place in our society. But personal experience is a very big determiner of our realities…and I do have some in this area.
I taught kids who were labeled “Severely Emotionally Disturbed” for two decades. Most we’re extremely volatile and willing to inflict physical damage at any moment.
Of all the kids I taught, I can only think of a handful who did not love violent video games. They talked about it all the time. Compared notes. Often came in half asleep from playing until 3:00 AM.
Before it was deemed “unnecessary“, our first period was dedicated to a class meeting. At one of these meetings I asked them what it was that they loved about these games.
The violence/excitement factor was the common theme. And when someone said that he dug watching a character beg for mercy before blowing his/her brains out, the rest of the kids enthusiastically agreed. It was a high point of one of the games and they were all well acquainted with it.
Do violent video games and movies cause people to commit these acts of atrocity? I don’t think so. But they are definitely excellent tinder to add to the fire of anyone who leans in that direction.
I’ve seen this with young men today as well.
This even happens in the younger grades. Teachers report of students with angry impulses – who also exhibit repetitive talk about video games (mind craft etc – not all parents keep young children away from violent video games).
“But they are definitely excellent tinder to add to the fire of anyone who leans in that direction.” Well put gitipik. Lots of time in front of a screen takes the place of positive socialization experience – and replaced with competitive and sometimes violent content.
Gun control is most urgent.
But there are other issues that can’t be ignored – yes – including a leader who models fascist angry behavior.
“He stays up until 3:00, playing those terrible video games. If I take away the device he gets really angry and breaks things”.
There’s a lot to be said of a culture that glorifies and capitalizes, financially, on violence. Guns are the most obvious and prevalent manifestation. For me, it doesn’t matter that “most people” don’t go over the edge as a result of the barrage. Giving easy access (either store bought or from the family armory) of killing machines to those who ARE so inclined is madness.
To Diane’s comment today about the msm: yes, the msm has (& this wasn’t at first) been talking about his political bent–showed picture of him at it45 rally in neighboring suburb, costumed as Waldo (as in “Where’s Waldo?”). Lawrence O’Donnell, who’s always on the money & is, as he said, faithfully reporting on Uvalde nightly, also brought this up & showed a Tweet from his father that said something about protecting the 2nd amendment. (When he ran for mayor, H.P, under incumbent mayor Nancy Roetering, was the only city in IL to have an assault weapons ban, & that was probably a part of the reason he ran against her, although he’d cited displeasure as to how businesses were treated in H.P.). The local media, too, has been reporting on shooter’s activities, postings, political bent. Finally, I wish they would stop showing his picture & saying his name: his notoriety is surely thrilling to what a disinformation & extremist researcher & specialist reported as a dark web of potential mass shooters & wannabes, who are most certainly cheering his actions & are glorifying him. There is an organization, “Don’t Say His Name” that has earned the media to NOT show pictures or say names of mass shooters for just those reasons: copycats abound, &, like this one, they hide in plain sight. Once again, Anderson Cooper said that CNN was going to abide by this but, of course, they haven’t.
I can’t even remember the name of the Sandy Hook shooter, only remember one of the Columbine killers, couldn’t remember Parkland (until yesterday, when I looked him up for a quote) & people have told me they can’t remember Uvalde shooter’s name
(which I’d had trouble with, as well, but remember because it’s such a short one), but that’s only because there’s been so much (& continues to be) news surrounding the police inaction at the scene, & that’s been the focus…& needs to be, because those parents & the community wants answers & consequences, as there should be.
Again, I highly recommend watching “The Last Word w/Lawrence O’Donnell” on MSNBC–9-10 PM CT (& repeated from 12 AM-1 AM); 10-11 PM ET.
The end of this segment deals with the availability of guns:
Subject of message: The frequency of nonfatal shootings and firearm deaths has become a uniquely American phenomenon. 90,498 gun deaths in 2020 and 2021
Dear Senator Todd Young [R-IN], are you still enjoying the bribe of $2,896,732 that the NRA gave you? It obviously is BLINDING you to the facts surrounding deaths by guns in the United States. There have been 309 mass killings of innocent adults and children since the start of THIS year.
Politicians such as yourself are quick to invoke mental health issues as the cause of mass shootings. However, three decades of research has established that people with mental illnesses are responsible for just a small percentage of interpersonal and gun violence. Numerous studies have reached this conclusion: While people with illnesses such as schizophrenia have a somewhat greater risk of committing violent acts than other members of the public, and substance use increases that risk, the vast majority of people with mental illness never perpetrate violence. They are more likely to be victims of violence.
There were 90,498 gun deaths in 2020 and 2021, 38,796 were homicides. There are an estimated 400 million guns in this country. The frequency of nonfatal shootings and firearm deaths, experts say, has become a uniquely American phenomenon.
You, Senator Todd Young, are guilty of perpetrating the number of murders and suicides because you have been bought off by the NRA. You never will stop the murder of innocent adults and children because you don’t have the guts to vote for meaningful gun control laws.
As a parting thought, let me add: 90,498 deaths to living humans caused by the number of available guns in the United States never matters. JUST GET THAT FETUS BORN. After that, it then can die.
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Subject of message: The frequency of nonfatal shootings & firearm deaths has become a uniquely American phenomenon. 90,498 gun deaths in 2020 & 2021 plus there were 309 mass murders of the innocent THIS year.
Dear Senator Braun [R-IN], being afraid of not being re-elected by Hoosiers obviously is BLINDING you to the facts surrounding the number of deaths by guns in the United States. There have been 309 mass killings of innocent adults and children since the start of THIS year.
Politicians such as yourself are quick to invoke mental health issues as the cause of mass shootings. However, three decades of research has established that people with mental illnesses are responsible for just a small percentage of interpersonal and gun violence. Numerous studies have reached this conclusion: While people with illnesses such as schizophrenia have a somewhat greater risk of committing violent acts than other members of the public, and substance use increases that risk, the vast majority of people with mental illness never perpetrate violence. They are more likely to be victims of violence.
There were 90,498 gun deaths in 2020 and 2021, 38,796 were homicides. There are an estimated 400 million guns in this country. The frequency of nonfatal shootings and firearm deaths, experts say, has become a uniquely American phenomenon.
You, Senator Mike Braun, are guilty of perpetrating the number of murders and suicides. You never will stop the murder of innocent adults and children because you don’t have the guts to vote for MEANINGFUL gun control laws. The second amendment doesn’t give everyone the right to kill and destroy human life. When the second amendment was written, there were NO automatic rifles that could instantly kill masses of people. You can allow everyone who loves guns to possess a musket that has to be reloaded after having fired one shot. That is originalism at its best. Also, women and blacks at that time didn’t have the right to vote. Do you really want to go back to that time in history?
As a parting thought, let me add: 90,498 deaths to living humans caused by the number of available guns in the United States never matters. JUST GET THAT FETUS BORN. After that, it then can die.