Lloyd Lofthouse was a Marine. He saw combat. Then he became a teacher. He is retired.
He explains here why it is a VERY bad idea to arm teachers:
”I woke up this morning remembering what it was like when I was teaching. There were students everywhere. Many arrived early in the morning and some were still around late at night. My classroom was surrounded by other classrooms full of students during the regular school day when a shooter might show up.
“If I had been armed with an automatic pistol and fired in any direction, I would have hit other classrooms with an average of 34 students in each one and a teacher and sometimes other adults helping the teacher or observing. No matter which way I fired a pistol, there would be another classroom and if the classroom wasn’t there, there were the streets with traffic and businesses and houses on the other side of those streets. People everywhere.
“Between classes, the halls were filled (packed is a better description) with students moving from one class to the next. Even trained as I was from the time I was a U.S. Marine, there would be no way to avoid hitting another student in that crowd even if I could identify the shooter. If there was a shooter, that crowd would be in a panic running everywhere. One shot from a pistol I carried, even if it hit the shooter could end up passing through the shooter and hitting a student behind them.
“If all the teachers are armed and several are shooting at the shooter if they can see the shooter and there are others all around in a panic, the death toll and wounded could end up much higher.
“How could any teacher live with that for the rest of their lives — that they fired on a shooter but missed and hit another child and/or that they hit the shooter but also took out one or more children behind the shooter?
“What happens to the teachers then — will they be lauded as heroes or crucified as careless killers?
“No matter how much one trains to become a skilled shooter, there is no one, I repeat, no one, not even the best snipers in the military that don’t miss their target and hit something else to either side or behind it without hitting the target.
”Once you pull that trigger, that round is going to go somewhere with no guarantee that you will hit what you wanted to hit. Even if you shoot straight up into the sky, that bullet will eventually come back down and hit the earth or something/someone else.”
I appreciate all the posts and comments resisting the insanity of armed teachers. But I just submitted an Op-Ed to the New York Times (which won’t be published) making a quite different point that seems to evade nearly everyone.
It reads, in part: “The images of bleeding children won’t leave me alone. The idea of arming teachers is ludicrous. School security issues are nearly irrelevant. Unspoken – unnoticed – in the chaotic conversation about school shootings is a simple reality. When my school discussed and rejected armed security guards, I pointed out the truth. Yes, the idea of an armed madman in a classroom is unthinkable. But at our school – at every school – hundreds of kids giggle on playgrounds, gather at entrances at arrival time, linger on sidewalks after school and fill bleachers at sports events. Teachers and kids roam towns and cities on field trips. A sad, angry man-child, lonely and desperate, needn’t penetrate a “hardened” school to unleash mayhem. The children are everywhere.
There are only two ways to keep children safe. We need to deeply examine why so many boys in America are bullied, marginalized, saturated with violent images and hell-bent on getting even. And we need to get killing machines off the streets, out of stores, out of homes and come to our senses.
There is no conclusion other than to admit that we love our guns more than we love our children. And it makes me weep.”
Exactly right, Steve. Some people love guns more than children. Some people love fetuses but don’t care about born children.
“Right to (9 months of) Life”
Starts at fert
And ends at birth
Life is curt
For what it’s worth
Your comment is right on, Diane.
Thanks for this. We need people in public office who care more about the people they are supposed to serve rather than the donors they now serve. The only way to accomplish this is by voter turnout at every single election. That’s the only way to overcome the paranoia driving the gun lobby propaganda. The Reich Minister of Propaganda taught them well.
Steve,
Thank you so much for sharing this. I just read this aloud to my husband (we are both educators) and we absolutely agree that issues of bullying, harassment, isolation, depression and the normalization of violence are essential and often-overlooked parts of the larger conversation about how to keep kids safe. Is your op-ed posted anywhere else and/or are you continuing this conversation on FB?
Lindsey
stevenelson0248: spot on.
😎
Thank you, Lloyd, for this sanity. Btw, for those of you who don’t know this yet, Lloyd Lofthoise is Aldo a gifted novelist. Give him a read!
Yes and yes.
Is Aldo his nom de plume?
The president makes these outrageous statements
1) because he’s just stupid;
2) because he doesn’t think and doesn’t listen to any educated expert;
3) he caters to the crowds he hears in his sleep cheering on these outrageous comments
4) he knows that one outrageous comment gets the headline instead of the facts and issues.
It’s on his “I need a diversion” calendar Sunday talk show and WH visits, “make outrageous statement” – – Then if it’s Monday it’s infrastructure, Tuesday the wall, Wednesday immigrants, Thursday Obama, Friday Hillary. Distraction and hoots and hollers from his angry white base.
Arming teachers. It is so outrageous can you believe it even made the news? And now sucks up the news. Police go through months of training and part of that is how to handle a criminal on a crowded street. There are hundreds of reasons why the idea is outrageous and 1 in a million that there will be an armed teacher actually in the hall where the shooter is.
Ohhhh …and THIS mother IS crazy!
For real!
This is one where I think Trump is so in the weeds that he’s saying whatever he’s told to say. He added some of his usual stupid improvised remarks that kind of glance on the topic…but I think this is one of the rare moments when he’s not looking for a diversion.
He looked scared.
Just read where he got the idea from LaPierre. NRA. Why am I not surprised?
Thank you, Lloyd. Drumph is a simpleton.
I just read these:
https://www.commondreams.org/views/2018/02/24/no-founding-fathers-didnt-give-you-right-bear-arms
https://www.commondreams.org/further/2018/02/22/savage-sickos-among-us
I’m planning to send this letter to my corrupt Senator Todd Young (R-IN) on 2/25/2018 who received $2,896,732 from the NRA to always vote the correct way on any gun control bill.
Again teachers LEAD!
https://www.commondreams.org/news/2018/02/22/armmewith-teachers-lead-opposition-trumps-plan-give-educators-guns
http://www.dailycamera.com/boulder-county-schools/ci_31688327/boulder-valley-school-district-rejects-suggestion-arm-teachers
Sen Blunt (MO) $4.5 million last 20 years; close to $3 million latest election cycle – after Newtown “I don’t think the weapon is the problem…” Florida “Let’s see if any laws were violated…” and his mantra “Too soon for policy – need more information”
http://www.stltoday.com/opinion/editorial/editorial-when-the-nra-is-under-fire-sen-roy-blunt/article_cbb7a034-fa20-5315-831d-d39ada14a699.html
These guys are all going to hide behind the “911 and FBI knew about this guy…”
Don’t forget mental health services, which they won’t fund.
Lloyd makes sense. Our president does not. Case closed.
AGREE!
I sent Lloyd’s post to a friend who was also a Nam Vet and who owns guns. This is what he wrote to me:
“He” refers to Lloyd.
“He is absolutely correct. People don’t know the power of a bullet after it leaves the weapon. Depending on the caliber of the bullet, it can enter a house and exit the other side and enter another house. A 50 caliber can travel one mile and go through a hallow tile brick and kill the enemy. The AR-15 rifle round, can go through a person and hit another on the other side. Thank GOD it wasn’t an automatic.”
Thanks, Lloyd and Diane.
Arming teachers is such a ridiculously stupid idea, it’s not worth the attention it’s getting. It seems to me a dodge, a political sidestep to avoid discussion of the real issue, an assault rifle ban.
I was career military followed by university professor. As a teacher, each classroom is filled with students who require that I look beyond their personal, financial, social, intellecual challenges and try to inspire,and and inform them to,become the best future self possible.
When teachers assume the role of armed guardian, sifting each class and unsettling encounter, they must, if to do,that task to its grim logical end, see their students, colleagues and strangers as potential targets. Each day conduct the surveillance and environmental checks prepared to kill. Teachers are already exhausted meeting endless adminisistrivia so add combat ethos to that.
If you think this will create a a sound area for teaching and learning you are deluded. Soon our schools will resemble many of our police – shaven headed, muscle bound bullies compensating with a firearm.
My bar for job satisfaction keeps getting lower. I used to get bent out of shape about questionable teaching methods, policy, and mandates. Then resisted standards, tests, scripted curricula, and CBE. Now I’m like, “please don’t let my colleagues carry weapons around children.” I have always told myself I’d always stick it out. Both for students, and in spite of the system. But, if arming teachers becomes a thing, I’m out. I will take a pay cut, make pizzas, and default on my mortgage before I work with, or under anyone who allows this to happen.
In Israel, in response to school shootings, the government began arming teachers some years ago. See this article:
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/21714
Charles,
The U.S. is not Israel. We do not live in a garrison state.
Stupid comments like this waste my time and inform no one.
The U. S . A is not Israel you are completely we don’t leave in a garrison state .
I hope people understand that teachers are not soldiers , soldiets can not go to war without weapons, the weapon of the teachers have always been books, pencils and paper, the rule of execipon, was when the Castro dictatorship handed out weopons to teachers to intimidate students and opponents of the regime totalitarian Castro. We do not want another dictatorship, many have no idea what it is to live in a dictatorship. Thanks Diane for your excelent Job. You care about the good education.
I remember when you ask me who was the Education in Cuba I replay to you Public!
I am well-aware that the USA is not Israel. Nevertheless, I feel that the Israelis could offer us some excellent advice about hardening our schools, and preventing school shootings.
I used to work for the US Diplomatic service. The USA often consults with the Israelis (and other nations), on security issues.
You often suggest (correctly), that the USA should adopt ideas from Finland (and other nations).
Israel has not had a fatal school shooting in many years. Consulting with their security service, and picking up on some (NOT ALL) of their procedures, could help make our school safer.
Everyone in Israel, except the Orthodox, does military service, including women
Our countries are not comparable
Charles,
I have repeatedly asked you to stop posting irrelevant, distracting comments whose only purpose is to provoke me and waste my time
“Hardening our schools” is a despicable response to the problem. Instead of hardening our schools we need to soften our hearts.
Diane Charles could be smart but this link describes what he is. I hope you understand because I’m on your side . I’m with you because you are no only smart , your wise and strong fighter agains dooms and evils Choices I love your blog because you don’t hired the truth you have done a lot for the good education.
Thanks I really appreciate it! I should have listened to you and do when you asked me *here . *Reibel why, don’t you send your son to a public school ? Diane was to late for my son , Hialeah Education Academy . Inc destroyed my son future by the way that fraudulent Charter it’s inside a huge scandal , thanks God and Publics schooll defender like you those Charters are been questioned and loss the “good “ reputation that never has it .
Said no to Chaters because they are corrupt business.
http://scottberkun.com/essays/40-why-smart-people-defend-bad-ideas/
>
Charles, we were talking about banning assault weapons (and more). Can civilians in Israel, a country extremely close to war zones and under permanent terrorism threat, purchase AR 15’s? I didn’t think so. If anything, this is the topics the NRA should talk about instead of proposing crazy ideas.
For many crazy ideas, please see the Daily Show video I posted today.
The AR-15 and similar assault weapons were banned by Congress from 1994-2004. When the law expired, the ban was not renewed.
Israel has much different policies and legislation, with respect to private weapons ownership. Please see
http://www.thetower.org/article/yes-we-really-can-learn-about-guns-from-israel/
I believe sincerely, that the USA could learn much from other countries’ experience with private weapons ownership. We do not have all of the answers.
Nor does Israel. They live in a war zone 24/7.
Thank God, we do not.
We have a lot to learn from Australia and Japan.
Charles, why are you quoting filtered descriptions of Israel’s gun control:? The article’s basic claim that there is a proliferation of weapons in Israel is false when compared with the US: Israel’s civilian gun-rate is 5% of the US’s. Israel has a proliferation of weapons only compared to Europe where mass shootings in schools is nonexistent apart from isolated incidents.
As it has been explained many times: one false assumption makes a whole argument invalid. The article’s basic claim is invalid (it’s a badly disguised lie), hence there is no reason to read on.
Similarly, your claim that Israel and the US’s security situations are comparable is false, hence there is no reason to listen to the rest of what you are saying.
The correct approach even Israel signs up for: disarm the population first if you can, and arm only when unavoidable.
Actually, the article is sensible, and despite its ambiguous promise, it’s not advocating for gun ownership or for “hardening school security”. Quite the opposite
Wayne LaPierre, drew a controversial parallel in an attempt to support this idea on Meet The Press. “Israel had a whole lot of school shootings until they did one thing: They said, ‘We’re going to stop it,’ and they put armed security in every school and they have not had a problem since then,” he said.
Israeli officials rejected LaPierre’s false analogy and understandably distanced themselves from America’s gun violence crisis. “We’re fighting terrorism, which comes under very specific geopolitical and military circumstances. This is not something that compares with the situation in the US,” Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor said.
@ Stevenelson:
Q “Hardening our schools” is a despicable response to the problem. Instead of hardening our schools we need to soften our hearts END Q
Are you serious? Almost everyone from the NRA to the most vociferous opponent of the 2d amendment, is in favor of increasing security measures in public schools, to provide additional protection from violence.
By “hardening”, I mean increasing security training for school personnel, providing additional fencing, and video camera observation.
We need not turn our publicly-operated schools into prisons, with barbed wire fencing, and watchtowers with sharpshooters patrolling with sniper rifles.
We can protect our nation’s children from violence (and other crimes, like drug dealing,etc). with increased technology, and security awareness.
Charles,
Would security fences and cameras stopped Cruz? The armed guards hid.
Next idea.
“We can protect our nation’s children from violence (and other crimes, like drug dealing,etc). with increased technology, and security awareness.”
Why do that when guncontrol already works very well in the rest of the western (and not so western) world? Why make kids and parents paranoid when there are proven methods to safety which, instead of increasing costs, reduce costs: people instead of buying guns, will buy flowers to their spouses and their kids’ teachers, and politicians instead of paying more for weapons research and surveillance technology, and cutting taxes for gun manufacturers will give more to public schools.
Come on Charles, we do not have to widen the battlefield but reduce its size. We need disarmament not armament.
Not buying it, Charles. The response to killings should be to do something about guns in our country. And about men who need guns to affirm their masculinity. And about a society that bullies and humiliates boys until they burst. The whole “secure school” nonsense is . . . nonsense. As I have written, being a head of a school for 19 years, we can’t “harden” our school against a gun culture. Our children are on playgrounds, on field trips, in front of the school in large groups before and after school.
The “harden” schools crap is NRA talk, adopted by a mindless president. It is a way to avoid the real issue, which is to have a relatively gun free society with men and boys who don’t need guns to feel “manly.”
There is no reason to take Charles seriously: in another blog post here, he shows us an article by an Israeli guy whose point is exactly that America should implement heavy gun control, and dismisses the NRA call for armed guards in US schools as nonsense.
I think the main thing we need to stick to is that we don’t want our kids going to school afraid. Armed guards patrolling the halls shouldn’t become the norm.
And I’ll keep repeating this:
It’s not just schools. It’s happening everywhere. Should we just place an armed guard on every corner to keep the people “safe”?
A semi-automatic rifle is going to give an aggressor with a plan which includes knowledge of the target area a huge advantage over the defender. Semi-automatic weapons kill lots of people in a short amount of time. They have very little recoil, so they are very accurate and they have 30 rounds per clip. And the clips are replaced easily.
Why do we need to allow any weapon of this sort to be sold to civilians?
When pressed for an answer to this, I hear this quote of Washington’s, which is tagged on to the end of the 2nd amendment:
“A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined. But they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government”.
Muskets ain’t gonna do it no more. Gotta keep up with the Joneses.
“A free people ought not only be armed and disciplined. But they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government”.
The constitution needs to be updated, but for now, it’s old enough to be read as the Bible: translate the concrete references to current usage. In this case, the government nowadays has very different means to abuse us, and we should be armed against those abuses. This whole “we need guns to protect us from government” takes away our attention from these modern day abuses, so that we won’t fight them with appropriate weapons.
That’s an excellent point, Mate. Guns are not our only concern by any means.
I’m interested in finding the origins of that quote, btw. It’s inscribed on a plaque somewhere in the large state of Texas. What’s notable is that it quotes the 2nd Amendment and then adds that last part, at the end (the person posting the image had circled that part, to make his point).
I just did a search on it:
http://www.mountvernon.org/digital-encyclopedia/article/spurious-quotations/
Not entirely accurate, it would seem:
“This quote is partially accurate as the beginning section is taken from Washington’s First Annual Message to Congress on the State of the Union. However, the quote is then manipulated into a differing context and the remaining text is inaccurate. Here is the actual text from Washington’s speech:
“A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.”
So…I’ll post that in reply on FB and am confident that the person responsible for the quote (and whoever inscribed the quote on that plaque) will tell me that it’s “fake news”.
Dang…what kind of a world are we living in, now?
““A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.””
This is even worse: it’s even more specific about individuals’ need to accumulate their own “military supplies” so that they can be independent of others.
It makes no sense in today’s world: only the richest could accumulate effective military supplies: tanks, bombers, drones. But even they don’t do it, since they have better (less obvious) ways of making sure, the government does their bidding and screws us .
We need to arm ourselves with laws against exploitation, instead of shooting each other and ourselves with guns.
Don’t ask me to step into the mind of a psychopath. Would security fences, and video cameras have deterred this individual? I don’t know.
I do know, that increased security awareness, and appropriate technology, will help make our schools safer.
No one questions the need to have fire drills. There has not been a fatal school fire for many years. Should schools conduct security and quick-evacuation drills? Of course.
Law enforcement and uniform security guards must have procedures in place, to deal with an incident which involves an active shooter.
Charles,
Schools already have shooter security drills. They have fences. They have armed guards.
Ban the damned guns!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swords_to_ploughshares
>
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swords_to_ploughshares The United Nation has been done nothing but God did a lot and still have a lot more to do.. God is good all the time , all the time God is good because >>>>He will render judgment among the nations And set matters straight respecting many peoples. They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.
>
Q Schools already have shooter security drills. They have fences. They have armed guards.
Ban the damned guns! END Q
Would it not be more correct to state that some schools have guards, drills, and fences? Almost everyone agrees, that more can be done to improve safety at our schools.
Schools need to be prepared for natural disasters, chemical spills, and other such emergencies. Preparing for evacuations is just good common sense.
More can be done to assist the mentally ill. The alleged perpetrator in Florida had some 39 police calls at his residence. When a person goes on Facebook, and brags about being a school shooter, someone should have noticed!
I am all for reasonable restrictions on firearms, and lawful steps to keep deadly weapons out of the hands of individuals who are dangerous.
If there is a way to “ban guns”, and keep this ban, in harmony with the US constitution and the 2d amendment, I am all for it.
Congress banned assault rifles from 1994-2004.
If it was constitutional then, it is now.
We are more in agreement than you realize. I have said repeatedly, that I am for reasonable restrictions on firearms ownership. I would have no problem with re-instating a ban on weapons of this nature. Federal law bans sawed-off shotguns, and fully-automatic weapons. (see Miller v US, 1939).
If we are to have an increased level of safety , we must take the proper steps to reach this goal. Enacting just one “feel good” piece of legislation, is not going to get us there.
Mental health care, improved physical security, better spotting of problem students, proper training for school personnel, developing proper responses to emergency situations, etc. all need to be implemented.
We owe it to our nation’s children.
Most urgent: Re-enact the Congressional ban on assault rifles that was enforced from 1994-2004 and supported by Presidents Reagan, Ford, and Carter.
I’ve brought up the re-enactment of the ban on these rifles to the hardcores and their response was “the data shows that the ban showed no effect, whatsoever”.
They also claim that states with more guns have lower gun related crime rates. I sent them a Scientific American article refuting this and was told the data proves this wrong.
I’m at a loss for our how state is operating:
A) We won’t actively research gun violence because it’s too closely associated with leading to advocacy.
B) We want to give more guns to people to “harden” targets. Out of the millions of school children in the united states, and hundreds of thousands of teachers, how many people stand to be hurt by adding that many more weapons of violence to school grounds? If they are tightly secured, how can they be readily accessed to let teachers “fight back” . If teachers fight back, what happens if/when more students are readily hurt by their fighting fire with fire?
C) We have 1/3 of the world’s mass shootings yet have 5% of the world’s populations. We are number 1 in gun homicides among industrialized nations. Only impoverished nations outstrip us in gun violence.
So having the most guns doesn’t mean we have the most violence compared to poor countries with significant arms. But at what point do we ask the question about whether the number of guns has any connection to the number of deaths?
If it doesn’t, why don’t we invest money into research that might show that.
It’s ridiculous that the NRA has inserted itself into this argument with a proposal it has favored for years as being the solution.
We already have more guns per capita than any other nation. At what point does “more guns” stop being the answer???
Such a strange feeling right now, Lloyd. I’ve been on vacation in Mexico and will be back in school tomorrow.
There are a couple of NRA members in the school. Very skilled marksmen with both pistol and rifles. Responsible people who I get along with very well.
I fully expect them to approach me about being part of the armed team. I don’t own any firearms but I like to do target shooting when I visit friends in Vermont and I’m a good shot.
But there’s no way I’m going to volunteer for this. And there’s no way I’m going to support them or ANY person in ANY school in the world in this unbelievably stupid excuse for a “solution”.
I’ll be polite and respectful…but I’ll let them know my thoughts and feelings in no uncertain way. Hopefully it won’t create a divide.
Your post is spot on. I copied and pasted it to my Notes. Thanks.I use sane statements like this from people who know to give strength to my argument when dealing with the hardcores. Do you know that this one guy was telling me that the AR-15, being a civilian variation of the military versions, is more of a “varmint killing” weapon than anything else?
Is his name Jed Clampett by chance?
“Very skilled marksmen with both pistol and rifles. Responsible people ”
If they think, they should carry guns in school, they are not responsible people. They need to be unbrainwashed.
Another thing being lost in the discussion:
It’s not just schools.
Orlando night club
Las Vegas outdoor music festival
Are we going to have armed military style personnel on every corner in order to keep us “safe”?
This is insanity.
Lloyd,
Do you own any semi-automatics?
Who cares ?
We care about students , read this if you think it’s interisting .
https://represent.us/action/no-the-problem/
Lloyd Care about students and Diane care but no many more that is why the schooll sistem is like that .
I went through a bunch of things regarding my children’s , Thanks God , Thanks God Diane and Lloyd help me out with this because they care about students they don’t put money firts
Reblogged this on David R. Taylor-Thoughts on Education.
Reblogged this on The Soulful Veteran's Blog.
Lloyd no one what more facts , arguments about give weapons to teachers only you or no many can destroy those arguments, you hit the experience in bough areas ( battle field – school sistem)
I enjoyed your post and the way you expoused that give weapons to teachers will cause more casualties.
Congratulations dear Lloyd
Here is a teacher who is happy to carry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjFXB74iuaM
Trevor Noah on gun control. He suggests, among other things, moats with gun-eating sharks around schools and spikes at the school entrance with the heads of previous school shooters stuck on them as a great deterrent for an incoming shooter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQcaYYHqrUY