Trump Knew

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1. carolmalaysia says:

   July 12, 2017 at 3:10 pm

   The first video in this news article is interesting. Of course, Trump knew nothing about the contacts with Russia.
   ………..

   Trump Teased ‘Major’ News On Clinton Hours After Don Jr. Set Meeting On Russian Dirt
   Donald Trump promised a “major speech” attacking campaign rival Hillary Clinton last June, just hours after his son, Donald Trump Jr., set up a meetin…

   Read the entire article here: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-clinton-don-jr-russia_us_596562fee4b09b587d633d10

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2. Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

   July 12, 2017 at 3:12 pm

   The most complete accounting I have ever seen . It is not a smoking gun . It is a Gatling Gun, that has been fired so many times that it has melted .

   http://billmoyers.com/story/the-trump-resistance-plan-a-timeline-russia-and-president-trump/

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3. Ed Ciaccio says:

   July 12, 2017 at 3:17 pm

   Some historical context:

   Forgetting the ‘Dirty Dossier’ on Trump – Consortiumnews
   https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/10/forgetting-the-dirty-dossier-on-trump/

   Spinning Hillary: a history of America and Russia’s mutual meddling | World news | The Guardian
   https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/aug/03/spinning-hillary-a-history-of-america-and-russias-mutual-meddling

   “This isn’t even the first time the US and Russia have interfered in each other’s presidential campaigns. In a little-known quirk of post-cold war history, the 1996 re-election campaign of Putin’s mentor, Boris Yeltsin, was secretly managed by three American political consultants who on more than one occasion allegedly received direct assistance from Bill Clinton’s White House.”

   Yes, We’ve Done It Too: A History of U.S. Meddling in Other Countries’ Elections | The Lowdown | KQED News
   https://ww2.kqed.org/lowdown/2017/03/02/a-history-of-u-s-meddling-in-foreign-elections/

   Database Tracks History Of U.S. Meddling In Foreign Elections : NPR http://www.npr.org/2016/12/22/506625913/database-tracks-history-of-u-s-meddling-in-foreign-elections

   And a warning to Democrats:

   Ten Problems with Anti-Russian Obsession – Consortiumnews https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/09/ten-problems-with-anti-russian-obsession/

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   • dianeravitch says:

     July 12, 2017 at 3:21 pm

     Ed,

     Is this meant to say it is okay for Putin to choose Trump as our President?

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     • dienne77 says:

       July 12, 2017 at 4:28 pm

       Diane, please read, if nothing else, that last link, particularly points 6, 9 and 10. No one has said anything about it being “okay”. What we’ve said is first, it’s still not proven (despite constant drum-beating to the contrary, and, second, it’s distracting from what we really need to focus on, which is stopping the neoliberal/neoconservative policies that Trump is advancing (which were, in turn, plenty advanced before he even set foot in the White House).

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     • LeftCoastTeacher says:

       July 13, 2017 at 3:34 am

       I’m not condoning collusion with our traditional rival superpower, but Dienne has a point about the limitations of pursuing the Russia thing. Impeachment? That road ends with President Mike Pence. Next in line is Paul Ryan. What if Trump, Pence, and Ryan somehow were all impeached or resigned? President Orrin Hatch. After that, it’s Rex Tillerson. It’s entrancing to watch the brain wreck, I mean twain wreck, I mean tweet wreck, oy vey it’s late, the train wreck of the White House family reality show, but I wish I were seeing more in the media instead about how the Democratic Party plans to reconnect with the demos. …President Orrin Hatch. Still shivering… Living through this period of time in history is like teaching or raising adolescents: There are no easy ways to do it, and if you don’t keep graduation on your mind, you’ll go completely out of your mind. I joke. Adolescents are very easygoing and calming.

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     • Clarity says:

       July 14, 2017 at 1:20 pm

       @dienne77 and @LeftCoastTeacher. Thanks for saying so. Time and energy spent to derail the connections that make HRC and the Billary/Bush/Obama/back to post WW2 puppets for the Corporate Elite.
       Picture a tail chasing dog riding a roller coaster encased in an active ferris wheel

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   • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

     July 12, 2017 at 5:13 pm

     dienne77

     “A judge or jury may infer that Z was in the bedroom. … Circumstantial evidence is generally admissible in court unless the connection between the fact and the inference is too weak to be of help in deciding the case. Many convictions for various crimes have rested largely on circumstantial evidence.”

     But we have now gone beyond the mountain of circumstantial evidence . Not only to the admission of collusion, in this case criminal conspiracy to commit treason . None of the said admissions made voluntarily all denied till they were exposed . We have come to the point where it surrealistic to believe anything else.

     I am well aware of our history of meddling from Mossadegh to Maduro . I am well aware of our insane violation of the agreements with Gorbachev not to move NATO one inch to the east. I have stated here many times that US foreign policy has never been about what the people of any Nation desire, not about the hopes and aspirations for democracy . We are ruthless Human right abusers in the the SOBs we have supported .

     It is not the Russians who have committed a violation here. They are rational actors pursuing what they deem to be their national interest . Which happens to be the interests of of Putin and the oligarchs who surround him. National interests are always defined as the interests of the political elites who set the policies for any Nation. You and I would argue and agree that American Nation interest has been defined for quite sometime by the Corporatocracy and oligarchy that controls America, from ITT and Anaconda copper to Exxon Mobile …….

     But that is not what we are talking about here . The problem is not what the Russians have done. The problem is those Americans working with the Russians to subvert our most fundamental right. The right to free and fair elections. And Trump and the party that surrounds him from restrictions on voting rights to the collusion with a foreign hostile power, are guilty of TREASON . And for that some should be in jail for life.

     Go read the Moyers link I posted . If you can escape the conclusion of guilt . Please give me some of the drugs you are on .

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     • FLERP! says:

       July 12, 2017 at 7:33 pm

       Thank you. Few things are more annoying than the suggestion that circumstantial evidence is not evidence. It is evidence.

       And if the question is whether the Trump campaign was actively seeking assistance from Russia, this isn’t circumstantial evidence. It’s direct evidence, which is extraordinarily rare in conspiracy cases. That’s how big this story is.

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   • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

     July 12, 2017 at 7:01 pm

     Ed Ciaccio

     Robert Parry misses the whole point on the Dossier and that is that Steele was not working with a foreign hostile Government . He was working
     with individuals , most of whom are now dead . . Further keep up with the story Ed because we have gone way past Russian adoptions we now have the email chain that says the meeting was about dirt FROM THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT . Miss a day you miss a lot and Parry’s article was the day before. . Now Parry talks about Adam Schiff laying out the case based on the the Dossier well it would seem we have gone far past that original case from the email chain to the undisclosed meetings, to the request for a back door secure channel with Moscow. Here is what we don’t know. Exactly what was said at those meetings. What we do know is that immediately after that meeting there were emails released and several weeks later the plank in the Republican platform on the somewhat NEO NAZI regime in Ukraine was changed.

     If Hillary had done what Trump did and then lost the election their would be a whole lot of people sitting in Leavenworth waiting for trail. Now I would have no problem with that because if I never had to see her or Bill or Barrack or numerous neo liberal Democrats including our Congressman in the NY 3rd . I would be a happy camper.

     But that does not mean I want to see a traitor , an authoritarian demagogue , turn back the clock a hundred years on civil rights, on women’s rights, on labor and American workers,. While poisoning the American people with toxins at home and at work and putting the world on a cataclysmic path toward climate change .

     So sorry Ed Parry can go F—- himself .

     Go read the link I provided to the Moyers piece . It is not the dossier it is the totality and this goes way beyond Occam’s razor . Further I am sick of hearing how naive the Trumps are in ever case they are surrounded by long term right wing republican operatives who know exactly how the system works from Stone to Manafort to Flynn every one of them were long time operatives. Flynn our chief millatary spy head of the defense intelligence agency. Trump a graduate of U Pen. should wind up in the Pen

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   • bethree5 says:

     July 12, 2017 at 9:27 pm

     Actually, I really don’t care whether Hillary may have colluded with Russians on election outcomes to the same degree as DJTrump– & if true, would not even surprise me, as I view Dem & Rep parties’ contribution to the destruction of a thriving middle-class-dominated American democracy as [nearly] equal. What gives me great jollies is that we Dems may be able to hang this Russian monkey on the Repubs– aided by their big-mouthed hubris– & use it to win back house & senate seats & maybe the presidency.

     But what worries me is that Dems need to use the inequality stats & put their weight behind tax reform & regulations that will bring things back into balance. We need to purge the global neolibs from the Dem party & send them to Rep party where they belong– & champion income redistribution from 1% to 99%/ public goods: if we get things rebalanced, 1% will be motivated to bring profits home.

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     • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

       July 12, 2017 at 10:13 pm

       Basically what I told my NY 3rd rep the other night .

       A member of the “Problem Solvers caucus ” who voted for the Scrub act . Will not sign on to the Conyers Medicare for all bill . Voted to limit the ability of disabled peoples to sue for violation of the” peoples with disability act”. And probably is looking for a way to bring home the 2.6 trillion being stashed overseas tax free..

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     • Linda says:

       July 13, 2017 at 9:49 am

       David Brock, creator of Share Blue, recently published an article written by the site’s Senior Editor, “progressive” Kaili Joy Gray, “Youngest Dems in Congress…”. The “Youngest Dems” are going to “…help big business…” And,Gates and DFER could have written their criticism of schools.

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   • bethree5 says:

     July 12, 2017 at 10:25 pm

     RE: first cite, re: the Christopher Steele dossier, i.e., “opposition research”. Steele was originally hired by anti-Trump Republicans. When Trump won the primary, Dems took over his financial support. When Trump won the election, he finished the dossier pro bono. So it is ingenuous to slam Dems for financing partof the dossier. It was a bipartisan effort.

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4. Norwegian Filmmaker says:

   July 12, 2017 at 3:42 pm

   Diane,

   Rather than just put out a titillating tweet, which can affect one’s credibility. Why not put out the article in the NYT that conforms that Junior met with the the Russian lawyer? There is, I believe, an e-mail that strengthens the case of Russian interference with the cooperation of Trump.

   Please don’t cheapen yourself with a simple little Twitter. You will always be better than that.

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   • FLERP! says:

     July 12, 2017 at 5:21 pm

     I think Diane’s post assumes the reader is already familiar with the NY Times story.

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5. sandman1946 says:

   July 12, 2017 at 3:49 pm

   I agree he knew about the meeting.  Hopefully, they will find more smoking guns in the near future.

   Walter “Sandy” Silvers

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   • dianeravitch says:

     July 12, 2017 at 4:27 pm

     Don Jr. emails are not a smoking gun.
     They are the gun, the bullets, and the victim.

     For fun, go to Twitter and check out #DonJrchildrensbooks

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     • Duane E Swacker says:

       July 12, 2017 at 4:39 pm

       I thought you were anti-gun, Diane?? 🙂

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6. FLERP! says:

   July 12, 2017 at 5:20 pm

   We now know for certain that the highest-level members of Trump’s campaign (1) were told as early as June 2016 that the Russian government supported Trump’s candidacy and had obtained sensitive information that would incriminate Hillary Clinton, (2) were very enthusiastic about the prospect of obtaining that information, and (3) took at least one meeting with someone they were told was an agent or representative of the Russian government in an effort to obtain the information. Did they obtain that information at this meeting? Probably not. Did they ultimately obtain similar information and/or collude with foreign nations to obtain or disseminate it? We don’t know that. But what we know so far is pretty astonishing.

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7. carolmalaysia says:

   July 12, 2017 at 5:35 pm

   I just received this email from my Senator Joe Donnelly (D) of Indiana:

   Thank you for taking the time to contact me about Russian attempts to influence the 2016 elections and undermine faith in our democratic institutions. Like you, I believe we need a fair and thorough investigation into Russian interference in our democracy.

   As you may know, in January 2017, U.S. intelligence agencies released a report confirming that Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered a multi-pronged campaign to undermine public faith in our democratic system by discrediting Secretary Hillary Clinton and helping Donald Trump when possible during the 2016 elections. The unclassified version of the report states that Russian intelligence services used cyber operations along with traditional and social media in an attempt to influence the elections and undermine the U.S. democratic process. On March 20, 2017, FBI Director James Comey testified before the House Intelligence Committee and confirmed that the FBI is conducting an investigation into whether Russian officials coordinated their efforts with individuals or organizations with ties to the Trump campaign.

   On May 9, 2017, President Trump removed Director Comey from his position as Director of the FBI. The White House stated that Director Comey was dismissed at the recommendation of Department of Justice (DOJ) officials who were unsatisfied with his handling of the investigation into Hillary Clinton’s use of a private email server. President Trump later stated that he had planned to fire Director Comey regardless of the Justice Department’s recommendation, and he reportedly told Russian officials that firing Comey had “taken off” pressure he faced due to the investigation into his campaign. On June 8, 2017, Director Comey testified before the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence about the circumstances surrounding his dismissal.

   On May 17, 2017, Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein appointed former FBI Director Robert Mueller as special counsel to oversee the investigation into possible coordination between Russian officials and individuals associated with the Trump campaign. As special counsel, Mueller will operate independently from the day-to-day supervision of Justice Department officials, can request staff and resources, and has the authority to prosecute federal crimes discovered in the course of the investigation.

   There are questions about the President’s decision to dismiss Director Comey while he was at the center of one of the most important FBI investigations in recent memory. I am pleased that DOJ has named a special counsel to lead a comprehensive investigation, and I trust that Mr. Mueller will follow the facts wherever they lead to ensure a thorough and independent review going forward. There are still many questions regarding Russia’s interference in our election, and I will continue to closely follow developments in both this investigation and the review being led by the Senate Intelligence Committee until the American people have the answers they deserve.

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8. Therlo says:

   July 12, 2017 at 5:47 pm

   …and NOW, Trump is posting, or tweeting, or leaking, or posturing, that Putin REALLY wanted Clinton to win. Day is night, up is down – pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Amazing.

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   • ciedie aech says:

     July 13, 2017 at 1:23 pm

     Perfect metaphor: Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain. 🙂

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9. Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

   July 12, 2017 at 7:12 pm

   dianeravitch

   I must read slow because it took me about an hour to go through the time line on Moyers
   I will be in front of Trump tower on Saturday .

   https://refusefascism.org/2017/06/09/july-15-2017-in-cities-across-the-country-demonstrate/

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   • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

     July 12, 2017 at 7:40 pm

     And each was a short bullet point

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10. Lloyd Lofthouse says:

    July 12, 2017 at 8:58 pm

    I think we should support a hashtag for Trump to use on Twitter and other sites

    #FakePresidenTrump

    And every time he Tweets about the Fake Media, we counterattack with that hashtag.

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11. Lea S says:

    July 12, 2017 at 9:15 pm

    Read what Matt Vespa wrote on the ultra-conservative “fake news” website Townhall. According to Vespa, Don Jr. Did nothing illegal. No wonder so many Trump supporters do not know what is really going on. Townhall and HotAir are part of Koch political machine echo chamber. Many republican talking points are repeated almost word-for-word from these websites.

    https://m.townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2017/07/12/lawyer-trump-jr-broke-no-laws-foreign-nationals-can-voluntarily-share-opposition-research-n2353713

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    • bethree5 says:

      July 12, 2017 at 9:48 pm

      The very legal parsing & speculation at that link shows they are dancing around legal hypotheses that might be presented in court– & evades the political ramifications of actually being brought to court.

      Meanwhile on the floor of house & senate, many stalwart Repubs are outraged by the DJTJr mtg & tweets, & are speaking out, suggesting that a Repub rift may finally emerge sufficient to undermine congressional support of POTUS.

      As for me, I just keep my ear to the ground via CSPAN’s 365-day/yr call-in show ‘Washington Journal’. I am noticing a turning-pt among Repubs from ‘give Trump a chance’ to ‘sorry I voted for him’– mostly on account of healthcare bill, but some re: Russian infl on campaign.

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    • Lloyd Lofthouse says:

      July 12, 2017 at 9:49 pm

      “Many Republican talking points are repeated almost word-for-word from these websites.”

      Those talking points originated with ALEC and the Koch brothers. Once the elected Koch minions start spreading those talking points, that’s when they are repeated and alternative facts are created to support the confirmation bias of their easy to fool supporters that have swallowed all this swill by the ton.

      Once you have consumed this poison long enough, there is little chance of ever turning back.

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      • Lea S says:

        July 12, 2017 at 10:04 pm

        Exactly. I can stand only so much of the nonsense printed on Townhall. Mainly, I’m curious about how the far-right voters are spinning current events. Townhall and Hot Air items are poorly written and fail to site sources and facts to support their opinions. It’s just one narrow-minded, simplistically reasoned opinion puff piece after another.

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      • Lloyd Lofthouse says:

        July 12, 2017 at 10:23 pm

        An addict, a gambler, alcoholic or drug addict, that doesn’t want to change, can justify their habit repeatedly. That’s why it is well known that there is no way to get an addict to stop unless they admit they are an addict and want to stop and even then it often isn’t easy.

        Trump’s rabid supporters are addicts. They are addicted to Trump and his horrid behavior. He has hypnotized them with his P. T. Barnum con game. There is a lot of truth to the old sayhing that there’s a sucker born every minute.

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      • Lea S says:

        July 12, 2017 at 10:44 pm

        True. Trumpanistas are addicted to the empty spectacle of bread and circuses….Sad!

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      • Lloyd Lofthouse says:

        July 12, 2017 at 10:53 pm

        Tragic for everyone else.

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      • Linda says:

        July 13, 2017 at 9:53 am

        In answer to the question about how the info. is being spun by the right wing- “faith leaders” went to the Oval Office for a photo op “putting their hands” on Trump in prayer and support.

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      • Lloyd Lofthouse says:

        July 13, 2017 at 12:29 pm

        Were those Fake faith healers from the Extreme Christian Right (described in the Bible as false prophets) that wants to fulfill all the prophecies that signal the apocalypse is here?

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    • dianeravitch says:

      July 12, 2017 at 11:20 pm

      Trump supporters talking point: “But Hillary…”

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12. Wait , What? says:

    July 13, 2017 at 12:12 am

    Please – go up about 10,000 feet (or see the entire 12 months or 6 months).
    See the totality of the lies, exaggerations, demeaning of people, bullying, disrespect, self-serving, baiting, and obsessions, etc. –

    Everyone (media, us, everyone but T’s base) gets hyped up understandably about each incident which is about one new one a day.

    BUT – where is the CUMULATIVE effect and the outrage over what this person has done to this country, to the reputation of this country, to decency, to integrity of the office, and to individuals and humanity?

    Why isn’t Congress – dems and gop – outraged?

    Why aren’t GOP congressmen (yes, men) being challenged for being silent and obedient? (yes – if Obama did any one of these things GOP would go ballistic. T has done hundreds of these things and it’s just another inning forgotten in a never ending ball game.

    We are being lulled into comfortable daze of “ah – this one will get him” instead of seeing the magnitude of harm he has done.

    Yes – liberal perspective here – and disagreed with much / most of Reagan, Bush, and Bush – – but they never behaved like this. They never disrespected allies and baited enemies. They never created scapegoats and discredited media or anyone who disagreed with them.

    When is enough enough of saying “when is enough enough?”

    Bombard Congress to do their job of checks and balances instead of this complicity to a dictator’s M.O.

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    • dianeravitch says:

      July 13, 2017 at 12:27 am

      Thank you.

      Hard to believe GOP elected s continue to defend him. To say that Don Jr was naive. The family is without decency, honor, patriotism, dignity, honesty. We are an international laughing stock.

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    • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

      July 13, 2017 at 6:35 am

      Wait , What?

      You are not looking at the totality . The Trump base was not created by Trump . It is a fifty year Republican project.

      Nixon’s Southern Strategy .
      Nixon’s Plumbers units
      Nixon’s secrete war in Cambodia… …. .
      Nixon’s criminal overthrow of Allende

      Reagan’s Welfare Queens
      Reagan’s Iran Contra affair. including sabotaging the hostage release.
      Reagan’s lead role in assaulting unions.

      Bush pardons nine.

      Bush / Cheney . What intelligence failure? Could anything be more Trumpian than the manipulation of the evidence of weapons of mass destruction by Cheney .The outing of Valarie Plame Wilson .
      Causing the deaths of 3,000 American boys and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis.
      ,Voter disenfranchisement in Florida a precursor for what was to come
      Swift Boating of John Kerry .

      The big picture Trump is the Republican Party or there would be more opposition to him from that party’s leadership. . He is the culmination of their world view dating back to Nixon. A willingness to say and do anything to maintain or ascertain power. To use demagoguery appealing to the worst in us.

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      • Joel Herman (@jwherman11) says:

        July 13, 2017 at 7:13 am

        Secret / love that edit button

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      • Abigail Shure says:

        July 13, 2017 at 12:13 pm

        The Democrats could shoulder their fair share of responsibility for having no message and catering to those with deep pockets.

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    • Norwegian Filmmaker says:

      July 13, 2017 at 8:04 am

      This is the biggest immediate problem: that all the pols up on Capitol Hill think it’s okay to not say anything or not say much of anything about Trump’s and his family’s behavior.

      This is truly the LOWEST point this federal government has sunk to. There are few exceptions on either side of the aisle . . .

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    • Norwegian Filmmaker says:

      July 13, 2017 at 8:08 am

      I mean, if Trump were caught stabbing someone to death with footage of him pulling the knife out of the victim’s body and declaring, “I’m glad I killed you, you bastard! You deserved it!”, then his PR people’s response to the public would be, “The only wrongful thing there is that this very private affair got leaked to the media! You guys are the problem! The President is just a victim of biased journalism and the liberal media!”

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13. carolmalaysia says:

    July 13, 2017 at 10:07 am

    There is a video of a BBC reporter interviewing Trump supporters. Interesting viewpoint. (Ugh.) The Orange Idiot calls everything ‘fantastic’. It’s one of his few vocabulary words.

    Trump Russia claims: Mood in the White House is ‘fantastic’

    President Donald Trump says the mood in the White House is “fantastic” despite intense scrutiny of his campaign’s alleged dealings with Russia.

    He told Reuters the administration was “functioning beautifully”.

    The president also defended his son, who it has emerged met a Russian lawyer during the election campaign.

    US media describe the White House as being in chaos over the story, with a Trump ally calling it a “Category 5 hurricane”, the Washington Post said….

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40590094

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    • dianeravitch says:

      July 13, 2017 at 10:18 am

      Hmmm. Hundreds of high-level jobs are still not filled. The State Department is a ghost village but it doesn’t matter because Jared Kushner is in charge of foreign policy.

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      • carolmalaysia says:

        July 13, 2017 at 10:22 am

        It doesn’t matter how qualified anyone is. The only thing that counts is ‘loyalty’. How disgusting to see his cabinet individually bow to our great leader. How do they live with themselves?

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14. carolmalaysia says:

    July 13, 2017 at 10:53 am

    Here is an article written by journalist Nicholas Kristof. When will Kushner solve all the problems of the Middle East and reorganize the whole state department? It’s amazing how much ability this fellow has. (I’m being sarcastic.)

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/

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    • carolmalaysia says:

      July 13, 2017 at 10:55 am

      It didn’t come through. The headline is “All Roads Now Lead to Kushner.”

      Try this:

      Or, copy and paste this URL into your browser: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/13/opinion/kushner-donald-trump-jr-emails.html?emc=eta1

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      • Abigail Shure says:

        July 13, 2017 at 11:58 am

        Thanks Carol!

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