Let’s begin with the stipulation that the lists of “America’s Best High Schools” based on test scores or AP coursetaking encourage schools to game the system and are invalid on their face.
Then, congratulations to Gary Rubinstein! He not only demonstrated that New York City’s KIPP high school gamed the rankings by U.S. News & World Report, but the magazine noticed his critique, decided Gary was right, and dropped that KIPP school from its list.
Gary wrote:
“U.S. News and World Report publishes an annual list of the best high schools based on a metric involving mostly AP tests. Two months ago I noticed something strange when examining the data for a KIPP high school in New York that was ranked 29th in the country and 4th in the state on this list. Though there is just one KIPP high school in New York, there were four KIPP high schools in the rankings. These schools were actually middle schools. One of those schools had 100% of their students passing an AP while the other three had 0%. The only logical explanation for this is that KIPP manipulated their rosters, assigning kids who passed APs to one ‘school’ and kids who didn’t to the other three ‘schools’ even though they were all just part of one high school.”
He now wonders whether all the publications that hailed KIPP’s success will print the correction: Rupert Murdoch’s New York Post; Campbell Brown’s The 74; and the National Review.
Gary writes:
“In my years of blogging and uncovering things like this, this is a nice tangible ‘victory.’ I’m pretty sure that if I had never discovered this discrepancy, this correction would have not happened. KIPP had done the same thing with this school for a few years and have surely been using it in fund raising materials and maybe even grants. In the scheme of things it is a pretty small victory but still worth feeling good about.”
Thank you, Gary. You are a hero of the Resistance to corporate reform. You most certainly belong on the Honor Roll.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
A very worthy effort without which many of us — certainly myself — would be unaware! A huge thanks to Gary for his ingenious reporting, and a huge thanks to Diane for the megaphone.
Now all we need is for someone to convince USNews their ranking is silly.
Good one, Roy. I AGREE totally. Rankings are mostly for parents. Look at Harvard and Kushner.
As posted earlier, Kushner was a mediocre student in high school. His father donate over $2 million to Harvard, and miraculously Jared won admission, even as better qualified students at his high school were rejected. The story appears in a book and an article by Daniel Golden about rigging admissions to the Ivy League.
I learned from a man tiling a bathroom that once one tile is loose it weakens the whole tiled wall…and they all start to go! Well one Kipp “tile” is loose and may the others fall like dominoes! Hats off to Rubinstein because he is an individual whose background enables him to garner attention and he uses this platform SO WISELY. Now if the public-at-large will begin to question the “corporate ed reform” as we who teach in public schools always do!
“Loose Rankings”
Tiles are loose —
And so are screws
Ranking use
We should refuse
What if all who would fight test-score reform quit validating the ranking game…
The game is on with the rankings, whether you like it or not.
We have to find a way to show what a fraud it is.
The only thing worse than loose tiles is loose screws.
And deformers seem to have a lot of both.
LOOSE SCREWS … NICE ONE, SomeDAM poet.
Any market based system may result in schools trying to manipulate their status in the rankings when the rankings equal money in the bank. Jersey Jazzman constantly blows holes in all the self-proclaimed “miracles,” that generally occur by cherry picking data and ignoring the negatives like attrition rates. Rankings are market based politically and economically motivated theater.
Yes, indeed. Kudos to Gary R!
When it comes to the heavyweights of corporate education reform, there are powerful disincentives to be accurate and ethical in the use of numbers & stats, and even more powerful incentives to make the numbers & stats do a danse macabre to their tune.
And just what does a “danse macabre” have to do with the US version of GERM? A late-medieval allegory on the universality of death—and referencing the 19th century French composer Camille Saint-Saëns—leads rheeally naturally to the universality of $tudent $ucce$$ in the minds and hearts of those promoting, selling, mandating and profiting off of charter chains and vouchers and “personalized” CBE and the like.
But, but, but, aren’t there limits to all this? When a very old and very dead and very Greek guy isn’t available, a very old and very dead and very Roman guy will do:
“For greed all nature is too little.” [Lucius Annaeus Seneca]
As true today as it was two millennia ago.
😎
This is great news for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is that evidence still has value and credibility, and is in ascendance in this situation over public relations. Congratulations and thank you Gary Rubinstein.
When Gary went to KIPP’s own web site he found the relevant data readily available in a form he considered accurate.
“Though there is no state report card for KIPP NYC College Prep, the school has one on their website for the 2014-2015 school year on which the U.S. News ratings were based.
“Conveniently, at the bottom of that report card are the true numbers for their AP participation and AP passing rate.”
But when Gary went to NY government sources, he quickly became baffled:
“Why the students are still ‘officially’ in their middle schools is a mystery to me and why there is not report card for the KIPP high school is also pretty baffling.”
You can try yourself to navigate a search for “KIPP” here:
http://schools.nyc.gov/Accountability/tools/report/default.htm
and here
http://schoolqualityreports.nyc/reports/school_quality_guide.html
and perhaps join in Gary’s bafflement.
Baffled, Gary speculated:
“Now someone could say that maybe KIPP had nothing to do with this, that the New York City Department of Education supplies the data to The College Board and since that data makes it seem like the four middle schools also house high schools, the AP would treat them as four different high schools rather than one school, so there may not be any attempt to mislead by KIPP….
“No, it is more likely ”
And on the basis of his speculation, which I found provocative but unpersuasive, he accused. And then, without further evidence, blithely convicted:
“KIPP had done the same thing with this school for a few years and have surely been using it in fund raising materials and maybe even grants. ”
Never so far as I can tell did he make inquiry of KIPP or US News & World Report.
Stephen B Ronan. You wrote: “Never so far as I can tell did he (Gary) make inquiry of KIPP or US News & World Report.
But US News and World Report took Gary’s analysis seriously. That matters.
KIPP seems to be silent. That matters too.
If you think that Gary’s conclusions are “unpersuasive” a polite word for “wrong” and that he “blithely convicted” KIPP
then I suggest you seek the answers you want from KIPP and US News and World Report,
Ask those sources yourself, do the additional research work and report back.
Bravo for your suggestion, Guru Laura H. Chapman.
I am second to your suggestion.
IMHO, any reader in this forum needs to be serious with facts or true experiment in order to argue or to against all conscientious veteran educators like Gary Rubinstein, especially Guru Laura H. Chapman…
and mostly Dr. Ravitch.
Your secret admirer,
May king
Laura: “But US News and World Report took Gary’s analysis seriously. That matters.”
Where is your evidence that US News and World Report corrected the mistake due to Gary’s analysis? It’s a plausible hypothesis, very possibly true, but without any proof provided by all those merrily leaping to conclusions. Gary himself seemed not to even think it worth notifying them: “I wrote a post about this and some people suggested I somehow report this to US News and World Report. I didn’t want to get into a wild goose chase about this. I didn’t think that US News and World Report really cared if their metric had been gamed or not.”
Laura: “If you think that Gary’s conclusions are ‘unpersuasive’ a polite word for ‘wrong’ and that he ‘blithely convicted’ KIPP then I suggest you seek the answers you want from KIPP and US News and World Report”
Yikes, Laura. “Unpersuasive” and “wrong” are not synonomous, and one is not a polite word for the other.
Laura: “Ask those sources yourself, do the additional research work and report back.”
I think it’s rather more incumbent on those making serious accusations, and summarily convicting, and celebrating on the sidelines, to buttress their arguments with evidence rather than a skeptical spectator to such all-too-frequent shenanigans.
But nevertheless, as it happens, prior to Diane’s posting this morning, I did in fact contact someone closely familiar with KIPP’s operations in NY who assured me that KIPP didn’t provide incorrect data, much less try to deceive anyone.
I don’t take that as utterly conclusive, just the person’s honest understanding. I do think it unlikely there was any high-level conspiracy within KIPP. Perhaps someone erred inputting data somewhere. Perhaps even someone connected with KIPP, but postings like the messages we see here add smoke to Gary’s fuel rather than shed light.
Have you yourself tried to locate the correct info for NYC KIPP high school(s) on New York government web sites? Good luck with that.
Stephen,
You claim that Gary had no impact on US News’ decision to kick KIPP off its “best” high schools list. We don’t know whether he did or not. What we do know is that Gary was right. US News kicked KIPP off the list.
Surely they were aware of Gary’s critique because it was reposted here. Believe it or not, many journalists read this blog.
So, are you quibbling that there’s no definitive connection between Rubenstein’s analysis and the US News change, or are you defending the integrity of the US News & World Report school rankings?
And what’s your stake in this?
democracy: “So, are you quibbling that there’s no definitive connection between Rubenstein’s analysis and the US News change,”
I am indeed quibbling that there’s no definitive connection between Rubinstein’s analysis and the US News change. And making a broader point that far too many merrily leap to convenient definitive conclusions based on insufficient evidence where the leap suits their predilections. For example, even smart folks whom I respect like Gary and Jazzman for years have supposedly debunked charter successes based in substantial part on silly superficial glances at the number of students in schools’ starting class one year and graduating class several years later, claiming that the differential is a proper measure of students who have been squeezed out of the charter school or abandoned it. And then such sloppiness has been roundly applauded in environments like this.
In this case, I think it is a quite likely possibility that Gary finding the correct information on KIPP’s own web site and presenting it to us (with Diane’s help) served a vital role in making US News aware of that one among the dozens of errors that they have since corrected. Some private speculation that KIPP had perhaps deliberately engineered the US News error for insidious purposes would have been justified and could have been followed up with some investigative reporting. My dad who wrote for the NY Times for dozens of years might well have picked up the phone and started making calls. Instead we see plausible speculation swiftly descend into unwarranted premature conclusions celebrated unquestioningly.
democracy: “And what’s your stake in this?”
An unending search for the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Well okay, okay, “unending” is hyperbole. And untruthful.
“My dad, who wrote for The NY Times … might well have picked up the phone and started making calls”
And KIPP could have told your dad that unlike public schools they have no obligation to reply or be transparent – which is why the NAACP has called for a moratorium.
I have read your posts and your only obligation is to defend charter schools.
Got to go lists? Stephen B. Ronan says you have no proof that they weren’t the anomaly the offending charter claimed. Suspending 20% of the kindergarten and first graders? Stephen says you have no proof every one of those non – white kids wasn’t as violent as the charter claimed. Disappearing children? Stephen says you have no proof their families didn’t voluntarily leave the richest and best performing school because they dislike rich high performing schools. And Stephen will fight transparency to make sure you can’t get the proof. Truly absurd this pro charter hack would criticize real research.
“Got to go lists? Stephen B. Ronan says you have no proof that they weren’t the anomaly the offending charter claimed. Suspending 20% of the kindergarten and first graders? Stephen says you have no proof every one of those non – white kids wasn’t as violent as the charter claimed. Disappearing children? Stephen says you have no proof their families didn’t voluntarily leave the richest and best performing school because they dislike rich high performing schools. And Stephen will fight transparency to make sure you can’t get the proof.”
Kindly provide links or other evidence to substantiate these assertions. Thanks.
NYC public school parent, do not let Ronan take charge of the conversation. Ronan will have you running in circles as you waste time to answer those challenges, and then Ronan will start over again asking more questions to send in back to wasting time.
Charter Schools Propping Up the School-to-Prison Pipeline – U.S. News
“Charter schools suspend students at a much higher rate than non-charter schools, some of which have suspension rates north of 70 percent. But a disproportionate amount of those suspensions fall on black students, who are four times more likely to be suspended than white students, and students with disabilities, who are twice as likely to be suspended as their non-disabled peers.” …
“One finding in particular left the researchers suspicious: More than 17 percent of all secondary-level charter schools suspended no students, they found, whereas for non-charters, just over 8 percent of secondary schools suspended zero students.
“This raises questions about whether charter schools may be violating civil rights law by not reporting the data on whom they exclude from school on disciplinary grounds,” the researchers wrote.
https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-03-17/study-charter-schools-suspend-more-black-students-disabled-students
Ah, so Lloyd wishes for us to all turn the page. Bid a wistful goodbye to Rubinstein’s ruminations, and start to focus on “a blistering new analysis from researchers at the Center for Civil Rights Remedies at the University of California, Los Angeles.” (March 2016).
May we skip ahead just a little bit? There’s an even much newer blistering analysis from that Dan Losen et al team at the Center for Civil Rights Remedies (March 2017): “Suspended Education in Massachusetts” http://schottfoundation.org/report/suspended-education-massachusetts
Here’s the note I sent to Dan after starting to read it:
Hi Dan,
I saw Jennifer Berkshire’s reference to your Center’s report: “Suspended Education in Massachusetts”.
I look forward to perusing it further, but got stalled by the second sentence of the first paragraph of the Introduction, which states: “Scholars have found that missing three or more days of school in the fourth grade predicts a reduction in reading achievement by one full grade level on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (Ginsburg, Jordan, & Chang, 2014). ”
That seems counter-intuitive. Checking what those scholars wrote, I see: “Low-income fourth graders with poor attendance scored 10 points (equivalent to one grade on the NAEP scale) lower than those with perfect attendance.” (pg 4)
On page 2, they had provided this definition of poor attendance: “Poor Attendance in NAEP: Missing 3 or more days in the month before the assessment.” So it seems that they were not comparing those who missed three or more days of school in the entire fourth grade with the average student, or all those with relatively good attendance, but insteand comparing those who missed three or more days in the single month before the NAEP with those who had perfect attendance for that month.
As they elaborate on page 3: “About one in five students in both fourth and eighth grade reported missing three or more days in the month before the test. If that pattern persisted all year, the students would have missed 27 days or about 15 percent of the school year. About 3 percent of students missed 10 or more days in the prior month, a level of absenteeism associated with the weakest scores.”
Best wishes,
– Stephen
Stephen,
I don’t understand why your knickers are twisted because Gary Rubinstein spotted the KIPP misreporting of data, and US News kicked KIPP NYC off its list of “best” high schools.
What are you challenging? I don’t understand. Gary was correct. US News removed KIPP.
What am I missing?
Diane, Gary told us that he spotted correct data about KIPP publicly available on KIPP’s web site and contrasted that with different, incorrect data concerning KIPP on the US News & World Report web site.
He then speculated that the error on the US News site was somehow insidiously insinuated there by KIPP via some inchoate nefarious scheme apparently involving somehow routing false information to US News via the NY State Education Dep’t (and perhaps the College Board?).
Never did Gary claim to have actually “spotted the KIPP misreporting of data”. He envisioned the possibility through a thick haze of smoke. He provided no convincing proof that KIPP was responsible for the US News error. He just at some point decided to up his speculative rhetoric to defamatory conclusive statements. And folks here bought it, hook, line and sinker. Excuse my discombobulated knickers… I’m strenuously attempting a Heimlich maneuver on the lot of ya.
Diane: “What am I missing?”
What are you missing? You are missing persuasive proof from Gary that his allegations about KIPP malfeasance are true. Perhaps they are. May we wait for serious evidence before arriving at a verdict?
Stephen Ronan: “Gary and Jazzman for years have supposedly debunked charter successes based in substantial part on silly superficial glances at the number of students in schools’ starting class one year and graduating class several years later, claiming that the differential is a proper measure of students who have been squeezed out of the charter school or abandoned it.”
So, Stephen, when this happens at a charter school, or a KIPP school, where did the missing students go?
“where did the missing students go?”
Many of them are in fact not actually missing. Jazzman and I had an interchange on the subject last fall…
http://jerseyjazzman.blogspot.com/2016/09/massachusetts-charter-schools-and-their.html
http://jerseyjazzman.blogspot.com/2016/10/charter-school-attrition-in-ma-reader.html
http://jerseyjazzman.blogspot.com/2016/10/more-about-attrition-rates-in-boston.html
With my concluding thoughts expressed at the end of the comment section of that last piece.
In his orginal piece, Jazzman had written stuff like: “In the case of City on a Hill [COAH]… their 2011 freshman class shrank by more than half by the time they were seniors. That is a remarkable difference compared to BPS.
The whole interchange is rather lengthy, and you may find this segment below from my concluding comments adequately answers your question.
I previously shared with you the most recently available COAH retention data:
9th: 27.8%
10th: 3.3%
11th: 3.2%
12th: 7.4%
http://www.doe.mass.edu/infoservices/reports/retention/
So, clearly, a large portion of the decline in enrollment between 9th and 12th grade is indeed caused by front-loaded retention. And, also clearly, that doesn’t explain all of it. After some years with 100 newly enrolled 9th graders each year, if retention rates like those cited above were the only factor, I think we might at some point see enrollment along these lines:
9th: 138 students;
10th: 103
11th: 103
12th: 107
So, to achieve a fuller understanding of the enrollment decline, we would best move on to other DESE data, and learn:
COAH had a zero percent dropout rate:
http://profiles.doe.mass.edu/dropout/default.aspx?orgcode=04370505&orgtypecode=6&leftNavId=15627&
8.4% summer attrition rate:
http://profiles.doe.mass.edu/attrition/default.aspx?orgcode=04370505&fycode=2015&orgtypecode=6&
and
91.8% school year stability rate:
http://profiles.doe.mass.edu/mobility/default.aspx?orgcode=04370505&fycode=2015&orgtypecode=6&
So, it appears that throughout the entire summer and school year, COAH does better on every one of those measures than is typically the case for traditional public schools in the same community. COAH was the school you originally cited as a prime example of Commonwealth charter schools losing students. Rather than a poster child for attrition loss aimed at ridding schools of poor performers, COAH is perhaps instead a poster child for the practice of callously dumping high perfomers into college after four years, while keeping the academically less accomplished students close at hand, for at least one additional year.
Stephen Ronan,
Are you now acknowledging that if it is true that the highest performing charter school chain in NY state suspended 20% of its young students in a school with almost no white students then you agree with me that their excuse that every one of those young children was acting out violently was a lie?
Once you confirm that I will show you links.
Just calling your bluff. Once you admit that any charter school claiming 20% or even 10% of their 5 and 6 year old children are violent is lying and its oversight is non- existent, then I am happy to provide proof.
But if you are going to simply tell me that I should take a white person’s characterization of non- white kids as true because you are inclined to believe white charter operators over low income parents whose children you insist must be violent, then why should I bother? You already made it clear that you believe in the violent nature of so many non white charter students. I don’t. Let’s just agree to disagree on that.
If you acknowledge how outrageously racist it would be for a charter CEO to make such a dishonest claim about the number of violent kindergarten children first, I will post a link. If you believe such a claim could be true, your racism is quite clear so my link would be irrelevant.
NYC public school parent: “Are you now acknowledging that if it is true…”
Actually, I’m sitting here with my hands if not folded at least closely adjacent, tracking Lloyd’s focus on the Center for Civil Rights Remedies’ blistering report on suspensions.
I’m reminded that it compared charter schools to pretty much all traditional public schools throughout the United States.
Stretching one hand skyward momentarily, I seek to ask, as I have asked before:
“Does anybody here think that that is a more appropriate methodology than comparing each charter school with traditional public schools in the same general locale?”
According to a report authored by Nat Malkus, who used the latter approach:
“Discipline rates are another important measure on which to compare charters and TPSs because charter opponents have argued that charters use severe disciplinary practices to “push out” undesirable students. In fact, a report by The Center for Civil Rights Remedies used the very same data as in Figure 8 and found that charters suspend students at higher rates than TPSs do. That pattern appears when charters are compared with all TPSs; however, the pattern of discipline is much more similar between charters and their neighboring public schools, casting doubt on whether charter discipline is disproportionate.
[…]
“Suspensions. Again, about half of charters were in the mid-range for suspension rates, compared to 70 percent of reference TPSs. The percentage of charters that had the highest rank was quite close to that of reference TPSs (Figure 24). In contrast, charters were the lowest ranked in terms of suspensions twice as often as reference TPSs, casting significant doubt on the frequent assertion that charter schools broadly use excessive discipline procedures.
[…]
“On the other hand, charter discipline practices are a clear example of a myth that these analyses persuasively discredit. Recently, a report by UCLA’s Center for Civil Rights Remedies used oversimplified comparisons that supported the notion that charters have higher rates of out-of-school suspension.30 Press coverage used pejorative phrases such as “the charter sneak attack” and the “school-to-prison pipeline” to describe the findings and further propagate this myth.31 Appropriate and balanced methodological critiques of the report will only do so much to push back on such generalizations.32
[…]
“These analyses, using the very same data but more careful comparisons, clearly show that the reverse is true for most charter schools. Compared to their neighboring TPSs, more charters have lower suspension rates than reference TPSs. Unbridled discipline policies are problematic in any school, but the idea that charter schools suspend students more than traditional public schools do is a myth.”
Click to access Differences-on-balance.pdf
Stephen,
You blanketed this Blog with pro-charter commentary before the vote on Question 2 in Massachusetts last fall. You lost overwhelmingly, was it 62%-38%. The only districts that voted for more charters were wealthy ones that felt sure the charters would not be in their communities.
Now you are back with the pro-charter propaganda.
Please give it a rest. You know how I feel about charters: they should be controlled by the elected board, should be subject to all the same laws as public schools, should be financially transparent, should have salary caps, should be unionized, should enroll kids that can’t make it in the public schools.
I don’t want to waste my time arguing with you. You don’t persuade me, and I doubt you persuade anyone else.
Oh, dear Diane…
I can imagine a Trump supporter telling you you lost, give up, go away, hush yourself.
And I can imagine your reaction. Have seen it here in practice.
As the Elizabeth Warren bumper sticker I was handed at a recent Democratic party convention stated:
“Neverthess, she persisted.”
In that respect, you inspire emulation.
Thanks, Stephen. With DeVos and Trump championing school choice, charter supporters are in the catbird seat. Plus you have a Republican governor and a Republican state board in Massachusetts. All you lack is public support.
I did not suggest you stop advocating for charter schools. I did suggest you stop pestering me and my readers with pro-charter advocacy. First, because it wastes your time; second, because it wastes my time; third, because it is like selling ice at the North Pole or coal to Newcastle. Wrong place.
Ah, please think through those analogies, Dr. Ravitch. Is what I’m selling what’s already readily found here? May I suggest as a substitute: “Like selling ice in hell”?
I accept your analogy but would reverse it.
Like selling the Devil’s handiwork in heaven
Hah! Nicely done. Touché
Even if retentions are front-loaded,those students are still there, still in the system. And as long as they stay in the system, they’ll show up, at some point. They don’t just disappear completely.
Unless, of course, they do.
Stephen B. Ronan,
Find me one study about KINDERGRTEN suspensions in public schools that are 20% high.
How typical of your kind to cite public school suspensions of much older students. Anything to mislead in that Trump- liike way you have.
I called your bluff and you sided with the white lady who claims 20% of the kindergarten and first grade children with the most motivated parents in NYC in one of her charter schools are violent. I’m sure the fact it was a charter with almost no white students had nothing to do with your determination to believe so many 5 year olds do violent things all the time. I’m sure if those were white middle class kids you’d also believe it and it’s just a lucky coincidence that the affluent white kindergarten children in that charter chain don’t get suspended at such high rates.
Could you be more racist, Stephen? You have some chutzpah attacking the NAACP for questioning a charter leader who claims 20% of her students are violent AT AGE 6 and 7!! You are so certain it is true because of the trust you have in Trump’s favorite charter leader and the disgust you have for 6 year old at-risk children. And you could not provide a bit of proof that suspension rates in public kindergartens and first grades are that high. Shame on you trying to convince me to stop questioning a charter leader happy to use racism to get away with saying things that white folks like you never question. So many violent 5 year olds what can she do but suspend them? Especially knowing Stephen Ronan has her back working hard to convince Americans that so many non- white 5 year olds are violent and deserved it. You certainly do work hard to tell America that. Shame on you.
I continue to caution you about extrapolating what you believe about a single charter school chain to most or all other charters nationwide.
A little more data for you to chew on while you reflect on that:
Table 2: School Characteristics: City of Chicago in 2012-2013 which includes K-8 schools
Expulsions per 1000 students
Traditional public schools: .06
Charter schools: .68
Suspensions per 1000 students
Traditional public schools: 24
Charter schools: 1
https://www1.law.umn.edu/uploads/e9/5d/e95d8af0fa0673c39aac013df6d3d56d/Chicago-Charters-FINAL.pdf (Page 13/30)
And this, largely taken from the interchange with Jazzman that I alluded to previously:
I have heard it asserted by others with pitbull persistence that the highest performing charters assuredly have the highest attrition… They must attain the highest performance by most sweepingly pushing out the least scholarly scholars. Though that’s plausible, the Boston data runs contrary.
In Massachusetts, DESE constructs a numeric percentile score that aims to rank schools against others statewide that serve the same or very similar grade levels. My understanding is that it derives from a complex blend of test scores, growth, graduation rates, etc. that’s tough to decipher, and that I might quarrel with if I fully understood it. But it’s the best single score I can find for purposes of ranking schools as to how much better kids read, write and calculate as they progress through school.
http://profiles.doe.mass.edu/accountability/report/aboutdata.aspx
So here’s that score for Boston’s 2015 Commonwealth charter schools in the first column, and in the second column, DESE’s attrition score for the same school.
for Boston’s 2015 Commonwealth charter schools:
97 5.3
93 1.6
91 5.3
78 9.1
71 6.9
62 12
58 8.6
57 8
54 11
51 8
42 7.7
36 11.3
32 10
23 18.9
OK, no positive correlation between attrition and performance there. We could imagine that the impact is via school-year rather than summer loss, but with only 82 students total in all grades leaving all Commonwealth charter schools in the city during the school year, that’s not a compelling putative explanation.
Stephen,
According to latest studies (sorry, I can’t recall the link right now, it is late), public schools in Chicago outperform charters. Troy LaRiviere did the research.
Thanks. I’ll be interested in the link if you happen across it any day soon. I think you’re likely thinking of the analyses by Myron Orfield and Thomas Luce like the one I linked to above. That was titled “Charter Schools in Chicago: No Model for Education Reform” and they arrived at the conclusion that you suggest, i.e., that traditional public schools in Chicago outperform charters.
But, funded in substantial part by the Illinois Education Association, the Chicago Teacher’s Union, and the Illinois Federation of Teachers their work has received some sufficiently serious criticism that I’d be cautious about accepting their conclusions…
They do, by the way, in the study I cited, acknowledge that CREDO’s most recent study had showed “most comparisons showing charter students out-performing their traditional school peers.”
They try to undercut CREDO’s methodology, but their attempt in that respect is seriously defective. Would be glad to explain why if I didn’t fear you would consider it a waste of time ;-).
Sleep well.
No. Troy LaRiviere.
Ah, you’re referring to an op-ed of his that was published in the Chicago Sun-Times and subsequently, he says, “scrubbed” from the site?
It examined student “growth percentiles” determining that growth was better in Chicago traditional schools.
Subseqently LaRaviere learned that eight of the city’s charter schools had showed no MAP growth data at all because they had not “opted in” to the MAP assessment.
And while the traditional school students had taken the pre-test in the spring of 2013 and test in spring of 2014, many of the charter school students had taken the pre-test not in the spring but instead in the fall of 2013. Troy argued that this should have strengthened his case due to the impacts of summer learning loss; he’d expect lower test scores in the fall of the same year than in the spring. And it became clear that charter school students had in many cases taken different tests than the traditional school students. And some charter students had taken one version (aligned with state standards) for the pre-test and a different version (aligned with Common Core) for the test.
In any event, LaRaviere declines to pay much mind to more recent CPS data since he simply doesn’t trust it.
Ronan,
You should try Google and find the link on your own. All the keywords are there. For instance, “Troy LaRaviere” and “Chicago public schools outperforming corporate charters”
I did and found the study in seconds.
“Drop Charter Reform Strategy: Chicago’s Public school students outearn students from charters.”
https://troylaraviere.net/2016/05/09/drop-charter-reform-strategy-chicagos-public-school-students-outlearn-students-from-charters/
But then that would take away time from your Trumpish Style Trolling.
Lloyd, recall that Diane had stated: “According to latest studies”:
And the analysis that LaRaviere did in 2014, that resulted in the op-ed that the Sun-Times published, then “scrubbed”, and that Diane featured in 2014 (https://dianeravitch.net/2014/09/04/troy-a-lariviere-how-chicago-neighborhood-schools-outperformed-charter-schools/) hardly qualifies as among the “latest studies”.
I had imagined that she was thinking of something more recent than that.
If you had used scholar.google.com, you might have noticed some interesting, dynamic, material from LaRaviere but not that analysis of CPS data. And in any event (particularly if you limited your search to 2015 forward) you could readily have found more recent studies, such as this, which you and Diane may find interesting: “Music Programs in Charter and Traditional Schools, A Comparative Study of Chicago Elementary Schools,” Jamey Kelley, Steven M. Demorest (February 19, 2016)
From the abstract:
“Results indicated that while all schools in the sample offered significantly less music than national averages, significantly more charter schools offered music during the school day. Charter schools were more likely to offer traditional music (band, choir, orchestra) as electives. Schools with music programs, regardless of school type, had higher test scores and higher attendance rates even when controlling for differences in socioeconomic status between music and non music schools. ”
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0022429416630282
Stephen,
Any school that can choose its students should be able to produce higher test scores than schools that must accept kids with disabilities of all kinds, ELLs, and behavioral problems. Do you agree?
Diane: “Any school that can choose its students should be able to produce higher test scores than schools that must accept kids with disabilities of all kinds, ELLs, and behavioral problems. Do you agree?”
Indeed I do. More successful musicians, athletes, visual artists, thespians, as well as test-takers depending on what they choose. Presuming they have a school that is adequately appealing to the targeted populace, that the chosen students prefer that school over their alternatives.
Here in Boston, as we have discussed before, there are lots of schools that choose their students by test, by audition, by essay, by interview.
(They’re mainly public district schools, though also private and parochial; the charter schools by contrast all use open lotteries for admission and the best have remarkably little attrition.)
Haha, Stephen. Any student who applies to enter a public school will be enrolled in a public school. If the student wants to enter a selective public school, she may not gain entry. But she will be placed in a public school, not left on the street.
Entry to any charter school is by selection–the charter’s selection. If the student does not gain entry, the charter has no further responsibility.
For the nth time, charters are private schools that operate with public funding. Like Boeing, Lockheed Martin. As many courts and the NLRB have ruled, as federal courts and the Washington State high court ruled, charter schools are not “state actors.”
“she will be placed in a public school, not left on the street.”
I have known a good many people who have not been successfully admitted to and retained by the traditional public school system, folks who at elementary or high school age migrated on to psychiatric facilities, specialized facilities for individuals with exceptionally severe disabilities, or correctional facilities. Some eventually made it back. Some didn’t.
And all that was largely outside the more routine out-of-district placement for students with disabilities: “In 2011-2012, approximately 6 percent of students with disabilities in Massachusetts were educated in out-of-district settings, either in private special education schools or collaborative programs, representing about double the national average of 3 percent.
Click to access Hehir%20SynthesisReport.pdf
I don’t think that whatever test scores they may accumulate are merged with those of the sending district’s students.
But, in any event, your argument entirely neglects the fact that comparisons that show Boston charter schools doing extraordinarily well in respect to academic achievement typically carefully match lottery school applicants who randomly win a lottery and attend a charter school with those who randomly lose and do not attend a charter school. They don’t compare the full pool of charter school students with all those attending district schools.
Diane: “For the nth time, charters are private schools ”
Diane, if you’d like to considerably strengthen your argument when you make it the nth plus 1 time (and lawd it needs it) have a look at it made more expansively by Robert D. Skeels, “a Juris Doctor Candidate whose specialty is education law in the era of neoliberalism”. (And then perhaps continue on a bit further to read the subsequent message by some wiseacre with the user name “sbrsb”) …in the comments section here: http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/09/the-charter-school-debate-is-over.html
Stephen,
Were those people who were not admitted to public schools accepted by charter schools?
“Were those people who were not admitted to public schools accepted by charter schools?”
I don’t think I’ve ever used the word tautology before, am not fully confident in its use, but am tempted here.
Massachusetts charter schools are public schools, every one of ’em. You could look it up. It’s right there in Mass. General Laws.
http://www.doe.mass.edu/lawsregs/ch71s89.html
But if your question were instead whether youth not willingly served by traditional public schools are commonly served instead at facilities operated by private nonprofit providers the answer would be yes, both in respect to alternative settings for individuals with disabilities and youth corrections facilities.
And if it were instead whether students attending kindergarten at a charter school could all have been admitted to a traditional public school had they not won admission to a charter school the answer would also be yes.
You may perhaps find this document of related interest.
“Technical Assistance Advisory SPED 2014-5: Charter School Responsibilities for Students with Disabilities Who May Need an Out-of-District Program – 603 CMR 28.10(6)”
So as not to evade your intent, I’ll assert that it is occasionally, but too rarely, the case that public charter schools serve students that traditional public schools have found it impossible to retain, see e.g.:
https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2016/03/31/chelsea-charter-program-that-reached-struggling-kids-reaches-milestone/KYZKbHYHdsqCVD6XM8xxeI/story.html
Calling a private school “public” does not make it public.
Public schools have elected boards, with the exception of a small number of big cities.
Public schools are accountable and transparent.
The national NAACP and Black Lives Matter have called for a moratorium on new charters until they meet the same laws and standards as public schools.
I could call myself 20 years old, but I’m not. Maybe I could get the Legislature in New York or Mass to say I am 20 years old. Won’t work.
Diane: “Calling a private school ‘public’ does not make it public.”
And conversely, Diane, your calling a public charter school “private” does not make it private.
You’re outnumbered and outweighed by publicly elected legislators in this state who have determined that our charter schools are public. And you have yet to point to a single court or NLRB decision that contradicts my legislators’ determination in this matter.
Diane: “Public schools have elected boards, with the exception of a small number of big cities.”
I am confident that Lloyd is at Google typing “state school for” and finding lots more exceptions.
In respect to the not-so-small number of big cities, have a look at pp 13-15 in “Mayoral Governance and Student Achievement How Mayor-Led Districts Are Improving School and Student Performance” Kenneth K. Wong and Francis X. Shen March 2013 (with Broad Fndn funding)
Click to access MayoralControl-6.pdf
Diane: “Public schools are accountable and transparent.”
Lloyd: “school board fraud….” Go for it.
Diane: “The national NAACP and Black Lives Matter have called for a moratorium on new charters until they meet the same laws and standards as public schools.”
Please feel at liberty to disagree with them.
The notion that it would make sense to have a nation-wide moratorium if charter schools everywhere but, say, New Hampshire met some ideal national standard strikes me as needing rather stronger supporting argumentation that I have yet to see anywhere. Perhaps you can provide it. You haven’t yet.
Diane: “I could call myself 20 years old, but I’m not. Maybe I could get the Legislature in New York or Mass to say I am 20 years old. Won’t work.”
I might attempt an amicus brief arguing that you project what appears as abundant youthful energy, and that many of your cells may indeed be precisely 20 years old, others somewhat more or less. You are diverse in age, I could argue, and not all your aspects should be confined to a single uniform standard.
But your estimation of the SJC’s likely conclusion may be correct for once.
Stephen,
In two separate cases, the National Labor Relations Board ruled that charter schools are private, not public.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/education/wp/2016/08/30/national-labor-relations-board-decides-charter-schools-are-private-corporations-not-public-schools/?utm_term=.2fd41b7f81f7
In two separate cases in federal courts (Arizona and California), charter operators claimed they were not subject to state law governing public schools, because they are not public schools. The federal courts agreed.
Whenever charters are in Court, their defense is that they are not public schools.
In a criminal case in California, where operators of a charter were indicted and convicted for misappropriating $200,000, the California Charter School Association entered an amicus brief claiming that the charter owners could not be prosecuted because the charter school is not a public school.
They convinced me.
The voters of Massachusetts voted 62-38% not to increase the number of charters despite the millions sent from out of state by people like the rightwing Waltons of Arkansas.
When I consider your legal analysis as you strive to extrapolate those decisions to Massachusetts public charter schools and search for a synonym for “slovenly,” which seems a little impolite, I am offered: “careless, slapdash, slipshod, haphazard, hit-or-miss, untidy, messy, negligent, lax, lackadaisical, slack.”
Take your choice. And then perhaps go read the Skeels/sbrsb interchange if you haven’t yet…
Diane: “The voters of Massachusetts voted 62-38% not to increase the number of charters despite the millions sent from out of state by people like the rightwing Waltons of Arkansas.”
They rejected a very particular ill-advised plan and process for expansion of charter schools, inundated by a blizzard of falsehoods by certain key opponents, while in many cases understanding that other opponents like Mayor Walsh of Boston were seeking an increase of charter schools just at a different rate and via a different legislative process.
SR,
NLRB decisions are national, not for particular states.
As Trump replaces members of the NLRB with anti-union people who share his views, perhaps the NLRB will side with you, DeVos, and Trump.
A former friend of mine I’d known for more than sixty years thinks just like Ronan. That is why he is now a former friend. That former friend was once a sensible person but then he was seduced by the hate filled, lying, Alt Right media. That old, former friend taught me what confirmation bias was. Back when we were still communicating and we were debating sexual orientation, he used a link to an anonymous blogger that claimed he or she lived in San Francisco. This anonymous blogger that I think called itself “Rabbit” never linked to any sources of evidence to support what he thought about gay people. That blogger spewed endless extreme opinions with no basis in fact. My former friend saw this as evidence to support what he wanted to think.
The Alt Right media has spawned many of these sources to offer the easy to fool minions fake evidence to support their confirmation bias.
Let’s not forget that some people can be fooled all of the time. Nothing we say, no valid evidence we provide, will change the way the “some” think.
That is why I think the United States is headed for a Balkanized Civil War. The fascist, conspiracy theory loving, Alt-Right Trumpists against the rest of us, but how many of us will be willing to take up arms to fight them when the bullets and bombs start flying? That is the question. I do not think non-violence is going to stop them or even slow them up if they take over and hold power. They aren’t there yet. but they are inching closer every time Trump tweets his bully tactics and insults and is allowed to get away with it.
Lloyd, on this block, and in this neighborhood, good folks are trying to stem the gun violence not advance it. There has been a lot lately. I am optimistic that if you were here you would join those positive efforts.
Best wishes.
I’m not sure what your point was. I suspect your comment was a very lame attempt to change the subject, as usual.
Is Ronan really your last name?
From Urban Dictionary:
“Ronan is a brilliant person he has lots of friends and he has a really good personality he really likes technology and is an expert with it he fancies one person until he gets out of school he is a really good boyfriend to have he won’t leave you or cheat on you he is always kind and caring he is very generous and once he’s made a friend he’ll be loyal to them unless they disrespect him
Ronan being defined is cool”
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Ronan
To be honest, though, the first time I saw your alleged last name, I thought of this one – that you selected that assumed name for online comments because you fancied yourself as a lone samurai saving the world one comment at a time.
“A rōnin (浪人 Rōnin, “drifter” or “wanderer”, i.e. “he who drifts/wanders”) was a samurai without lord or master during the feudal period (1185–1868) of Japan.”
Yes, Lloyd.
But not a bad hypothesis. As a young man, I was first informed about the Ronins by a man I admired a lot, a former New England Patriot who had somehow developed substantial interest/expertise in those samurai, and was delighted to share his knowledge with a Ronan.
My main attempt to thoughtfully select another name was in primary school… part of the Catholic process in which one picks a Confirmation name/saint….
I picked Thomas/Doubting Thomas… I am more a “that may not suffice” than slash and slice kinda guy.
Tangentially, do you think this is a general subject area that may be worth discussing on your blog, Diane?
https://melmagazine.com/the-connection-between-concussions-cte-and-acts-of-violence-65330058f80
That provocative speculation was published this week.
I’d promise ahead of time, if that would be helpful, not to highlight disparate incidence of football and impacts at charter v. traditional public schools.
Stephen: “a former New England Patriot who had somehow developed substantial interest/expertise in those samurai…”
Ah, now I understand that better.
“At the same time Larry Garron was on the Patriots he studied various forms of martial arts. He holds rank in Kenpō (fist law), Hakkō-ryū Jujutsu, Gōjū-ryū (hard soft system), Shintō Musō-ryū, Yoshitsune Jujitsu, and Taekwondo.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Garron
Are you implying that because of using the name Stephen, you have earned black belts in several different martial arts or is that just wishful thinking?
I have no martial art’s belts – just a few, long healed broken bones learning how to use my body as a weapon. But what I learned long ago is rusty at my current age. Age has a way of slowing you down.
Sorry, Llloyd, I don’t grasp the logic that would arrive you at that inference.
I fear that it may give you further food for indigestion to know that neither Diane nor I has yet seemed willing to publicly confirm or deny our participation in this:
But I for one empathize with your not feeling as limber as you may once have been.
When it comes to logic, how we arrive at what’s called logic depends on our learning style and/or modality. While all children can learn, not all children learn the same.
How we learn influences how we arrive at our logic. A perfect example of this is Trump’s supporters. They have arrived at their logic from learning sources known as the Alt-Right media that reports on conspiracy theories without any valid evidence and spreads lies far and wide. That is the foundation for Trumpist logic.
Learning styles and learning modalities are often spoken of interchangeably. Modalities refer to how students use their senses in the learning process. We commonly consider four modalities: visual (seeing), auditory (hearing), kinesthetic (moving), and tactile (touching). As you might guess, the more senses or modalities we can activate, the more learning will take place.
I learned about this back in the early 1980s and adapted the lessons I taught to offer all four major learning modalities an opportunity to learn. The reason I learned it was because in California to keep our credentials to teach we had to take approved workshops on a regular basis and apply what we learned in our lessons. We were offered a wide choice of workshops and I preferred those that focused on how the brain and/or memory works in relation to how we learn.
Diane: “NLRB decisions are national, not for particular states.”
Let me offer you an analogy. The EPA establishes a national standard for emissions by power plants.
It then determines that a particular power plant violates its standard.
Would it be logical from that to conclude that all power plants nationwide are in violation of the EPA standard?
I am mildly confident your answer will be no. One might have to carefully examine the standard, and any particular power plant’s operations to determine whether that power plant did or did not meet the national standard. Though understanding particular states’ laws, and enforcement mechanisms, might helpfully inform one’s speculation.
The NLRB did not issue a national decision defining all charter schools as public or private. It has examined, in a very small number of cases, whether a particular charter school such as Hyde Leadership charter school in NY State currently conformed to previously articulated standards (the “Hawkins County test”) as to whether it was properly considered a ‘political subdivision’. Hyde arguably (it was a split decision) did not pass the Hawkins County test as constituting a political subdivision, as per the 2-1 majority.
If you were to carefully consider the Hawkins County test and Massachusetts General Laws, I think you will determine that, by contrast, every Massachusetts charter school does.
A Grand Jury prosecutor once told me in respect to Massachusetts statutes: You’ll need to take my word for it.
My response: That may not always suffice.
So, I’ll be sympathetic if you want to carefully review with me chapter and verse of the Hawkins County test and relevant Massachusetts statutes rather than just take my word for it.
As background reading, if neither Skeels v. sbrsb in the blogosphere, nor the text of the key NLRB decision and dissent, are able to capture your attention, you could start with the majority decision that Supreme Court Justice William Brennan delivered in NLRB v. Nat. Gas Util. Dist. of Hawkins County 402 U.S. 600 (1971)
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/402/600/case.html
It’s quite brief.
CREDO is funded by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.
Oops “to return to traditional public schools” should be inserted before “in the city” in the final sentence.
Thank you Gary! Statistics are wonderful if you know how to read them.
This is not the first time Gary has had an impact with his mathematically based debunking.
His series on VAM in NY City schools revealed that VAM was basically a crapshoot (literally and figuratively)
This (and the work of people like Audrey Amrein Beardsley) set the stage for later lawsuits ( eg, from Sheri Lederman) based on the fact that VAM is essentially arbitrary.
Gary has been exposing bunk for quite a while now and sometimes it takes time for the public to take note.
Us News understands that if they didn’t respond by bremoving the school in question from their list of “top schools” they would just make the claims of critics that their ranking system can be gamed (which it obviously can) more credible.
The US News Rankings are a fraud no matter who is on the list. The “best” schools have astonishing attrition rates and few poor kids, ELLs, or specEd
Actually the best CHARTER schools have high attrition rates. The best PUBLIC schools have low attrition rates. Of course those public schools also often serve middle class kids and not at risk kids.
The difference is that none of those public schools are making claims that they have solved the problem of how to educate all the at risk kids in failing public schools. The charters have.
The difference is honesty (public schools) and Trump- like boasts with as much honesty and self promotion that we hear from charter folks.
Until there is total open-door transparency for all schools that accept public money, trust and accuracy is a factor that doesn’t exist and only fools with confirmation bias will accept the misleading claims hidden behind the Wizard-of-Oz Curtains of secrecy.
Congratulations, Gary Rubinstein. Great reporting!
Kudos to Rubenstein for the research. Facts are ammunition to expose fake reform. Now let’s circulate this on Facebook with a photo to attract more attention.
It isn’t just the US News & World Report school rankings that are dubious. It’s also Jay Mathews Challenge Index rankings at The Washington Post, which have been discussed on this blog.
But there’s another set of rankings that are equally suspect. And no one is saying anything much about them. These are the school rankings produced by an outfit called Niche. And they are not very good.
First, some history.
Niche is a private, for-profit company. It began as College Prowler, a college guidebook company. Some questioned its college rankings and reviews, and its less-then-ethical practices. Some higher education experts criticized the “College Prowler scandal, in which the purveyor of college guides was caught impersonating both students and colleges on Facebook in order to mine data and drive traffic to its website.” More information on that scandal can be found here:
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2008/12/22/frenemies-facebook
The Chronicle of Higher Education noted that “College Prowler had formed a partnership with [another] company to ‘colonize’ Facebook groups for marketing purposes.”
In 2015, the architectural engineering company SmithGroupJJR, one of the top such firms in the country, noted in its Perspectives blog that the Niche college rankings were of “questionable” value and – importantly – observed that Niche is working toward a future of trying to get its rankings used as ” a viable future replacement for SAT/ACT scores…”
Niche now ranks public schools too, in each state and across states. It describes its methodology for “Best Academics” as “a comprehensive assessment of the quality of the academics at public school districts in the United States.”
But it isn’t really that at all.
Nearly a third of that assessment relies on dubious data. For “Best Academics,” Niche allots 10 percent to the number of students taking an Advanced Placement (AP) course, 10 percent for the percentage of students who “pass” an AP course, and 10 percent for SAT/ACT composite score. The Niche ‘best academics” assessment jumps to about fifty percent when student “interest” in an “elite” college is added in. Niche also uses state testing data.
Research shows clearly that AP is not what people think it is. For example, a 2002 National Research Council comprehensive study of AP math and science courses and tests found they were “a mile wide and an inch deep” and did not conform to research-based principles of learning. A “3” on an AP test is considered a “passing” score, but it equates to a “C” in a college survey course, and most colleges – especially the “elite ones” – do not award any credit for a “3.” Students freely admit that they take AP course primarily to “look good” rather than to enrich their learning.
As I’ve noted before, AP may work well for some students, especially those who are already “college-bound to begin with” (Klopfenstein and Thomas, 2010). As Geiser (2007) notes, “systematic differences in student motivation, academic preparation, family background and high-school quality account for much of the observed difference in college outcomes between AP and non-AP students.” College Board-funded studies do not control well for these student characteristics (even the College Board concedes that “interest and motivation” are keys to “success in any course”). Klopfenstein and Thomas (2010) find that when these demographic characteristics are controlled for, the claims made for AP disappear.
A newer (2013) study from Stanford notes that “increasingly, universities seem
to be moving away from awarding credit for AP courses.” The study pointed out that “the impact of the AP program on various measures of college success was found to be negligible.” And it adds this: “definitive claims about the AP program and its impact on students and schools are difficult to substantiate.”
But Niche has glommed onto the AP myth. The SAT and ACT too.
SAT and ACT scores are little more than proxies for family income. They are not accurate predictors of success in college. College enrollment specialists say that their research finds the SAT predicts between 3 and 14 percent of the variance in freshman-year college grades, and after that nothing (the ACT is only marginally better). As the head of one college enrollment consulting company commented, “I might as well measure their shoe size.” Moreover, colleges – especially “elite” ones – use SAT and ACT scores to enhance their own prestige and to exclude poorer students from admissions.
The Niche methodology for “best schools” also utilizes survey responses. Niche says that there must be a minimum of “11 unique respondents required at each district.” If that is for the entire district, then it’s a pretty doggone small sample. Moreover, the responses on which the rankings are made must come from “registered users.”
All of this raises multiple questions. Why is Niche using suspect data like AP and SAT/ACT scores to rank schools? How – exactly – does one becomes a “registered user”? What are the demographics of Niche “registered users”? What does a sample “survey” that Niche gives to “registered users” look like?
Guess what? If you asked Niche – even if you asked multiple times – you’d not get any answers.
Interestingly, if you look at the Niche “best schools” rankings, all of them are interlinked with Realtor.com.
Perhaps even more interesting, and bizarre, is that one central Virginia school division — a school division that touts AP courses and SAT scores, and that has gone all-in on the STEM fallacy, and that bills itself as “innovative” and “cutting edge” — has adopted the Niche rankings as the basis for a “market” that determines how it pays its teachers.
The founder of College Prowler/Niche says this about Niche evolved out of College Prowler:
“Only a couple million people a year choose colleges. It’s not a market like Facebook…we needed more visitors and more dollars per visitor. How much traffic you have and how well you monetize this traffic is at the core of everything…So we rebranded from College Prowler to Niche…to a much larger market…We wanted to be a very big company, and now that’s what we’re on the path to do.”
So, Niche, is “on the path” to market its mostly made-up school rankings to suckers, make big money doing it, and it has the help of a public school system that has already bought into all the educational goofiness that’s out there and yet has the gall to call itself “innovative.”
I cannot help but to recall the line from Forrest Gump: “Stupid is as stupid does.”