In the current climate of union-busting in Indiana, State Senator Pete Miller has proposed a plan to pay teachers more if they have needed skills (like STEM backgrounds), without increasing the funding available. That means that any increased pay will be taken away from other teachers. This is a way to break the unions and to create divisiveness in the schools, in place of collaboration.
The reformers never give up on their plans to turn schools into businesses and children into products, with test scores as the “profit.”
If you live in Indiana, get active to stop this bad idea. The link shows you how to take action.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
I can guarantee that after they bust the union with this tactic, ALL teachers, including STEM teachers will be paid much, much less.
Membership needs to stay strong and refuse this proposal. It is discriminatory in nature and they will not stop at STEM teachers. Better STEM job fairs and recruitment need to be implemented — not higher wages offered.
We only need to look to the private sector STEM fields in tech to see what really happens here. Tech companies do not offer STEM workers more money to alleviate “shortages”. Rather these companies accept lower quality products or pay employees less by shipping jobs to lower standard of living countries or import H1bs.
Agree. http://dailycaller.com/2015/07/08/microsoft-lays-off-thousands-while-demanding-more-h1-b-visas/
“The reformers never give up on their plans to turn schools into businesses and children into products, with test scores as the ‘profit.’”
No, the profit isn’t in the test scores, those are the means to achieve the profits . . .
. . . for the very few and definitely no benefits/profits for the children.
I’m not surprised. Governor Pence and is cronies have tried everything they can possibly do to turn educatio in Indiana into a shambles.
This reminds me of the new law just passed in Florida where teachers with high SAT scores, and who were smart enough to save them, will now get a $10,000 bonus. With the new teachers, they’ll be guaranteed that bonus before even setting foot in a classroom (upon completion of a school year), before even showing how good or bad they are as teachers.
Florida legislators picked some arbitrary cut-off point — 1300 out of 1600 or something in the old system (before the SAT had a writing portion); a different threshold with the new system — to decide which teachers get the bonus.
I asked my mother if she saved my SAT scores in a file somewhere, and she said, “No. Why would I do that?”
“Well, had you saved it, and if I taught in Florida’s public schools, I’d get an extra $10,000 salary bonus.”
My mother, a retired teacher with a career spanning 30 years, replied, “Wait a minute. Are you serious? Are they REALLY doing that in Florida? That has got to be the STUPIDEST idea that I’ve ever heard.”
“Well you know these days there’s a lot of stupid ideas being promulgated in education.”
“No, not just in education. That’s too limiting. That’s one of the stupidest ideas of ANY kind that I’ve ever heard ANYWHERE. What are they thinking?”
I then explained the suspicions that others had. By offering that SAT bonus, Florida’s corporate education reformers are trying to lure as many young teachers — right out of college, who’ve never taught before — from Teach for America, and from other TFA knockoffs like the TNTP. Those teachers who took the SAT more recently would have more likelihood to have saved their scores.
“‘Well, here’s how it works, Mom. Sure, it costs an extra $10,000-per-year-per-teacher, but the odds are that the vast majority of those same teachers will be gone in 2 years or 3 at the most, and thus, never move up a Florida school district’s salary schedule. Therefore, in the long rung, having those short-term temp teachers will — compared to having career teachers like you and me — save hundreds of thousands of dollars per teacher, and untold millions over all. Florida taxpayers and corporations will then be saved that money in their taxes. That’s the goal.”
“Yeah, but those getting the bonus aren’t real teachers. They’re just unqualified scabs, with no university education or training.”
“No kidding.”
“What about the quality of the education and instruction being delivered? What about the caliber of the educators in the classroom? There’s no correlation between high SAT scores and teaching ability. Some of the naturally smartest people I’ve known can’t teach worth a damn. You know that.”
“I know, I know.”
“The kids in Florida will likely end up with a vast majority of lousy, amateur teachers teaching them — mixed in with a few good ones. Furthermore, if I were one of the veterans who didn’t save their scores, I’d be furious. That’s going to be such a divisive element to introduce into a school’s culture, and the kids will suffer because of that as well.”
“Ehhh… go figure.”
Since Republicans in Florida believe a high school SAT score demonstrate superior teaching skills, I would then assume they automatically disqualify Rubio as he was a C or lower student in high school? Can we get the SAT/ACT scores and grade cards of the other candidates?
As I recall, Douglas County Colorado has had differentiated pay by “hard to staff subjects” and the school board’s judgment abut the relative importance of instruction at particular grade levels.
Other wise, this is not just a single state issue because ESSA. Why? Congress is offering bait for differentiated pay and the current darling is for teachers of STEM and computer science.
Title II authorizes and blatantly pushes states toward compensation based on a hierarchy of valued subjects. There is funding to get this going.
‘‘SEC. 2245. STEM MASTER TEACHER CORPS.
‘‘(a) IN GENERAL.—From the funds reserved under section 2241(4) for a fiscal year, the Secretary may award grants to—
‘‘(1) State educational agencies to enable such agencies to support the development of a State-wide STEM master teacher corps; or
‘‘(2) State educational agencies, or nonprofit organizations in partnership with State educational agencies, to support the implementation, replication, or expansion of effective science, technology, engineering, and mathematics professional development programs in schools across the State through collaboration with school administrators, principals, and STEM educators.
‘
‘(b) STEM MASTER TEACHER CORPS.—In this section, the term ‘STEM master teacher corps’ means a State-led effort to elevate the status of the science, technology, engineering, and mathematics teaching profession by recognizing, rewarding, attracting, and retaining outstanding science, technology, engineering, and mathematics teachers, particularly in high-need and rural schools, by—
‘‘(1) selecting candidates to be master teachers in the corps
on the basis of— ‘‘(A) content knowledge based on a screening examination; and ‘‘(B) pedagogical knowledge of and success in teaching;
‘‘(2) offering such teachers opportunities to– ‘‘(A) work with one another in scholarly communities; and ‘‘(B) participate in and lead high-quality professional development; and
AND….Here you see it
‘‘(3) providing such teachers with additional appropriate and substantial compensation for the work described in paragraph (2) and in the master teacher community.
Source p. 152 in the super final ESSA, signed by the President which is 391 pages long. Find it via
Click to access essa-final-version.pdf
I don’t care what people say about “hard to staff,” the fact is these specialities are typically male-dominated. This is nothing less than sex discrimination.
Utah has had the same policies–to pay a $5,000 “bonus” to STEM teachers. The ironic part is that Utah has also passed a bill requiring students to pass a citizenship test to graduate–but isn’t paying social studies teachers the bonus.
If it’s not hard to fill Social Studies teaching slots (lots of out-of-work history majors), why would we pay them a bonus? Have you ever taken Econ 101?
Yes, of course I have. I’m a social studies teacher. My point is that it is not really that hard to fill math or science positions, at least in my state. And the only “high stakes” test for students in Utah is the citizenship test, so you’d think that there would be some recognition for that.
I am no longer going to reply to you, because you have preconceived (and wrong) notions about public schools, and you refuse to learn anything new, so it does no good to try to educate you.
Virginia/Brian/asp…. my Econ 101 included: “THORSTEIN VEBLEN, an economist who dabbled in sociology, reckoned that the best-off members of a community established the standards that everyone else followed.” and it included Galbraith “Economics and the Public Purpose.
Brian/Virginia/ASP… when I teach Econ 101 this is the reference I will concentrate on : “Does Money Matter”? An NBER paper “The estimates suggest that spending increases do lead to improved test scores. Estimates for 4th- graders suggest that a one standard deviation increase in per-pupil spending ($1000) increases math, reading, science and social studies test scores by about a half of a standard deviation. Estimated effects are remarkably consistent across specifications and test subjects. Estimates for 8th-graders show no evidence of an effect of spending on district average test scores. One explanation for the difference between 4th- and 8th-grade effects is that 4th-graders spent a larger fraction of their education in well-funded schools.
Further investigation into the effects of spending on the distribution of test scores suggests that increases in 4th-grade test scores come as a result of an increase in performance by students at the bottom of the distribution. The results also suggest that increases in spending led to a decrease in the fraction of 8th-graders scoring at both ends of the distribution. Future work should investigate possible explanations for this finding.
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This research was done with MEAP.. before MCAS was developed. There was some reliability/validity built into the tests over the decades as MA went through several iterations MEAP/MCAS etc. but not with PARCC because it came out as a “product” with no field testing — fait a’ccompli . Unfortunately, Comissioner Greg Anrig went to work at ETS after these early field tests in MA and we got stuck with people like David Driscoll and Mitchell Chester. I had a discussion with a man at the Albany library and he said their last best commissioner was Gordon Ambach. People like Romney came along and built their creds on the success of schools in MA and all I can say is “Romney would kill the goose that lays golden eggs”.
Where in the heck comes forth the idea that teachers with science and math backgrounds, which are almost always men, deserve more money as teachers than say kindergarten teachers, who are almost always women? Do these people really think they deserve more money than those teachers who are far harder working because they work with the youngest children and provide those children with the foundation for learning on which all other learning is built, including so-called STEM?
This is why you have a step system where experience and education are the most important. Male dominated teaching specialties do NOT deserve higher pay than elementary teachers. Period.
Susan,
Not everything needs to be viewed from a gender equality perspective. As everyone knows the “market” is gender neutral and therefore those issues don’t exist. The “market” allocates resources as it sees fit.
And if anyone believes those last two sentences I’ve got some great white and black sand ocean front beach properties for sale cheaply at Lake of the Ozarks in Central Missouri. Call now, operators are standing by.
Duane you forgot to add: “If your last name starts with letters A-L we can take your calls immediately today…. otherwise, M-Z you miss out because you can’t call until tomorrow… But keep those calls coming.
Sorry, Duane, but this is a form of sex discrimination. Hate to break it to ya. Kindergarten teaching is way harder than lecturing to a bunch of students on math and science. BTW, there is no such thing as “gender”–the correct term is sex.
That’s nonsense. We live in a capitalist nation where salaries are determined by supply and demand. Male basketball players earn more because more folks want to see them. Female ice skaters earn more because more people want to see them. Astronauts make a pittance compared to the requirements because everyone wants to go to space (they could pay astronauts nothing if they wanted).
Most of the STEM teachers are still female in K-12. Stop your liberal nonsense. You couldn’t teach STEM if you wanted. At least not well.
I don’t think you are clueless…. I think you are a troll… take your nonsense somewhere else! Truth is truth, and just because you spout it, does no t make it true… although such machinations work http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Why-Urban-Legends-Get-Told-in-Sci_Tech-People_Study_Threat_Urban-Legends-160108-521.html
but not here… peddle you mythology elsewhere.
Sorry about that, Duane. I understand your point now.
No hay problema, Susana.
I was worried that you might not “get” what I intended.
Although I do have a question about ” BTW, there is no such thing as “gender”–the correct term is sex.” I don’t see the difference that you are attempting to portray. If anything I would have been the opposite of what you wrote. Help me out.
ay ay ay, not “I would” but “I would have thought it. . . “
” Stop your liberal nonsense. You couldn’t teach STEM if you wanted.”
You have hit on what makes me uniquely proud of who I am… This is what I have worked for all of my life. I am a liberal (supporter of Elizabeth Warren, Barney Frank, Bernie Sanders) and I am extremely proud of this fact because they represent my values. Your name calling has made me realize that my ideals are accomplished. I majored in math in college in 1960 and also in literature and if I had a third major it would have been history — my later degrees were in psychology/learning disabilities. What you call nonsense is what I am calling my very best accomplishments. I was able to get A in physics in an urban area where the colleges had no physics lab (due to poverty of resources). Later on in my career I was in meetings on gifted education in NH where the Governor Sununu was known to state “we don’t need those labs in the schools because the teachers just take the time off.” So that is what you keep doing when you make your comments — I see Governor Sununu’s face. My neighbor teaches chemistry at three different colleges and she is adjunct so she has to drive the car around with supplies in the back seat (these adjunct faculty pay parking at each college, they pay union dues at each college) and they cannot earn one living adequate to keep the home fires burning. Then you select out E. Warren (who fits your standard of “rare and valued” ) and you point at her salary and try to tell me that adjunct faculty are used because Warren’s salary is too high? This is just standard republican fare. Father Drinan taught this to me in the 1950s in Worcester County before he went on to do anti-war organizing in the 60s.
reference: Governor Sununu in 1985, then Governor John Sununu presented his Governor’s Initiative for Excellence in Education. Four hundred projects to benefit gifted and talented students were guided by this Initiative’s Gifted and Talented Action.
And, he wanted no labs… no resources for labs because the teachers are just too lazy… I’ve heard this mantra repeated for how many decades now? Deprive the schools of resources and then blame the teachers (or the feckless parents , or the “grit less” kids) … What’s the matter with Kansas.
I guess he would have tested the students in 10th grade to see which kids deserved to have a physics lab…but the skinflint was depriving them for 10 years by restricting resources… All the time depriving the teachers of a physics lab in the college where they are supposed to prepare to teach the students in their schools.
Brian/Virginia/asp… if I didn’t live near Boston I would choose Austin or Seattle…. Austin gets a bad rap for being in TX but they are more attuned to Seattle or Boston in terms of the “liberal” viewpoints held by many in the city. http://www3.forbes.com/lifestyle/the-most-conservative-and-most-liberal-cities-in-america/2/ just wanting to share more of my “liberal nonsense” with Brian/Virginia/asp…. this is boring for most of the people who read here.
At one time we believed in working together to better education for all.
Now, they wish to pit one group against another.
Divide and conquer.
Typical political agenda.
Gordon, that was always the way things worked in the past — you became a teacher with a goal to build community. The current policies in the republican governor’s agenda are purposely meant to destroy communities — Romney said it when he hoped “they will self-deport”. We saw what he did to eduction in MA ; withholding state funds, making local cities/towns come up with more local taxation. Romney went around claiming how wonderful education programs were in MA and then he set about “killing the goose that lays golden eggs”. ALL of this next generation of their proposed “leaders” are worse than McCain and Romney. Out of the whole bunch Lindsey Graham is the only one I can even tolerate to listen to and of course he’s gone from their candidates at this point…
Another divisive tactic that will do nothing but make matters worse. Pitting one against the other is foolish.
crossposted at OPed
http://www.opednews.com/populum/modify_quicklink.php
This is called a labor market. More valuable and rare skills require more compensation. This should have been implemented a long time ago.
Another policy that coincides with more pay is more accountability. Since ELA and math skills are more important (yes, more important than art, music, history etc. Those are not useless but not as important), they should require both more scrutiny and more pay. We have objective measures (VAMs) that can determine effectiveness in ELA/math but not so well in other subjects.
In teachers’ minds, the only way to implement a new policy is to throw huge $$$ at it. Ane even then, they want veto power. That’s not reality. It’s great to hear Indiana is implementing effective reform.
“We have objective measures (VAMs) that can determine effectiveness in ELA/math”. VAM for Dummies http://curmudgucation.blogspot.com/2014/02/vam-for-dummies.html
There are computer programs that solve integrals in Calculus, but they cannot tell you how they solved it. If computers produce better VAM scores than students, are students obsolete?
ugh
Diane, you need an “ignore user” program on here so I never have to read bloviated blather from virginia…. please.
Virginia/Brian always comes in with the same hammer and it is the wrong paradigm. The last conversation I had with Virginia/Brian I asked him to get back to me after he had read the Henry Levin encyclopedia on evaluation of computer technologies in educational programs. Today , I would treat him the same way as if he were a grad student in one of my classes at U. Mass and say “get back to me after you have read the encyclopedia on evaluation of education and professional educators by Michael Scriven.” Scriven, M (2009). Demythologizing causation and evidence. In Donaldson, S; Christie, C; and Mark, M. What counts as credible evidence in applied research and evaluation practice? Sage Publications…. this would be a starting place so Brian could come to class asking a few good questions rather than preaching how he thinks his perfect system (he is borrowing from the Navy or wherever) would work. By the way, Michael Scriven has done work for Department of Defense/ certification of civil service program personnel (not just teachers.) I will build the reading list for Brian /Virginia maybe the asp means as soon as possible?
jeanhaverhill, so this goes to the heart of theory vs practice. You can devise a system that evaluates what should be measured, but that doesn’t mean it is being measured. And no, the evaluation procedures for civil servants in the federal space is not a glowing example of a great eval system. I’m not saying the structure is not well-designed, but when implemented by interested parties, it simply doesn’t measure quality.
Are you denying that 99%+ of every district rates teachers as effective? Are you suggesting this is accurate? Are you suggesting that Scriven or any other researcher continues to obtain empirical evidence to demonstrate that their methods are being implemented as intended?
Look, the theory of communism is great. Everybody contributes based on their talents and is provided according to needs. Everybody works hard and are efficiently allocated. That’s fantasy. Folks need incentives to pursue more difficult but higher value careers. Folks need incentives not to sit at home and receive payments. Capitalism is largely based on the fallibility of humans. Same with evaluations.
If we had an effective evaluation system, we wouldn’t need to weight VAMs very highly. CFR admit as much. But the point is that we do not have a credible system regardless of which of your heroes devised it. And this token eval system is used to give blanket salary increases to teachers based on their possessing a heartbeat.
MathVale, who programmed those computers? Thought so.
AlwaysLearning, when you can explain CFR’s research and why it could be wrong, then maybe I’ll respond to Peter Greene’s silly blogs. Peter doesn’t even try to refute the core argument. That is a sign of a lightweight who doesn’t understand.
asp/Brian/Virginia… please include in your critique a comparison with the military personnel evaluation systems as cited in Colonel Yates’ report:
[PDF]RETHINKING MILITARY PERSONNEL EVALUATIONS
dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA560299
RETHINKING MILITARY PERSONNEL EVALUATIONS BY … AUTHOR: Lieutenant Colonel Brian A. Yates TITLE: Rethinking Military Personnel Evaluations FORMAT: …
Include in your discussion the New York Times article mentioned earlier in these comments on evaluation of medical personnel… You can find “cliff notes” in the journal GOVERNING that will quickly bring you up to date. I’m sure you get the “gist” of my response and you can apply your extreme “grit” to getting these tasks done.
“. Sigmund Freud, himself, saw philosophical humor as the highest defense mechanism: “Look here! This is all this seemingly dangerous world amounts to. Child’s play – the very thing to jest about.” it might be similar to what is expressed as “gallows” humor.. it is not “adolescent frat boy humor” and it is not playground bullying ….. I’ll try to find Sternberg’s definition as well
jeanhaverhill, I’m not dismissing the benefits of humor, but Sigmund Freud was a quack whose contributions have been thoroughly debunked!
Are you honestly saying that teachers shouldn’t have to pass the GED? Maybe elementary teachers don’t need to be STEM experts, but they either need to be conversant with STEM or we need to separate the teaching of various subjects (the latter would be preferred for a number of reasons not least of which is we could pay them more). What teachers do you know that can’t pass basic competency tests? Maybe that data should be made public as well.
I have no problem with Harvard paying Warren whatever they want. But it’s rather odd that she complained of increased tuition which, of course, is caused by exorbitant pay packages. I’m must saying maybe you should criticize the educators’ hero on this too if you think all teachers should be paid equal amounts.
Are you suggesting a model inline with Brian Yates proposal of a fixed points system? Each principal would have points sufficient to rate each teacher as average. The principal could only raise a teacher’s eval but using points from other teachers’ evaluation? That could be very useful but the question is whether any principal would ever rate a teacher as ineffective. They may be more averse to rating a teacher ineffective than they are interested in giving credit to truly great teachers. I would note that the Navy enforced a virtual bell curve within its rating system. I thought that worked quite well.
Diane, you cannot expect results before the system has been implemented. The Dallas reform efforts aim to recruit the best teachers from surrounding areas and retain the most effective teachers in Dallas. How would scores change overnight? If the turnover in Dallas is only 3% and the plan just started last year, you would see small results during the first 5 years of its implementation. But over time, the improvement should be steady and consistent. But by “results”, I am referring to student growth data relative to other Texas teachers. That’s the only way to discount the input SES of the students.
please do not accuse me…. I said that teachers in Massachusetts have to pass State tests for teachers (and they are mostly Pearson)
The GED test is a different situation but it is in the same mold; punish the people, limit their opportunities. Those are experimental tests with no reliability and validity. The teacher test in MA , when it fails professional teachers in their own field by 2 points, — that means the tests are not valid….
Teacher tests, GED tests, student tests — separate tests that are marketed (many from Pearson) ; what do they have in common? They have absolutely no proven reliability or validity and they are being sold to parents with statements about predictive validity and that is fraud. The taxpayers are paying for this giant corporate to build reliability on their tests and they are using the students as guinea pigs. That is why they want 100% in these experiments because if they don’t have a full sampling then their results will be skewed and they will never have any reliability or validity. That is why they demand that all the kids take the tests.
Are you honestly saying that teachers shouldn’t have to pass the GED?
jeanhaverhill@aol.com
So jeanhaverhill, let’s make sure we understand what you are saying. If teachers who teach high school physics fail the teacher test for physics, then it’s impossible for those teachers to be ineffective and have unacceptable content knowledge. The fact that a 15-yr teacher fails the test must mean that the test is invalid. Is that a fair summary of your statement?
Did every teacher fail? Maybe some just “guessed” right?
Should kids have to pass any test to graduate from high school? Is a diploma just a participation trophy?
What is the matter with you? I read what Jean said. How do you come up with such a conclusion? RU 4 real. Do you not know what is happening? Are you so locked in your own belief system that you cannot see the big picture that is the topic of conversation here. There re 15,880 districts an tens of thousands f schools and hundreds of thousands of teachers. YOUR experience, your grasp of things is very narrow, and no matter ho many people tell you the truth, nothing nmatters
you distort what I say
The 15 year teacher with a master’s degree who speaks 3 languages failed the Pearson test by 2 points. The Pearson test is not valid. All of the 15 years of different supervisors in 3 different districts who have knowledge of her performance in teaching the languages in junior high and high school have rated her proficient. The professional judgment of the supervisors should weight more than an artificial test prepared by pearson who is known for poor quality tests. Instead, the teacher has to pay to take the test over, find the two or three esoteric statements from some place (that don’t apply to her classroom skills or her knowledge) and come up with what the test taker is looking for. This is anecdotal; I give the case as an example of how teachers in many instances are being penalized by the poor quality of the Pearson test. Test performance on Pearson tests does not equate to effective classroom teaching. Part of the fault is in who the individuals are who are preparing the tests (ETS has worked on that for decades) and part of the fault because Pearson has cornered the markets and there are no alternatives.
The elementary school candidate who had to pass physics to graduate and get a college degree was a different case. This was before there was a Pearson test. In a college that only has one instructor in physics and no other opportunities to demonstrate knowledge other than “pass a course” on material that she will never be expected to teach. If the individual wants to teach high school science, math, physics, then certainly you would expect the person to pass a physics course . There are too many things a classroom teacher in the elementary grades will have to know that a physics high school teacher just cannot produce (we see this when we try to move teachers down from high school into elementary and they don’t have the abilities or skills and cannot adapt because they are subject centered and only know their own field).
but there is not much point in my continuing other than to say you distort everything I say and your whole purpose and intent is to trip me up.
let’s make sure we understand what you are saying. If teachers who teach high school physics fail the teacher test for physics, then it’s impossible for those teachers to be ineffective and have unacceptable content knowledge. The fact that a 15-yr teacher fails the test must mean that the test is invalid. Is that a fair summary of your statement?
jeanhaverhill@aol.com
that is a matter that is in the hands of each individual and separate state at this point and I am sure you and I would never agree. It is not your privilege to decide and tell the other 49 states that they must do exactly what you want…. These decisions are in flux and are changing monthly if any one is trying to gather these data. The last summary prepared by Educational Research Service on the requirements of the separate states is vastly out of date. A parent in California was trying to gather these kinds of data from the individual states and I don’t know how far he has gotten with the results but he had many contributors. I would give you his name but you would only go there to harass him or try to prove that you are smarter than he is…. or prove that your field of endeavor is vastly superior to his (i don’t even know what industry he works in)
Should kids have to pass any test to graduate from high school? Is a diploma just a participation trophy?
jeanhaverhill@aol.com
there are some valuable experiences you have never had, Virginia/asp/Brian… it is such a great satisfaction to a teacher when a student in 8th grade acts out “Erkel” with the glasses and the suspenders and the 8th grade child beside him says “well it’s funny but it gets old.” Another experience in special ed class you have never had the satisfaction of hearing an autistic child describe his emotions in terms of the beetle’s (he called it “Yesterday Sad”) A parent will observe these as the child grows and I consider myself among the most fortunate of teachers who have observed these developments in our students as the mature. http://sociallyspeakingllc.com/my-mission-for-socially/free-pdfs/childrens_humor_development.pdf
Donna, you can skip Virginia’s comments if you wish.
LOL Donna…. but then, without her clueless response, our more informed and brilliant readers would not have mentioned books that I have not read like“The German War” by Nicholas Stargardt or “Wages of Destruction” by Adam Tooze or this erudite and insightful comment by jeanhavermill:
“Whatever else it was, Adolf Hitler’s short-lived regime was also a colossal industrial process by which the wealth and productive power of much of Europe was wrenched from its normal purposes and converted into a machine for killing. For the economic historian, the great pitched battles of the second world war, from Stalingrad to Midway, are not primarily exercises in strategy, brutality or heroism but the titanic amassing of capital and human beings and their concentration on a point of space and history.
Economic historiography has thrown rays of haggard light into some of the blackest corners of the Third Reich… In his long new book, the Cambridge historian Adam Tooze presents the Third Reich as an engine doomed to smash itself to smithereens not, as for Speer, from bureaucratic turf wars and Hitler’s chaotic office habits, but from its own birth defects.” (from book review in UK Guardian) I get shivers on my spine when I think of the extremes that these corporate/industrialist/armaments can reach and of course Eisenhower’s warnings about the military /industrialist society.
I get the feed, too, Donna, and just skim and ignore raj, virginia and other clueless people.
At Oped, where I write, the publisher has little tolerance for opinions not linked to actual facts, although argument is encouraged, and the commentary threads can go on for days when he or Robert Reich, Chris Hedges and some of the knowledgeable and brilliant editors and readers there post…an it includes some who follow the GOP line of thinking, and put forth opinions that sound rational….unitl the facts are known…and we all know who they are, too.
I hope you still read my comments, Donna, and If yOU wish to communicate with me, by email, just message me at Oped, and I will give you my email, as I have done with many teachers who read here.
Also, you should visit my commentary there http://www.opednews.com/author/comments/author40790.html
and my series
http://www.opednews.com/author/series/author40790.html
I have 338,540 views there and 12,449 just this month, which is why when I link to Diane, she gets some more views from ordinary folks, no just teachers.
these are powerful books I learned a lot about FDR in the 1944 book…. I hope I was careful in putting quotes in when I was quoting Nicholas or Adam Tooze… my own comments are usually banal
There is nothing banal about your comments.
I almost said “dummies for VAM” but I won’t as that sounds like a Trumpism.
“More valuable and rare” skills… that is how we end up with CEO convincing people they are “valued and rare”… as in this article: CEO to Worker Pay Ratios: Average CEO Earns 204 Times Median Worker Pay
Dr. Andrew Chamberlain | August 25, 2015
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There are some accounting firms that will do a bean counting study for you…. Ernst & Ernst& Whinny, Coopers& Lybrand etc… They also will do “down time” studies counting how many minutes the kids stand in line for waiting to use the facilities in the wash rooms or, today, waiting for their time to use a computer or other expensive resource .
The district where I worked for 10 years did one of the studies comparing the roles of diverse professionals in the building — I don’t think I saved a copy and it would be quite old now anyway.
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I don’t think that Virginia/Bryan has any familiarity with the process for National Board certification either. Malcolm Provus was one of my professors and he did a study for the NEA called “time to teach”…. Then in the 1980s Michael Scriven was one of my professors ; things changed somewhat over those decades. Then the whole Sanders in Tennessee with the “Vam” distorted the progress as far as I can envision with their “algorithms” and the sense and meaning and purpose were lost. The McKinsey approach has been just as bad.
Ready to buy some of my cheap ocean front property, Brian?
this one is called “program fidelity” and if you look up Louisa Coates work in Appendix B in the “common-ness of core” you can then compare her article in Psychology Today showing how her work has been distorted in the states as they implant Duncan’s policies. You won’t have to defend Louisa in your reports… but the issue of “Program fidelity” is her masterpiece …
sadly, David Driscoll and his ilk (Martin West, Fordham etc) have reduced this to “grit”…so they can identify the “feckless parents” . Those laggards must be pointed out and we have algorithms that can find them (we determine if they ate curly french fries when they were age 6)…
” Folks need incentives to pursue more difficult but higher value careers. Folks need incentives not to sit at home and receive payments. ”
But you need to address these questions to David Driscoll at NAEP…they totally take “academic self-concept” and reduce it to questionnaires ; then when the questionnaires turn out to have no validity (construct validity) or reliability they say “well the kids lied” and had distorted “self-references”…. But please address your concepts to David Driscoll at NAEP … this is most likely above my pay grade.
“And this token eval system is used to give blanket salary increases to teachers based on their possessing a heartbeat.” I worked under merit pay system in Sudbury MA in 1960 – 1970 (with the exception of one year I taught in Fairfax County VA )… It’s not the place to put all my experiences here and it would be boring to most of the folks who want to read something that has some intellectual meat or “merit” to it.. puns intended…. I wish you could grasp the hyperbole and the irony that are used by Greene and others… it might “lighten” up the whole discussion a bit…. Hyperbole can be an important teaching tool.
Who programmed those computers? Why, people taught by teachers – the true job creators. Back at ya.
this is for virginia/brian/asp not that it will change his mind but it clearly illustrates the principles that are important in my way of thinking (and I believe there are many parents who agree– I find them in some good places on line/social media) http://www.livingindialogue.com/why-high-school-exit-exams-not-students-are-worthless-part-two/http://www.livingindialogue.com/why-high-school-exit-exams-not-students-are-worthless-part-two/ http://www.livingindialogue.com/why-high-school-exit-exams-not-students-are-worthless-part-two/
this weekend I am reading 1944 by Jay Winik (good resources on FDR) and “The German War” by Nicholas Stargardt. In the Stargardt book I came the concept described herein… To apply it here you could say I am using hyperbole but there are definitely some parallels especially given the ethos of “austerity” that we have been living under. quoting Nicholas Stargardt on “performance feeding” in the coal industry in Upper Silesia the managers in charge were taking away food from those who under performed and re-distributing it to those who exceeded the norms. This cannibalistic form of “social Darwinism” became standard practice in Germany in the armaments industry because it was so successful in the Upper Silesia coal . (Nicholas Hardstardt cites a source Wages of Destruction and Making and Breaking of Nazi Economy.) It draws enough parallels that I want to follow up on his primary sources.
Adam Tooze: “Wages of Destruction”…. “Whatever else it was, Adolf Hitler’s short-lived regime was also a colossal industrial process by which the wealth and productive power of much of Europe was wrenched from its normal purposes and converted into a machine for killing. For the economic historian, the great pitched battles of the second world war, from Stalingrad to Midway, are not primarily exercises in strategy, brutality or heroism but the titanic amassing of capital and human beings and their concentration on a point of space and history.
Economic historiography has thrown rays of haggard light into some of the blackest corners of the Third Reich… In his long new book, the Cambridge historian Adam Tooze presents the Third Reich as an engine doomed to smash itself to smithereens not, as for Speer, from bureaucratic turf wars and Hitler’s chaotic office habits, but from its own birth defects.” (from book review in UK Guardian) I get shivers on my spine when I think of the extremes that these corporate/industrialist/armaments can reach and of course Eisenhower’s warnings about the military /industrialist society ….
WOW, what a wonderful parallel, and reference. This is why I love reading at this site.
This is another great example of how teachers and teaching (and therefore learning) are being undermined by a misguided, destructive and demoralizing effort to apply business strategies to the work of supporting human development. I think it may be important for us as educators to recognize that this is happening in many other areas as well…
We are not alone: NYT just published a very interesting article about a group of physicians who are unionizing to fight off this corporatist mentality in their hospital. The author describes this as a struggle on behalf of “the ability of doctors everywhere to exercise their professional judgment” and many commenters agree eloquently – some even drawing the parallel between health care and education.
Sadly, educators are rarely so passionately defended in the public discourse, but I still find it encouraging to hear these arguments against the primacy of profit being articulated at all. Recognizing our profession as one of many facing this kind of attack may help us argue more confidently for the value of teacher judgement and student-centered education.
maybe Virginia/Brian would be pleased with Christie’s proposal… http://bizstandardnews.com/2015/08/23/chris-christie-suggests-teachers-get-minimum-wage-plus-bonuses/
Another Christie proposal Campbell Brown’s Education Summit last fall…
In his discussion with Campbell Brown, New Jersey Governor Christie calls to abolish tenure, or any job protections whatsoever…. no hearings, no independent arbiter… just give leaders the absolute power to just fire teachers at will.
He then offered up this defense. Forget evaluations or hearings. It’s very easy to decide which teachers should be fired, and then separated from their students.
Why Chubbo says that it takes all of ten minutes!
(21:13 – 21:54)
(21:13 – 21:54)
CHRISTIE (to the parents):
“Let me ask you a question, ’cause there’s a lot of people out here who care about education. When you go to ‘Back To School Night’, is there ever a doubt in your mind within ten minutes of getting in that classroom, whether that’s a good teacher or a bad teacher? Ever?
“You’re either in there going, ‘It’s gonna be a good year,’
” … or you’re… ‘Oh God. This is going to be a problem.’
“You don’t need a PhD in education to understand this (i.e. decide which teachers should be fired). If we (parents) can figure it out in ten minutes, then why can’t we have a tenure system that holds teacher to account, and that has parents understanding that they (parents) can have an impact on that, too.”
——————–
Could you imagine if you had a teacher saying the CONVERSE of this at a public forum… that a TEACHER can tell within ten minutes whether a PARENT is unfit, and thus, should have their child taken away by Child Services?
TEACHER: (to the teachers):
“Let me ask you a question, ’cause there’s a lot of people out here who care about parenting. When you go to “Back To School Night”, is there ever a doubt in your mind within ten minutes of meeting a parent whether that’s a good parent or a bad parent? Ever?
“You’re either in there going, ‘It’s gonna be a good year,’
” … or you’re… ‘Oh God. This is going to be be a problem.’
“You don’t need a PhD in child services or social work to understand this (i.e. decide which parent should have their children taken away). If we (teachers) can figure it out in ten minutes, then why can’t we have a child and family services system that holds parents to account, and that has teachers understanding that they (teachers) can have an impact on that, too.”
——————–
Jean,
Minimum wage plus bonuses will surely raise the status of the profession. Yet another example proving that Christie hates teachers.
I realize what Governor Bully Christie is up to. 8 years ago my significant other’s daughter from NJ used to call her dad on the phone and say “Chrstie’s getting rid of teacher pensions”… knowing we were both on teacher pension in Masachusetts. I would suggest : “Tell her you will call her back tomorrow”…. The destruction of the middle class is an intentional goal not a byproduct of their greed; it is policies that we see every day from people like M. Petrilli, Jay P Greene, Andy Smarick, Paul Schumpeter Peterson etc David Driscoll (NAEP) is one of their club members, too. After 15 years of listening to them I ‘ m sick of it. I was being sarcastic by trying to give Virginia/Brian a little bit to “chew ” on that he would love to swallow and would enjoy the delicacies.
jeanhaverhill, thank you for bringing up this topic. I am not on the record as saying teachers make too much (although ineffective teachers probably make too much regardless of salary and highly effective ones too little). I do not agree with Christie as to a minimum wage base plus bonuses. I do advocate Dallas, TX’s model where teachers start at a reasonable base and move up based on proven capability and leadership (dept head, mentorship, etc.). Teachers, in theory, could reach the max step in 8 years and earn $90K+. That’s how every private sector business works… you get promoted as you prove it.
But I am currently in a discussion with my district about teacher salaries. Notional BA teacher salaries start at $48K/yr for 200 days and rises to $93K/yr for the top Step 30. If you add in MA or EdD scales, it rises to $104K and even $108K+. But when you add in the 18% pension contributions from the district, a starting masters degree teacher makes $64K/yr to start and rises to $130K/yr for EdD’s at step 30. In Loudoun, VA, teachers get paid a LOT.
But you wouldn’t know if from the local discussion. Our Supt claims he needs to raise salaries to “compete”. We are an exurb of DC. Fairfax, VA is a suburb of DC (one county closer) with much higher costs of living. Fairfax also has 3x the population and students we do. Loudoun’s teacher salaries are higher for step 1 and step 30. But yet our Supt wants to raise salaries to compete! Say what?
So I compared our salaries to other districts where teachers make much less (see NC). Apparently, we just just aren’t paying enough to keep these teachers from leaving though. For our top step, the following amounts are just too little. Loudoun step 30 teachers make more than these districts by:
Fairfax, VA: $6800 less than LCPS
Virginia Beach, VA: $19.5K less than LCPS
Durham, NC: $36K less than LCPS
Knoxville, TN: $41K less than LCPS
This is the kind of nonsense that we are tired of. Yes, NC teachers appear to make abysmal salaries. That’s not the case everywhere. If you are a teacher with a great EVAAS score, come to Loudoun. In addition to high salaries, we also have the following benefits:
1. Very low %’s of ELL and FRL populations (~1/2 that of Fairfax, VA)
2. No midterms or finals to speak of (yes, our Supt doesn’t like tests so he just arbitrarily eliminated those)
3. “Heartbeat” evaluations (99.5% of our teachers are rated as great and no standardized test scores are used)
How could you go wrong? By the way, we hire 700 new teachers per year but our personnel dept is so incompetent, they have gaps all over the place. Any new teachers want to earn $64K to start?
Virginia,
I am glad to know that Dallas is doing things right. That being the case, why are people in Dallas so disappointed in the results? You seem to have contradicted yourself here because your model of success is not successful by the usual measures. The last superintendent, Mike Miles, drove out many of those carefully chosen teachers and he failed to see any improvement in test scores during his three-year time in office.
Here are a couple more. I’m sure you won’t have a problem finishing your critique a.s.p.
Purpose: The purpose of this article is to provide a written transcript of the 2009 Claremont Evaluation Debates. The first debate is between Michael Quinn Patton and Michael Scriven on the promise and pitfalls of utilization-focused evaluation. The second debate is between David Fetterman, Michael Quinn Patton, and Michael Scriven on the promise and pitfalls of empowerment evaluation.
Setting: The debates occurred at the Claremont Graduate University on August 23-24, 2009. Several hundred evaluators from around the world also viewed and participated in the debates via a live webcast.
Intervention: Not applicable.
Research Design: Not applicable.
Data Collection and Analysis: Not applicable. Findings: Not applicable.
Keywords: utilization-focused evaluation, empowerment evaluation, evaluation theory __________________________________
FYI for interested readers, VA SGP is NOT involved in any talks with his school district about salaries or any other issues. What he means is that he is trolling social media and cyber bullying his district through the comment sections of the local papers on top of filing frivolous law suits that are costly and unproductive. He has, in fact, been issued a no trespassing order at his own childrens’ school. Not a reliable source. But most of you have probably figured that out.
Jill Lancaster, you might want to think twice about posting nonsense on here. Diane is a big free speech advocate even though she has the right to censor her blog. It makes you appear weak, Jill, to not refute anything I say but merely call me names. And btw, Diane and her readers are quite aware of the lawsuit I filed against the chairman of our district, the right-hand man of charter school billionaire Dennis Bakke, who thought he could push charter schools into Loudoun without ever disclosing his ties.
Folks, Jill is upset that I encouraged readers to take a look and join the debate on Diane’s blog. One of their trumped up allegations was that employees at my kids’ school were “threatened” by me. But the emails clearly show they were not scared of any physical threat, but of being made famous on Diane’s national blog. I have never mentioned any teacher names, just admins responsible for policy. And Jill is upset that I have exposed the real salary scale of our teachers whose top step pays:
1. $6800 more than more affluent Fairfax County, VA to the east
2. $19,500/yr more than affluent Virginia Beach, VA
3. $36,000/yr more than Durham/Chapel Hill, NC (that’s the highest teacher pay in NC btw)
4. $41,000/yr more than Knoxville, TN
While we are an affluent county ($122k/yr household median income), two 1st-year teachers with Masters degree would earn a combined $124K/yr in our district. And we hire over 700 new teachers every year. Would any effective teachers like to move to Loudoun County, VA?
Remember, Loudoun teachers don’t give midterms/finals, don’t use standardized test scores to evaluate teachers, and all teachers (well, 99.5%+) are rated effective. Our ESL/FRL rates are among the lowest in the mid-Atlantic. You may be struggling in an urban environment. We are the exact opposite where you have the best pay and the best students. Jill Lancaster simply doesn’t want me to point that out.
It’s absolutely ludicrous, isn’t it, to think that those who have skills of higher value should be paid more than what is paid those who have skills of lesser value to offer. “From each according to his ability, to each according to his need” should be the order of the day, shouldn’t it? [smile]
S.h.e.e.e.s.h…reading the comments here – particularly of those who seem to think that everyone SHOULD be paid the same, regardless of what they “bring to the table” – one quickly comes to understand why education is in the shape it is in today. In truth, many of these [so-called] “educators” should never be allowed to come into contact with our society’s children at all, lest they inflict upon them the peculiar brand of “gimme, gimme” ism they’re infected with.
Isn’t it time that teachers actually became TEACHERS…and NOT just parasites on society?
You sound jealous. Sorry you missed out on the gravy train. Parasites? I consider myself more of a money sucking leech. Excuse me but my gardener and masseuse are arguing again and if I don’t stop them they will wake the maids from the PM shift.
Skills of Higher value according to whose value? Yours? The students, the parents, the district in which they live, the state they live in, the tech companies, the defense companies??? In education –Skills of “higher value” are debatable. Give it a rest.
Well, I can understand your hostility toward teachers. Obviously yours failed to teach you anything. But I think you have to allow for the defective raw material they were working with….
so now teachers are relegated to the “Useless eaters” and the “Superfluous people” category. Maybe Ken is just attempting to create more “dialogue” but i will go with Carol Burris’ expression “If I take the bait I am a fish”….. I took the “bait” from Virginia/Brain in previous posts when I should have walked away. The meanest thing I can say is “Governor Bully Christie” It’s obvious that people like Ken don’t read anything from Robert Reich .
jeanhaverhill, why would you say that? Are you saying that all teachers should earn exactly the same? Are you possibly suggesting that Harvard’s American Indian professor Elizabeth Warren was overpaid at $400K/yr when other profs and assoc profs were paid so much less? Or do you just oppose STEM teachers getting higher pay?
AlwaysLearning, congratulations, you are going to learn something today too! You may not have been aware of this, but you live in a capitalist nation. That means that markets set the prices. When skills are of higher value and scarce supply (e.g. STEM teachers), price rises. When skills are of lower value to the population (e.g. art history teachers) or are in great supply (think astronauts), prices fall. I would recommend you read Free to Choose by the late, great Milton Friedman if you would like to understand these concepts.
KenMeyer, given the ignorance of both the American population and especially educational profession on how capitalism works, I suggest we give every 10th grade student taking civics a copy of Friedman’s Free to Choose. If educators like AlwaysLearning want the opposing viewpoint, she can teach her viewpoint using Marx’ Communist Manifesto. May the best ideas win.
I handled this question during the last election cycle… It was attacks against Martha Coakley (she was used on cable tv to insult anyone running — Joe and Mika would call anyone “the Connecticut Martha Coakley) and in my town there was a 3 story mural painted on the side of a building that said “vote for the Colonel not the Indian. She had her salaries decided based on her experiences in law/courts/ the judicial system not based on the educational system. But I don’t want to go back to that experience because at least three of my maternal ancestors in MA had Native American ancestry.. Let’s not go there (it was discussed on the Diane Ravitch blog back during the previous election cycle). If you are interested in the DNA of Native American women, go the our Facebook page on Sanderson Genealogy … you will find some interesting Non Paternal Events quoted there because the women were Native American and the church had not recorded a marriage… But let’s not bore these good people her with such a tangent… Sanderson Genealogy on FB is by A. Stocker a retired genealogist and it covers the names Sanderson/Saunders/Sanders)
why would you say that? Are you saying that all teachers should earn exactly the same? Are you possibly suggesting that Harvard’s American Indian professor Elizabeth Warren was overpaid at $400K/yr when other profs and assoc profs were paid so much less? Or do you just oppose STEM teachers getting higher pay?
jeanhaverhill@aol.com
Must be “parasites” is the new word in Reform circles. Glad they replaced “lazy, communists” and “heathen, scum”. I was getting tired of those descriptions for our country’s educators.
Ken,
Do you teach? Have you ever taught? If so what levels and how many years?
Allow me to answer first (you know, the modelling technique) No, I’m retired from over 20 years of teaching the vast majority being high school Spanish.
You can do it! (you know, encouragement technique)
Vsgp, I would think your side would rather like Mein Kampf instead of Friedman. I hear it is out in print again. Not everyone who values true American hard work and fair compensation for a job well done is a Marxist. And collaboration does not mean communism. But I’ll direct you to Adam Smith’s first book prior Wealth of Nations which discussed morality. And when it comes to Friedman v Keynes in practice, Milton fails miserably.
Too bad people like you and Emperor Viginia who have no clue how deformers crashed your pie-in-the-sky worldview(a.k.a. meritocracy). Kicking the can down the road. Obviously, you never teach yourself.
Math and science teachers, once they are tenured, could have their state and federal taxes waived. This would not take money away from other teachers and would not cost the local districts any money either. The feds then skim the lost revenue fro the bloated defense budget.
Don’t kid yourself about where that makeup tax money would come from. Certainly not the MIC. And it’s still a crappy idea as it is.
like/agreed… “it’s a crappy idea”
The one-party rule in Indiana is doing everything it can to destroy public education with proposed legislation like this from Rep. Miller. What they are doing is no different than the poisoning of the water system in Flint MI. Here is a post from my blog about the destruction in Indiana. http://mikeandteresakendall.blogspot.com/
Poison. Webster defines it as something such as idea, emotion or situation that is very harmful.
Poison has been in the news lately when it was discovered that the public water supply in Flint Michigan had been poisoned by Governor Rick Snyder’s appointees that run the city, decided to switch the water source from lake water from Detroit to river water in Flint. This heavy-handed administrative policy approved by the Michigan Governor, despite warnings of possible lead poisoning caused by caustic river water, was ignored all for the sake of ideology. Snyder is one of those reform types of politicians that seem to know what is best for people, provided they are poor and preferably a minority. Even though he was made aware of the problem in February of 2015, nothing was done to correct the problem despite the cries of numbers of state staffers, the press, along with the Mayor and citizens of Flint.
Rick Snyder finally apologized for the mistake and has declared Flint a “man-made disaster”. Man-made for the bad ideology based decisions that will take billions of dollars to fix for everything from an entire new water system to the long term care of all of the children who were poisoned- just so a politician could point to his “fiscal responsibility.”
Indiana has its own poison, a man-made disaster that is costing us billions. Our public education system is being poisoned by the same kind of ideologues – politicians that implement heavy-handed top down mandates based on nothing more than the preferences of their wealthy donors. The ones poisoning public education stretch from the state house to out of state billionaires looking to make a profit on the tax-payers backs.
The purveyors of this destruction start with Mitch Daniels’ budget cuts to education, and continue on with the Indiana State House Education Committee Chairman Bob Behning who has brought us unlimited private school vouchers that bleed funds from local school districts for students that have never even attended a public school; and with Dennis Kruse, the Indiana State Senate Education Committee Chairman who along with Behning allowed “reforms” like forgiving loans to charter schools that fail, and changing laws that take away the powers of the elected State Superintendent. And we can’t forget how much damage Mike Pence has brought to Indiana’s education system by loading the State Board of Education with charter school administrators and relatives of Republican House members, all so he can increase the number of charter schools that can be profit makers for his wealthy donors. Pence brought the public school destruction to a new level by making ISTEP the “dumpster fire” that has been a complete waste of time and $24 million by insisting that the state continue with a flawed test that is no longer valid and will only brand schools and communities with a failing label that do not deserve.
There is a long list of elected state officials that are leading the charge to take down our public schools such as Pence, Behning, and Kruse. But there many Republican legislators along with a few Democrats that are responsible for enabling the destruction. Legislators that pass laws to allow a private charter school company to take ownership of a public school building for one dollar; representatives that find it acceptable to cut educational funding for public schools, and then take even more from the public education budget to finance private schools. State Senators that insist the state spend millions on testing but refuse to provide enough funding to allow public school kids to have art and music classes.
Since Mitch Daniels started his destruction there have been 111 new laws passed that have poisoned public education. It’s time we look at the damage and hold people responsible. While both parties have had a hand in the reforms, the GOP has been the leader and they have to own it. With low voter turnout, and uncontested elections, the Republican’s tight grip on the Statehouse will continue unless voters decide to stand up and make a change.
It could take billions of dollars and decades to recover from the damage caused by these ideologues. Let’s vote Pence, Behning and Kruse out of office. Stop the poison.
I am definitely agreeing with Teresa: ” Our public education system is being poisoned by the same kind of ideologues – politicians that implement heavy-handed top down mandates based on nothing more than the preferences of their wealthy donors. The ones poisoning public education stretch from the state house to out of state billionaires looking to make a profit on the tax-payers backs.” and I name David Driscoll (NAEP) among them and I will call it a cabal, or an “interlocking directorate” or identify it as a purposeful governmental strategy- – we have seen it coming through the neo liberals and the neo-conservatives surrounding Arne Duncan … It is embedded in the bureaucracy and the “educrats” in the state department like Mitchell Chester in MA. They are also turning out “future leaders” for principals and superintendents as Paul Schumpeter Peterson is doing. “Checkers” Finn may have retired from the F.I. main role but he is instrumental in fostering the same goals and those individuals feed to the Governors as “experts” in education. Sandra Stotsky has described some of it at the state level in her article on “Trojan Horses”. One area where I see the parents are criticizing right now is the ESSA “family engagement” approach and I intend to help parents in describing what they see as encroaching on the home/family when the feds or the state bureaucracy will over reach.
these are the “Trojan Horses” that Stotsky brings forth that are specific to Massachusetts. Her longer article lists different states (not just MA)… http://newbostonpost.com/2016/01/08/deliberately-deceiving-the-public-on-common-core/
The interlocking directorates are shaped to an ever increasing degree by philanthropoliticians, with Bill Gates in particular seeking others in the foundation world to demolish public education and higher education–joined by all too eager “education leaders.”
A recent example is the Gates push to take over teacher education accreditation and certification via a Gates funded “Inspectorate” system in tandem with four other initiatives to “transform teacher education.” Among these is setting up criteria for all teacher preparations programs in Massachusetts, empowering Relay Graduate School of Education to propagate it’s vision of “best practice” in education, funneling money to several universities to remove higher education from teacher preparation placing that responsibility in districts, and ramping up rating schemes for teacher preparation to fit the ideological agenda of the National Center for Teacher Quality. NCTQ is infamous for U.S. News and World Report rankings of teacher education programs with not an ounce of methodological credibility to warrant these. NCTQ promotes the use of specific texts for teaching reading and math–both from Pearson, and no surprise on the advisory panel for NCQT, endorsing these ratings none other than Sir Michael Barber, the Chief Education Advisor for Pearson International and Wendy Kopp founder of Teach for America, coincidently a favored alternative certification program in NCTQ’s Teacher Prep Review (the source of ratings).
like/agreed. Silber wanted to have all the teachers trained at Boston University . Fortunately, that didn’t happen… but this plan is more devious and deceptive…. On the April meeting of MACTE (faculty mostly adjunct form Colleges of Teacher Education who affiliate with ACTE) it is a discussion item. Yesterday, I sent the program chair a request to disseminate a questionnaire/survey on the experiences the faculty are having with these CAP procedures… but that will take a committee approval so I don’t imagine it can be in place before the April meeting. A colleague who works at Simmons and one at Lesley have reviewed the questionnaire … if you would like to see it I can get a copy to you by Monday or Tuesday. The woman in the State Department is Heather Pesky and she said at the last MACTE meeting “we are not attempting to shut you down” but that is a consequence of what they are putting in place. I get these initials /acronym out of place sometimes but look at NPTE states (MA is one of about 7 Connecticut etc)… They have already put their data gathering into 3 different colleges and the people present their “data” at the MACTE meetings … I can send you the agenda (even if you don’t live in MA it might be helpful?)
this is the letter they sent out with the April MACTE agenda… ”
a flyer from DESE focused on recruiting program approval reviewers for next year. Here is the text from DESE’s email:
Dear Colleagues,
Next year, nearly 4,500 candidates will complete an educator preparation program and become employed in a Massachusetts public school. Tens of thousands of students will depend daily on the knowledge and skills of the teachers and leaders prepared in these programs.
ESE is preparing to select the cohort of reviewers that help determine the quality of these preparation programs and we need your help. ESE relies heavily on the skilled and committed professionals who are selected as reviewers to review, analyze, and evaluate evidence of educator preparation program effectiveness in the Commonwealth.
As the leader of networks of stakeholders in education, we hope you can help us recruit:
· Start spreading the word. We have provided a short blurb below and an attached flyer to ease communication with your network of educators. If you would, please CC me on any outgoing communication in order to help us track outreach.
· Tell us if you have specific publications or events that could help spread the word about applying.
· Nominate specific people through this online nomination form. Applicants can apply online here.
We are looking for teachers, administrators, district staff, professional support personnel and other engaged education professionals with experience in PK-12 education or educator preparation.
The application for RETURNING reviewers should only take 30-45 minutes (some logistics info and then 2 quick reflection questions).
——————————————————————–
If you live in MA consider volunteering for this? You don’t have to work at one of the colleges. There is also something to be said for NOT volunteering.
Math Value…. thanks for the reminders of names we have been called… I would add to the list “marriage wreckers” which came specifically from the Fordham Institute. This one was intentionally aimed at the female gendered teachers but all the one’s you cite are non-specific to gender. One of my friends in Cambridge remembers her mom organizing union labor protests on the docks in NY and she could add a few blistering phrases so i will ask her. Also, Michael Fiorillo has a classic/iconic description of the Bread and Roses strike that would fit into this module.
And Christie calls teachers the most “destructive force” in education. Kasich called a police officer an “idiot” for writing him a ticket. And these names are just the nice ones they use in public.
There was someone writing here in comments last year who said on her dissertation that she was not allowed to use any references cited from prior to (like 2001) — I forget the exact date… but to me that is so wrong. Her professors obviously don’t understand the word “canonical” and don’t know the history of research. With that apology, give me the luxury of citing this article. I consider myself to be among the most fortunate to have actually met Malcollm Provus and Michael Scriven in person and to have learned from them… Here is one that shows important threads that have been lost when we focus on “test scores” from experimental tests to evaluate anything — especially the teachers (but it is absolutely unfair to the students as well)….
Click to access DUTIES_OF_THE_TEACHER.pdf
Thanks for that link Jean!!
https://www.wmich.edu/sites/default/files/attachments/u58/2015/Contemporary_Thinking_About_Causation.pdf for those of you who don’t like my 1994 references…. These threads on evaluation run through the work of a lifetime career. That is why M. Scriven has what is called “wisdom”…. it comes with old age. I should thank Gerry Sroufe from AERA for making the work of people like M. Scriven more available .
Duane/Ken… I remember this discussion when certification changes were being made and the programs were altered so that a teacher could not just study the art of teaching (and learn skills, strategies, curriculum etc) but had to have a subject specialty major. I know one woman in particular who struggled to get a D in Physics or just to pass… and it did not make her a better elementary teacher knowing that content from physics. Today we have tests that fail , for example, a teacher with 15 years of successful classroom experience, who speak 3 languages (as Julie does) and she fails the Pearson test by 2 points. I am saying the same things about our students. not just defending teachers that I know…. The GED test is a one of the worst example where this is happening…
virginia/brian/asp “Peter Greene’s silly blogs. Peter doesn’t even try to refute the core argument. That is a sign of a lightweight who doesn’t understand.” If you look at frameworks for cognitive development, you will find that humor is one of the highest forms of intelligence and being able to use it appropriately is like one of Freud’s best defense mechanisms as well. Instead of being silly, Peter is showing one of the highest forms of “intelligence” as it is measured across domains and across disciplines. (cf. Sternberg’s definitions or the work of Scott Barry Kaufman called by the unfortunate title of “ungifted”) Most the ELA/literature teachers here I think would agree that they have the teaching of irony and hyperbole in the curriculum frameworks and find appropriate ways to introduce it.
Brian stated:
“That’s how every private sector business works… you get promoted as you prove it.”
Perhaps in business textbooks that is how it works but from my experiences (worked in the business sector until I was 38/9) that is not how it works at all. Nepotism, cronyism, ass kissing are the proven promotion means.
Amen. It is called crony capitalism for a reason. The people most insistent on a “free market” more often than not have never truly worked in one or are well cushioned from its effects. Like Trump getting millions from his dad, Romney’s trust funds, or Bush family power. Or they are retired early and have no skin in the game. The truth is the “free market” is neither free nor a market. The system is rigged and those that work the hardest and produce the best results are compensated the least.
I’ll add it is the “free market” believers that have given rise to Trump. Anybody in the real world and not sheltered from “free market” destruction would agree our system is badly broken. People who have worked all their lives and played by the “free market” rules are waking up to the fact they have been duped and lied to by those creating a rigged system. Socialized risk, privatized reward. Since establishment Republicans now control states, SCOTUS, local governments, Congress, media, and business increasingly for the past several decades, it is pretty clear they are to blame for failed economic and social policies. Wonder if they will now preach “accountability” from their gerrymandered districts and voter suppressed states?
I understand Trump supporters’ anger. I just think they are being manipulated yet again when Bernie’s Democratic Socialism would better serve their interests. And no, Democratic Socialism is not communism for those that can’t tell the difference.
Salute senõr Swacker. Your statement is 100+% accurate.
I refused to play golf with management one weekend. This has cost me my promotion which I am qualified for.
I always prefer to be with my child over the a** kissing for any promotion on the weekend. May

CALL FOR PRESENTATIONS Submission Deadline: April 1, 2016
If you live in MA consider preparing a one hour presentation.
P
roposals currently being sought for one hour presentations at the MACTE/COMTEC/MAECTE Spring conference on April 15, 2016. Conference Title: Family and Community Engagement
Keynote Speaker: Dr. Karen Mapp
Conference Location: Publick House Sturbridge, 277 Main St. Sturbridge, MA 01566
Possible topics for presentation include
1. Family and Community Engagement
• How are teacher candidates being prepared to engage families? What strategies do candidates develop to effectively collaborate with families and communities to create and implement strategies for supporting student learning and development? What strategies do candidates develop to welcome and encourage families to support student learning and development both at home and at school?
2. Partnerships with P-12
• What kinds of partnerships do institutions have with P-12 School Districts? What was the process for setting them up? What is their governance structure? How do they function?
3. CAP Implementation
• What have been/are the significant challenges with implementing CAP and how has your organization addressed them?
• Based on your experience with CAP, what processes/procedures has your organization put in place for full implementation of CAP in 2016-2017?
4. Teacher preparation programs and policy
• What role do policy makers play in our work preparing educators? How do/should we develop relationships with policy makers? How can we get our message out to policy makers to inform their work?
Proposal Requirements (Submission Deadline: April 1, 2016)
Proposals should be submitted electronically to Marge Magouirk Colbert (magouirk@educ.umass.edu)
• Presenters’ contact information & institutional affiliation (include all presenters)
• Presenters bios (~50 words)
• Title of one hour session
• Abstract of your presentation (250 – 300 words)
• Summary of your presentation for conference program (50 words)
————————————————————————————————
The Merit Pay Lie from peter Greene:
“Here’s a quick report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. This particular piece only covers 2006-2009, but it’s unlikely that the stats we’re looking at have changed dramatically.”
“What percentage of the private workforce– you know, that private sector where “everybody” accepts having their pay tied to their results– how much of that private work-force is composed of workers whose earnings are tied to sales or output?”
5%.
http://curmudgucation.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-merit-pay-lie.html
Even in sales, companies play games and it isn’t a 100% correlation between output and pay. There were some articles floating around recently about how with stock options, a popular TEAM motivation idea in tech, it is often the employees who are shafted while the investors and execs win regardless of outcome. So much for meritocracy.
Ok, so I’m not going to argue that merit pay will drive short-term performance from teachers. Certainly teachers are not built that way. But you are missing the point.
How many teachers on this blog have claimed to have considered leaving because of the pay? If so, you are admitting higher pay would cause you to stay or at least consider it more seriously. But we don’t want everyone to stay, only the good ones. And we need our STEM-trained teachers most of all. Heck, Diane herself has noted that school districts may not have the funds to entice the most qualified STEM workers to come teach.
Economics is the study of unlimited wants constrained by limited resources. I know you all would like to pay every teacher (good or bad, relevant subject or not) $200K/year. That’s not going to happen. Someone must decide how to distribute the funds. There is not as many opportunities for an elementary teacher than there is for a HS Calculus teacher in the private sector. That’s the facts.
The same thing happens in every sector. STEM workers get paid more than secretaries. Even tech workers in the military get paid more than US Marines who get shot at. Why? Supply and demand. If you want to live in communism, go visit Cuba or North Korea. Almost everyone else figured out it was a very bad idea.
As a Hoosier, I am sickened by the unenlightened thinking of the GOP-majority in both chambers of the Indianapolis statehouse. The author of this bill seems to think that every teacher is motivated by money; if I just dangle a little in front of the teachers, they’ll drool like besotted Wall Street bankers. A typically business-minded solution to an education problem.
I am a STEM teacher (having taught both math and science). I have never sought more money than my colleagues; I realized that I had to earn my spurs just like my colleagues with equal experience. The idea that they are offering more money to STEM teachers (to attract new ones? to keep old timers like me from leaving?) is repugnant.
Will somebody PLEASE get the message out to Indiana’s voters that the GOP has lost its grip on reality when it comes to education?
THE MESSAGE?
THERE ARE 15,880 SCHOOL DISTRICTS and that makes it ideal to fool residents.
Who is going to deliver this message, that has been HERE AT THIS SITE, an so many places?
My series at Oped, has links here ant to the best blogs, explaining the tragedy and the plan. http://www.opednews.com/author/series/author40790.html
The media is COMPLICIT… THE PEOPLE ARE INUNDATED WITH LIES.
WHEN THAT HAPPENS , the lie is repeated not he media then THIS HAPPENS
http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Why-Urban-Legends-Get-Told-in-Sci_Tech-People_Study_Threat_Urban-Legends-160108-521.html
So, you teachers have to organzie there, like they did in NY districts throughout NY state, The NPE has people who fought and won some battles in NY , where the governor is anti-teacher, anti-union, anti public school and a big fan VAM and expensive Pearson products.
To all authorities on education matters in America:
Please be educated and cultivated in treasuring teaching profession.
Please remember that whoever intentionally destroys public education, these politicians should be criminalized for pushing many younger American generations into MODERN SLAVERY in the NEAR future.
Children only LEARN when they are HAPPY. Children are happy when their parents have stable jobs. Jobs are only stable when worker are provided with training from manufacturers. This will prosper manufacturers and national economy in the long term.
We have seen that there are many foreigners who gradually own American prime real estates, banking business and many other industries under HIDDEN legal corporate.
Without PROPER education system, there will not be any EXCELLENT TEACHER. All shortcuts in learning and lots of high-stakes testing will yield ROBOT WORKERS. This means NO CREATIVITY = NO LEADING in any specialty. Back2basic
Jan 16 is the anniversary of the Bread and Roses strike in Lawrence MA. New York City Educator offered an excellent comment/post here at the Diane Ravitch blog in honor of the families of the strikers. Here is one quote from NYC-educator “Fight Fiercely, Harvard:” Massachusetts Militia (composed largely of Harvard students) confronts Lawrence strikers in 1912
In fact, public and private universities at the time were so identified with monopoly capital that their very nicknames stand as signposts of their class identification: “Standard Oil University” (U of Chicago), “Southern Pacific University” (Stanford), “Pillsbury University (U of Minnesota). —————————————————————————————————-
I guess we are back in that century because we now have University of Walton and others owned by the Koch brothers …
http://nyceducator.com/2010/09/ivy-league-union-busters-then-and-now.html
Thank you jeanhaverhill for the link
http://nyceducator.com/2010/09/ivy-league-union-busters-then-and-now.html
I would love to repeat the important paragraph from the COMMENT of that link article
[start paragraph]
…
However, Harvard, Fordham Institute (and given the new “MIT” study with Brown affiliate; the think tanks with the advanced graduate degrees in policy science) are just doing what they always did:
– align with POWER IN THE CAPITAL SENSE
– gather power in the uniform of a militia or police tribe and
– beat up on the local workers in the factories then,
– accuse the teachers or other workers of being “stubborn”, “recalcitrant” or incompetent to DIVIDE THEM from the every day laborers such as represented by the Bread and Roses strike.
[end paragraph]
In short, the fascist and communist who is misguided as capitalist by using people WITHOUT HUMANISTIC EDUCATION (= technocrat), and manipulate the military (= terrorists) in order to destroy the real capitalism with humanity.
That is why my parents constantly remind us NOT TO TRUST people who cannot defend themselves from body, mind and spirit aspects. In the same vein, we cannot trust a country where people are completely brain-washed and malnourished with IDIOCY IDEOLOGY = lack of humanistic education = lack of basic food and clean water.
If we are the TRUE EDUCATORS, please go to the sources in order to FIND OUT and FIGURE OUT the way to cultivate and educate teenagers from middle school up to university education about sharing, caring, and kindness in the true sense of humanity and responsibility of being a human within a logical mindset.
This LOGICAL mindset is to understand the FUNCTION and the REQUIREMENT for the well-being of our HUMAN BODY. There is a true equality in all human organs in the sense of importance to keep us ALIVE = learning and working with JOY.
From the brain to the intestine, the hair to the nail, the mouth to the a**, each part needs to be well care for the whole well-being of a human being,.
From leader to laborer, each person needs to be cultivated in humanistic education for the whole well-being of a country. Back2basic
based on your comment, you might enjoy this quote that Frank Bird III posted earlier today on line… ““Is it possible for an educational system to be conducted by a national state and yet the full social ends of the educative process not be restricted, constrained, and corrupted?” John Dewey
the article in the link NYCity educator was written by Michael Fiorillo ; he often comments here on the Diane Ravitch blog and I have thanked him many times for his insights. That is where I originally read his comments on the Bread and Roses strike and his iconic image from the city (the image is also available from Zinn Education Institute along with some other appropriate resources for teaching about the Bread and Roses strike).
m4potw … your thoughts reminded me of this part of a poem… “Thanks to the human heart by which we live,
Thanks to its tenderness, its joys, and fears,
To me the meanest flower that blows can give
Thoughts that do often lie too deep for tears.”
Thank you for your recommendation, guru jeanhaverhill. My mother keeps remind me that on Earth, the dichotomy is inevitable, and that intelligence or idiocy has the same fate – death. However, without understanding humanistic value, people will ignorantly self destroy themselves. The only solution to live forever is to learn to detach our emotion in GREED, LUST and EGO. So far, the only person on Earth has achieved this solution is the PHILOSOPHER BUDDHA.
As long as righteousness and rightfulness did not agree on the humanistic value, we will NEVER achieve “”an educational system to be conducted by a national state and yet the full social ends of the educative process not be restricted, constrained, and corrupted?” John Dewey.”” May
ECON 101… Virginia/Brian/ this would be included in my course for Econ 101.. “Economist Henry Levin, for example recognized the limits of the market. Citing a Federal Trade Commission finding that goods purchased wholesale for $1 sold for an average of $1.65 on the general market and $2.65 in stores in poor neighborhoods, Levin argued that ‘the failure of the market to give rich and poor equal access to privately produced goods and services should, in itself, make us skeptical about applying it to education.’ Henry M. Levin, The Failure of the Public Schools and the Free Market Remedy, 2 URB. REV. 32, 34 (1968). Among Levin’s concerns was that fewer sellers of quality educational services would appeal to children of the poor than to those of the middle class. “
Based on the fact that i live in a less affluent /urban area, I have to go 3 towns over to look for Whole Foods; I have to drive 1/2 hour or more for a trader Joe’s… The “free market” so called is not going to locate those stores near my city.
This also applies to another fact: graduation rates are also affected buy the distance the student is from the college (and of course how many part time jobs they have to work to earn their tuition which takes away from their studies and delays the graduation date)
I had asked you before to read henry Levin on his evaluations of the effectiveness of technology (he actually promotes it under the right circumstances)
You don’t read it but you tell me I would fail Econ 101 because I am a silly liberal.
The recent book that clearly describes for me the so called “free market” is Waking the Frog that talks about why the so called free market is not able to resolve issues of climate change.
jeanhaverhill, I am not claiming that the free market solves issues of public goods or externalities. We can collectively decide that certain products should be subsidized (phone access, public school, highways/tolls, etc.).
But that’s not the same thing as socialism. If you determine the cost it requires to teach different types of students (FRL, ESL, SpEd, etc.) and then provide funds based on the student population, you can still encourage free markets to solve those problems. When charters or even public schools received different amounts based on the complexity of the student (this is how the ACA works), then such kids would have options for quality education.
Note that cap-and-trade is an attempt to apply the free market to climate change. I have my doubts on the zealotry of the climate change crowd but I would support a carbon tax over a cap.
I’m not sure anybody would support an unfettered market (where even fraud was allowed). I have to review your prior comments to respond more completely but I will.
I have seen formulas that spell out a student in SPED requires 1.5 for the funding of resorces/programs so that would be over and above the amount for a general education pupil; but when do these suggestions actually get implemented? We have seen nothing but cuts. The federal government (Melody Musgrove in particular in the OSERS) is set to disabuse the local IEP teams (parents and teachers who know the student best) of their “attitudes” about what the students need and it is all based on cost avoidance. These austerity provisions have become entrenched in the bureaucracy at state and federal levels .
I can cite you fraud in the public schools in Massachusetts. A former superintendent siphoned off over 30 million dollars in a “special school” from special education funds and even though the attorney general’s office has boxes of files no charges have been filed to date. They took his pension away and the judge gave it back to him. One man received a $5,000 fine over this; one was supposedly indicted. There has been repeated fraud in other states and sites. The legislation will close the barn door after the horse is stolen as they did in Massachusetts but they have not closed all the loopholes. Google John Barranco in the Boston Globe and tell me if you think that is ethical . His assistant was earning as much as he was and she went to a FL University to teach “management”… I wrote to the University and requested they transfer her to teaching Hypnosis because she was not ethical in management standards. This is only one case and I’m sure others in FL or OH can tell you more.
in the MA case I cited that is in the Boston Globe, the Board kept telling the former superintendent “you have saved money one these special education students ; therefore you deserve a higher salary this year”… In some states there are rules that state if cost avoidance results in a budget “savings” or “surplus” that money goes back to the educational fund or the general fund. With a hand picked board of his friends he was able to get his salary up to $500,000 with his girlfriend at $250,000 and he walked away with the highest teacher pension in the state. Then we have all these people like Podgursky writing about the “Pension Payoff” and he doesn’t report on this kind of malfeasance… just says “those teachers and principals are paid too much”…. This same “cost avoidance” idea is now being promulgated as social impact bonds. When we had an energy crisis, a group of business managers went into districts to review the energy costs and we defined cost avoidance. The difficulty is that people keep going looking for that money as a surplus in the line items of the budget. This former superintendent kept buying luxury gifts, alcohol, tickets to the Kentucky Derby for his board etc (from MA to KY is an expensive weekend)…. It seems to be a lot of smoke and mirrors . Opening up the cap we have on charters in MA will only present more opportunities for this kind of theft from the public trough; it is not intended to help students at all.
Virginia/Brian/asp…. knowing how all the states fund the schools and the different formulas is above my pay grade (as i mentioned , knowing how all the states award diplomas…. But this is a reputable source; the fact that they say James Guthrie is one reason I would recommend this study… It is going to take me two postings to get the information here…
“An education adequacy costing-out study determines the amount of money actually needed to make available all of the educational services required to provide every child an opportunity to meet the applicable state education standards. A variety of approaches for undertaking such studies have been used in many states, including Illinois, Kentucky, Ohio, Oregon, Maryland, New Hampshire, Wisconsin, and Wyoming — in some cases as part of the development of a new funding system ordered by a state court. This policy brief describes briefly the concept of costing out and offers an overview of the three methodologies commonly used for this purpose.” Jim Guthrie was working on the Wyoming developments. He was one of my professors but it was quite some time ago and what I remember mostly was he went through a long fiscal analysis of the coleman report … and alternatives and interpretations of same.
jeanhaverhill, one might think that folks on both sides of the debate would want more transparency in costs. Here are some examples:
1. Schools with disadvantaged kids often have young, inexperienced teachers due to high turnover. New teachers may be placed in these schools directly out of college when it would be more efficient to let them get their feet under them first. This results in much less being spent on such kids because the cost of a new teacher is much less than senior teacher. Highlighting the true costs of each school would show the disparities are even worse than what is now publicized among districts.
2. SpEd students cost much more than GenEd students. This cuts both ways. If the money follows the child, schools with SpEd students get much more than those without. But it also highlights that the avg SpEd student costs 4x as much and taxpayers may revolt when they learn that number.
3. As I have mentioned before, teachers get pensions which can be quite significant. (18% in Virginia). If teachers knew how much pensions were worth, more candidates would apply. If taxpayers knew, they might be less inclined to raise pay.
“Cost Management” is one of my primary tasks in my day job. In order to be successful, the accounting systems and reporting systems must be configured to report at the proper level. If all school districts implemented cost models that allowed us to report the data above, we could have much more intelligent discussions.
For example, when Diane ran pieces on the Pennsylvania charter schools who were receiving higher reimbursements for SpEd students, many readers and Diane herself balked. But those costs were inline with current estimates for SpEd students. One can claim we need degrees of disability to distinguish between the $15K/yr student from the $80k/yr student, but generally, most education/union advocates oppose such information.
jeanhaverhill/Diane, are you willing to go on record saying we should calculate detailed costs so we can more appropriately assign resources?
Inner city schools should either have more senior teachers or more teachers overall.
Additional funding should follow SpEd students according to their disability wherever they go.
The true costs of teacher compensation should be reported?
If you agree, I can certainly get behind that effort.
reference to work citing Jim Guthrie…. and others in the field of finance http://www.schoolfunding.info/resource_center/costingoutprimer2.php3
jeanhaverhill, did you see my post above on Jan 14? Do you agree/disagree that costs should both be calculated and published for varying types of students/teachers? It would solve a lot of problems.