What does Betsy DeVos say about education? What does she care about? What matters most? Charters and vouchers. The charter chain that she praises in this video operates for profit. As the editorial page editor of the Detroit Free Press recently wrote, she is a lobbyist for privatized alternatives to public schools. She doesn’t care for public schools. She doesn’t like them.
TRANSCRIPT Betsy DeVos Interview w Edward J. Pozzuolli
VIDEO:
Betsy DeVos of the American Federation for Children
Published on Aug 6, 2015
Ed Pozzuoli, President of Fort Lauderdale based law firm Tripp Scott, sits down with Betsy DeVos, Chairman of the American Federation for Children, to discuss the school choice movement.
00:11
INTRO (by Ed Pozzuolli INTERVIEWER):
Good evening and welcome this is Ed Pozzuolli president of Tripp Scott and with me today, I’m so honored, Betsy DeVos. Betsy, welcome.
Betsy DeVos:
Thank you Ed.
INTERVIEWER:
Betsy is the chairman of the American Federation of Children, and is a true Pioneer, and when I say Pioneer, I mean it in the in the real sense of the ‘School Choice Movement’ across the country.
First QUESTION by Ed Pozzuolli):
I know you’ve given time, and energy, and money, and strategic advice, and all those great things, and so given that you’re ‘The Pioneer’, where does the ‘School Choice Movement’ stand in the United States?
00:42
Betsy DeVos
Well, first of all Ed, thanks for having me here today, and it’s really an honor to be here.
So ‘Education (School) Choice’ has made some tremendous strides in the last 3 or 4 years. Now there are 24 States, currently, that have some form of a private school choice program, “Education Choice Program’. And we… We (American Federation for Children & allied organizations) advocate for, and do the politics around, um… all forms of choice. So we believe that parents, and we target programs that are specifically geared to answer the needs of low-income parents and students, we believe that they should have the full range of choices.
QUESTION by INTERVIEWER:
So what are they? Give our audience a…
01:24
Betsy DeVos:
Well, starting with private schools, which is probably the most difficult form to get too, politically in people’s minds, Charter Schools, On-line Schools, Virtual Schools, Blended Learning, um… any, any combination thereof, and frankly any, you know, any combination, or any kind of choice that hasn’t yet been thought of. Um. Education Savings Accounts (ALEC), that’s a new one as well. Ah… we, we change policy through political effort to elect or defeat candidates in States based on this issue… their support, or lack of support, for the issue. Then we work on the policies, the legislation, the actual programs that they would consider, and we advocate (READ “lobby”) to get those passed in those legislatures, and with the governors. Once they’re passed, we help to get help parents and kids to find schools, and schools to find parents and kids.
02:19
QUESTION by INTERVIEWER: So, not only do you with the politics in the legislation, you also help the actual parents with the opportunities that now are available.
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly, exactly. Because so often, especially low-income parents we have to use different ways to inform them, or make them aware of these opportunities,
INTERVIEWER: Right.
Betsy DeVos:
…and help them with the application process, um… because most of them are means-tested, help them with finding the resources to be able to make the application, and, and really just helping the programs to be successful. Indiana’s a really great example.
INTERVIEWER: Great example..
Betsy DeVos:
You know this is only, I think, the third or fourth year of the program it’s already the largest voucher program in the country…
INTERVIEWER: Yep.
Betsy DeVos:
…and the demand is huge, not enough, not all of the parents and the students that apply are able to get into the program every year. So there’s gonna (going to be) a demand for more providers, more schools, more opportunities for entrepreneurs and innovators, and creators to come in, and start new ways of approaching education.
03:23
INTERVIEWER:
So in Indiana does the voucher program, but just to give our reviewers an understanding, lower-income families are also now have the choice of charter schools….
Betsy DeVos: Absolutely.
INTERVIEWER:
They also have the choice in the turnaround schools in Indiana.
Betsy DeVos: Yep.
INTERVIEWER:
And as well as the normal traditional public schools which are now having to compete with these other options.
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly, exactly.
03:43
QUESTION by INTERVIEWER:
What… are we still be seeing results? We’re looking at results-oriented for the benefit of the child, are we seeing that?
Betsy DeVos:
I… We definitely ARE seeing the results. And you know so many people get focused on school buildings, and the results of buildings, (REF to testing and evaluation systems in MI???) and I encourage them to really look at each individual child, cuz (because) that’s what we’re really concerned about. Right? How much is one kid learning, or what how much is one kid getting turned on to new opportunities, and new things that they haven’t um.. even been introduced to previously.
04:13
INTERVIEWER:
Now I know that you are in Florida is a, a dear spot in your heart…
Betsy DeVos: Yeah… (Dick & Betsy DeVos have at least one home in Florida in Vero Beach).
INTERVIEWER:
.. you live here, and so tell us a little bit about what’s going on in Florida, and some of the developments in the ‘School Choice Movement’ here.
04:26
Betsy DeVos:
Well, Florida I always cite Florida as really the farthest along, in terms of providing the widest range of choices, and the greatest access to those choices, of any state in the country. And from a political standpoint, having real bipartisan support for these choices. Because today, and I will, ya know, cite the very successful ‘Tax Credit Scholarship Program’ (vouchers) with over 70,000 children participating this year. Um, that program however, is under attack by those who are defenders of the ‘status quo’, and that will have to be litigated. But we’re very confident that as that program, and all the choices in Florida continue to grow, and as more students find success because of those choices, the constituency for ‘choices’, the full range, is going to continue to be very strong, and grow even stronger.
05:16
INTERVIEWER:
So those opportunities, explain to our viewers what that is.
Betsy DeVos:
The ‘Tax Credit Opportunity Scholarship’ is a tax credit against corporate taxes in the State of Florida. So if you have a business that pays Florida state corporate taxes, you can redesignate up to, I believe it’s 75%, of your corporate tax burden to the state annually into a ‘scholarship fund’. That scholarship fund then, is ‘vouchered out’, or giving out in, in incremental amounts to low-income students, and their families, to choose the school, or education setting, that’s gonna (going to) work best for them.
05:57
INTERVIEWER:
So then the child and their family can use the voucher and attend a private school…
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly.
INTERVIEWER:
…or parochial school or whatever…
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly.
INTERVIEWER:
And so since there are no ‘state monies’ involved it all essentially all ‘private monies’ with the ‘tax credit’ method.
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly. Exactly because those funds never go into the state coffers to begin with.
06:13
INTERVIEWER:
So for some of our ‘corporate partners’ who will watch this….
Betsy DeVos:
It’s a great opportunity… ABSOLUTELY it is (Betsy with a big smile).
06:19-06:23
INTERVIEWER:
Talk a little bit about in Florida the ‘charter school movement’, because that’s another element of ‘choice’ in Florida.
Betsy DeVos:
Well, the ‘Charter School Movement’ in Florida continues to be strong and grow even stronger. And ah,
INTERVIEWER:
By a quarter million kids…
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly. ‘Charter Schools USA’ (EMO), great provider of, of, of great opportunities for kids. Having visited one with Jon (Jonathan) and Sherry Hage (Founders of Charter Schools USA) not too long ago, (I’m) very impressed with ah, the approach to learning, to education, there. And, ah, charter schools are a very vibrant option and opportunity for parents in Florida too.
06:53
INTERVIEWER:
I think that’s true, and so what do you think the future of the ‘Choice Movement’ is in the United States?
06:59
Betsy DeVos:
I think as more and more parents realize that.. um.. their children’s future opportunities really are tied directly to the ability of each of their children to grow, and develop to their fullest potential, in other words get a good education, they are gonna (going to) become more demanding of that opportunity, of wider opportunities, because there are far too many.. um.. educational settings that just aren’t meeting the needs of all of the… all of today’s kids. And we think about the system that most kids are attending today the ‘traditional public schools’, and it’s a system that was brought to us two hundred years ago, by the Prussians, a very much an ‘industrial, factory model’ of education, and how much our society has changed today.
INTERVIEWER:
Right.
Betsy DeVos:
Technology has brought so many new opportunities, and we need to embrace that, and not only embrace it, but be bold about it, and allow people who are innovative and creative to come and help us think differently about how we could do education.
08:04
INTERVIEWER:
And so the ‘Choice Movement’ is truly what they called ‘disruptor’ in a certain sense….
Betsy DeVos:
It is indeed, it is indeed… (Betsy calls herself a “disruptor”). And the more of a ‘marketplace’ we have for education, the more, I think, the better.. um.. in general, kids are going to do educationally, and certainly the better individually, kids are going to be able to do.
08:23
INTERVIEWER:
And ultimately that’s the key…
Betsy DeVos:
And that is the key.
08:26
INTERVIEWER:
Well with that Betsy, I really do I want to take this opportunity and thank you again for your great work in this area and providing unbelievable ‘Educational Choice’ across the country, particularly for those who need it most, and so thank you.
Betsy DeVos:
Thank you Ed, thank you..
Diane Ravitch's blog 
When I was a kid and I was caught using profanity, even words I didn’t know were profanity, my Catholic godmother washed my mouth out with soap, and I had to pay this piggy bank that ended up being donated to the Church.
But soap is too good for Betsy DeVos.
I want a skunk to spray Betsy DeVos in the mouth, and five more skunks to spray here everywhere else.
I left the Catholic Church when I was 12.
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The public money Devos yearns to shift into private pockets is not money ever meant to be allotted to individual children. No more than a public library patron deserves a voucher to shop for books at a preferred private bookstore.
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Good analogy!
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“I think as more and more parents realize that.. um.. their children’s future opportunities really are tied directly to the ability of each of their children to grow, and develop to their fullest potential, in other words get a good education, they are gonna (going to) become more demanding of that opportunity, of wider opportunities, because there are far too many.. um.. educational settings that just aren’t meeting the needs of all of the… all of today’s kids. And we think about the system that most kids are attending today the ‘traditional public schools’, and it’s a system that was brought to us two hundred years ago, by the Prussians, a very much an ‘industrial, factory model’ of education, and how much our society has changed today.”
Ugh. Same old ed reform mush.
Actually, the cheap garbage online programs that DeVos lobbies for are much more like a “factory model of education” than anything you’ll see in a public school.
Kids staring at a screen and plodding thru a canned computer program is the definition of “factory model”. Is she actually familiar with any of the “online learning” products she’s selling to the public? They’re not “innovative” at all. They are cheaper than human teachers however. She’s got that part right.
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The DeVos Clan has but one religion — Moneytheism
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I love the complete contempt these folks have for “traditional” public schools.
They’re snobs. They designate thousands of schools as inherently inferior simply because they’re public. Let’s face facts- no one in Betsy Devos’ family has gone anywhere near a public school in at least 2 generations. She can’t imagine anyone valuing a public school.
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Can they require public schools to host DeVos or her staff when she parachutes into town?
Why would we want an opponent of our schools in our schools? Can we just pass on letting them in? We own the schools. We built them and we fund them. I don’t want the US Secretary of Education lobbying against my son’s school while she’s standing inmy son’s school. I don’t welcome her. She can stay in DC.
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Well-said!
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Her abysmal ignorance about the history of American education — along with everything else — tells us all we need to know about the quality of her private religious schooling.
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I don’t think it is ignorance but rather total contempt. She doesn’t want to know.
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I was referring to that remark about the Prussian model. It’s as if she never heard of John Dewey or any other educator of influence from the last century. The reasons for “choosing” to remain ignorant can of course be legion.
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Nauseating.
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Thanks for running this video. It takes real courage to post a viewpoint, which is obviously so opposed to your own. I congratulate you.
BTW- In the video, the interviewer calls Ms. DeVos a “pioneer”. You can always tell a pioneer, they have arrows in their backs.
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Looks like I pushed the send button twice. My apologies.
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…and Trump just announced, which is no surprise, that he will not be addressing the nation this Thursday, as to his businesses and their oversight.
But far more upsetting than DeVos and her plans, is this news that China is threatening to NUKE either us or our allies due to Trump’s Taiwan fiasco. Who is going to stop him???
The Daily Beast CHEAT SHEET
AM
EDITION
12
Dec
” China Warns Trump With Nuclear Fly-By”
“Chinese officials warned Monday that relations with the U.S. may fall apart if President-elect Donald Trump does not respect China’s “core interests” going forward. The comments were made in response to Trump’s now-infamous phone call with Taiwan’s president. “I want to stress that the Taiwan issue concerns China’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, and involves China’s core interests,” foreign ministry spokesman Geng Shuang said during a news briefing. “Upholding the ‘One China’ principle is the political basis for developing China-U.S. ties. If this basis is interfered with or damaged, then the healthy development of China-U.S. relations and bilateral cooperation in important areas is out of the question.” The warning comes hours after reports emerged indicating China flew a nuclear-capable bomber over a disputed part of the South China Sea, in a move U.S. officials say was meant to send a message to Trump. The Xian H-6 bomber, at times accompanied by fighter jets, flew along the demarcation line between China and disputed territories, including Taiwan, Fox News reported, citing U.S. officials. Pentagon officials reportedly found out about the nuclear bomber’s flight Friday, though it was not immediately clear when the flight took place. Officials have warned the flight was the first of its kind in more than 18 months.”
Happy holidays to one and all.
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Well then your late night or in your case early evening update is Rex Tillerson for State . So when the head stops spinning and the vomiting stops . Think of the positive side, When we are involved in numerous draining world conflicts,that we never win. When the economy tanks. When the South and East Coast are hit with several climate disasters and the West and Central States friy. We could get a redo of “hope and change” with leaders who mean it this time, or we just move to Canada .
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fry
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I find it highly ironic that she rails against public education for using a supposed “Prussian” model, factory-like in application, but advocates for charter schools – and their inherent teach-the-premade-lesson-without-deviation approach by untrained “teachers”.
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“INTERVIEWER:
And so since there are no ‘state monies’ involved it all essentially all ‘private monies’ with the ‘tax credit’ method.
Betsy DeVos:
Exactly. Exactly because those funds never go into the state coffers to begin with.”
So, does this incoming Secretary of Edu-Destruction not understand that tax credits are taxes that have been privatized? It’s not that people don’t have to pay taxes; they just get a rebate. It’s like a company offering $50 cash back for buying a washing machine. The price of the washer is unchanged. Your tax bracket is unchanged. Those are still tax dollars going to fund temples, mosques, synagogues, and churches.
DeVos is dishonest — sneaky and dishonest.
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Also, when a business person gets a tax credit, it is the rest of the taxpayers that have to make up the lost revenue.
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I find it increasingly harder to read the crap coming out of the edudeformer and privateer pie holes. So much horse manure-just one small example:
“. . . it’s a system that was brought to us two hundred years ago, by the Prussians. . . “
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Four years of this vomitous “educational” clap trap?! I think NJ has the strength to fight off the worst of this glop once Christie is gone. But we will see.
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Thanks for posting this video. It takes courage to post comments, which are obviously 1000% opposed to your own. I congratulate you.
BTW- In the video, the interviewer calls Ms. DeVos a “Pioneer”. You can always tell a pioneer, they have arrows in their backs.
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Or blood on their hands
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Someone else posted the exact same comment under a different name. So either you are a troll, or the other person is, or you are both one and the same. Which is it?
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I am Charles E Martin/cemab4y My computer has been having problems, dropping off in mid-email. No attempt to deceive and certainly no troll. My apologies.
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DeVos does realize that Catholic schools have the same schedule (Prussian) model that she so despises, right? I’ve encountered numerous kids who go to well-known Catholic schools in metro Detroit and their schedule looks pretty much like a typical high school schedule. Yet, those schools seem to be quite good in her estimation.
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When “quite good” might well mean “not heavily integrated?”
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Ciedie, you got that right.
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Reblogged this on David R. Taylor-Thoughts on Education and commented:
I find it interesting that she is only pushing school choice but Trump talked about returning control back to the local level. If things go according to plan, then there will not be anything left that requires local control.
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She thinks that if every family has a voucher, that is local control. I never wanted to go to a religious school, but if she were in charge, that would have been my only “choice.”
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I never really considered that as an aspect of local control. To me local control was/is the decisions made by the local school board and superintendent. Vouchers fallen more under the idea of parental control.
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I agree with you, David. I am just explaining the logic of the voucher advocates. They believe that local school boards elected by the citizens as less “democratic” than parental choice. Their logic ultimately is anarchist, as it leaves every one to fix their own problems with no social responsibility at all.
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Thank you for providing me with a new lens to see this from. Because I know as I go visit family in the next couple of weeks this will be a topic of conversation.
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Anarchists, individualists, and true libertarians don’t believe in using other people’s money to address their individual needs and wishes. Vouchers, “education stamps” are simply a device for injecting market psychology into an area where it does not belong. Capitalism is Great and Adam Smith is its Prophet. That is the only religion they really know.
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It really comes down to the role of public education in preserving a democratic society.
Q. Who are the stakeholders?
• A1. All Of Us.
• A2. Only the parents of school age children at a particular moment in time.
Q. What process should be used to determine the character of our public educational system held in common?
• A1. Democratic Dynamics — the collective decision-making process of All Of Us?
• A2. Market Forces — the choices profiteers choose to make available and the ad-driven choices of parents currently in the market.
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