I thought this must be a joke. It is not.
North Carolina legislators are considering a law that would demolish the teaching profession and encourage teacher turnover.
Call it the “here-today-gone-next-year” policy. The goal is to cut costs by increasing class sizes, pushing out senior teachers, and using technology to “flip” classrooms.
“A new plan to raise some teachers’ salaries while significantly reducing education spending is circulating among lawmakers and education professionals.
“The NC 60/30/10 Plan, which “embraces high teacher turnover,” would place teachers on one of three tracks: Apprentice, Master or Career.
“Sixty percent of all North Carolinian teachers would make $32,000/year in the Apprentice category and be allowed to teach for up to twenty years, at which time they must retire or move on to another industry.
“Thirty percent of teachers would be eligible for the Master category if they have been teaching for three years, have completed an online training program, and can demonstrate mastery of the teaching method based on “customer survey data.” Master teachers would earn $52,000/year.
“Ten percent of teachers would become Career teachers, making $72,000 if they have an advanced degree and can innovate and lead.
“All teachers would be able to serve in North Carolina for no more than 20 years. If the plan were to be adopted, all teachers in North Carolina would be required to reapply for their jobs in 2015.
“The man behind this plan is self-employed and self-described “educational pioneer” Dr. Lodge McCammon. A former Wake County teacher and Friday Institute specialist in curriculum and contemporary media, McCammon heavily promotes the use of video recording to transform teaching and learning.
“In a 2011 op-ed in the News & Observer, McCammon explains that flipped classrooms, in which students can view videotaped instructional materials at their own pace, should allow teachers to accommodate larger classroom sizes–and be paid according to how many students they can teach in one classroom.”
Is there something in the water served in the State Capitol? Do they hate teachers? Or is it that they just don’t like experienced teachers? What’s going on? Can anyone explain this blatant attempt to end teaching as a profession and a career? Will Arne Duncan denounce what this zany legislature is doing to teachers and public education? Will President Obama? He held the Democratic National Convention in North Carolina in 2012; last week, he announced a major job-creating project for the state. Can’t he just speak up?
Diane Ravitch's blog 
The sad thing is that our country’s values (not to mention logic) are so out of whack, and teachers have been so thoroughly demonized, that this plan probably makes sense to a large percentage of the population. I can’t count the number of ideas that would have seemed ludicrous just 15 years ago that are standard practice now and which people are now vehemently defending. I mean, I for one never thought we’d live in a country where so many people think the president has a unilateral right to assassinate a U.S. citizen (much less his 16 year old son), but there you have it.
Thanks for posting this. Since My state of NC loves to try out legislation that has not worked elsewhere or untried legislation with disastrous “unintended” consequences, I have a suggestion. Let’s try flipped legislation like they are suggesting for teachers. We should find someone smart who has a soul make the proposals and the people in the legislature just check the paperwork. We pay them by the number of constituents they actually help out.
Or let make them get re-elected right now. In the middle of a term. With no campaigning. And let’s require and micromanage what the day to day of their meeting schedules look like. Let’s make them take an online class in leadership and pay them according to an approval rating based on “consumer feedback.”
It is simply embarrassing. Very embarrassing.
We have a good candidate on this end
!
http://turnerfornchouse.com/
Joanna- wonderful we need to find all the good ones. Here is a good one on our end of the state! http://www.elizabethforncsenate.com/
Awesome.
You forgot the term limits or do you already have them? Twenty years seems a little long.
It’s an insult to teachers, but it’s also an insult to parents.
You should probably know that this cut-rate garbage is being sold to parents as “individualized learning” by Arne Duncan and jeb Bush (among others).
If you point out the obvious, the reality, that it’s being used as a way to cut costs on public education (for working class and middle class kids only) you’re immediately accused of being hostile to technology.
I knew it would be used to increase class sizes, fire teachers (or, as Rocketship is doing, create a 15 dollar an hour “monitor” replacement for teachers).
It’s not like they’re hiding it. It is IN the Rocketship business plan, and Pearson listed cutting costs on public ed as one of three reasons to adopt these models when the
It’s not a mystery. The companies and schools that sell this cite cost-cutting as a reason to adopt these methods.
Just as ed reform was sold as “improving public schools” when in practice it has done nothing but damage public schools, this is being sold as “individualized learning” when in practice in working class districts like mine is it ONLY used to cut costs in public ed.
Why do I know that ten years down the road I will end up with a cheap, online completely commercialized and profit-driven substitute for teachers? We were sold the same line of BS on ed reform as we’re being sold on this, and I have zero trust left.
And it’s an insult to principals who have already interviewed their staff and who stay on top of performance.
They are not listening to the teachers in the classroom. this is crazy stuff. this has to ube stopped. stay the course folks .Keep writing and talking to your staff and the “suits” . I believe we are starting to be heard. See you in March
Why should they listen to teacher? We are clueless. We don’t know anything about the profession for which we trained for.
They might as well hire a bunch of plumbers to teach trig and physics. They don’t want teachers.
Plumbers cost too much…
LOL…yes they actually earn a wage they can live on…Sad
I am assured by those close to me that folks in Raleigh leading us down this path will be voted out before it comes to pass.
The entire teaching force reapply in 2015? That is dumb.
That will be my cue. I do have a limit to how much humiliation I will put up with. I am sure I would be hired and most of us would, but requiring that is just silly. I wouldn’t want to give credence to a gesture like that by applying. Not really sure what folks would do. Imagine the expense of all those interviews! And what “online” program could possiy make that big a difference in the entire force? The subtext here has nothing to do with education. Just money and power.
Who is this tap dance for anyway? “Fix the education problem”—I read that as code for “make education cost as little as possible no matter what.”
There is so much fixation on this subject now, on the self-inflicted wound that is reform, that healing is prohibitive. In fact, I think we have a bacterial infection. There needs to be one of those lamp shade collars put on so our general assembly will quit gnawing on public schools.
I talked to a ten year teacher yesterday (top tier undergrad, Masters) who says the powers that be leave out the “guided practice” part of teaching teachers about the changes with CCSS and Read to Achieve. She said they roll stuff out before it has been tried or before teachers have been trained on it and then they flip flop and ask for feedback and change it —-the plane being built in the air analogy perfectly carried out (disastrously, rather). If not but for teachers (who handle it in stride and put children first),things would have imploded by now. They are beating up on the wrong cohort, it seems. But mostly, they are beating up on the students who attend school right now by making everything a giant experiment with questionable motives.
The oy good thing about this 60/30/10 idea is that it is so ridiculous, we might finally turn a corner in getting new leadership (or at least a new mind set across the state, namely that of people paying attention).
November can’t come fast enough.
I will say that this wise teacher to whom I spoke says she gives her third grade students a car analogy. She tells them and encourages them that they are the drivers in their car. She will give them the best gas and the best wheels she can, but they have to decide to follow the rules of the road. And she is honest with them that for third graders the rules of the road are pretty tight. Also, she said that many of them are not going to do well on these high stakes tests because their reading decoding skills stand in the way of their comprehension skills. It seems an earlier grade would have been a better one to crack down on, rather than passing them along to third grade through the primary grades and then having everything hinge on third grade reading. I have even heard it suggested that kindergarten might be the year to hold more students back (particularly if they have not had pre-K).
“There needs to be one of those lamp shade collars put on so our general assembly will quit gnawing on public schools.”
Fabulous analogy! Reminds me of the movie “Up:”https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWU5M1q0WqU
Honestly, state legislature, you think this is a good idea?
“He held the Democratic National Convention in North Carolina in 2012; last week, he announced a major job-creating project for the state. Can’t he just speak up?”
Fat chance. He spends a good part of every day promoting the wonders of “individualized education”, but it is NOT ABOUT replacing teachers or increasing class sizes or cutting education funding, and anyone who states the obvious and points to reality, how it is being used, hates “innovation”.
Power and Greed has brought out cruelty and callousness in NC legislators that is unprecedented. The diagnosis for these legislators is Narcissistic Personality Disorder. It has no cure, and it is epidemic. The only way to stop its destructive damage to children is to eliminate the corrupt leaders, and get them out of office. Parents and community members have to wake up and demand humane treatment for their children, and stop gawking and complaining like helpless bystanders. The best way to stop the narcissistic cruelty to children is to refuse high stakes testing, and implement Montessori elementary schools where children can be free to learn in a healthy holistic environment. Until parents and community members take action and drive these charlatans out of office, this insanity will continue.
I do short term foster care in an Eastern NC county and we have a psychologist in town everyone sees. The guy crams as many patients into 10 minute appointments to fill his day and spends whatever spare time he has teleconferencing other patients for more money. The guy may be one of the wealthiest people in town. On the flip side, each psych visit goes as follows- check BP, ask patient “everything ok?” then he rubber stamps your prescription and you’re on your way. Its awful. There’s never time to get a thorough examination, adults can continue getting powerful medicine refilled without explaining why its needed, and making changes to adjust to kids’ biology and situation can be difficult. I think the negative impacts of the discussed proposal above are obvious but the similarities of what I just described seem ironic.
Eric, How many special education children can you teach in one day? Since you will get paid by the child I feel bad that all special education teachers will be paid less. . . ???
Wow.
Not a fan of medicating developing brains as a rule.
That makes me very sad.
I think you meant psychiatrist, not that that makes his behavior better. Psychologists are not medical doctors and cannot prescribe medication.
“Therefore, it is now possible for a teacher who has adopted more efficient teaching practices to take on more students while offering high-quality, personalized instruction.”
That’s from the promoter/lobbyist, at the link.
I actually find him easier to deal with than the many, many people who omit the cost-cutting and efficiency motive behind this. At least he puts it right out there. He believes he can get quality, cheap. That’s an actual debate, instead of marketing.
I love how he states “efficient” teaching practices, not BEST teaching practices. As if efficiency is the goal.
Of course. Efficiency is always the goal in any business enterprise.
Joanna- how many children can you teach music to in one day?
Currently I teach 125 a day insets of about 24.
Last year there was a suggestion that we double up for music.
I guess if you want a sing along we could do that. But to know their names and their strengths and interests and give them attention on instruments and play games and have hands on stations (like Montessori style, which we do about every six weeks) requires the ratio we have. I only have 28 chairs and I’m pretty sure the fire code would not allow for 50+ in the room.
I get it. Is it about relationships? Or mass delivery of info and shared experience? I guess if I had a stellar sound system with headphone mic (like in a music video) we could make it work. But it’s the children individually that keep me going. When you’ve sing “Mr Alligator” (my hit song with kindergarten) 5,254 times such as I have, it is the things the children say and do that renew you. And that keep it human. And endearing.
The small classes for music in elementary school prepare them for the large ensemble situations they get later. But I believe the individual encouragement they get in early years makes them want to pursue ensnles later anyway.
(I know you weren’t looking for a long answer, but we have a snow day and I have the time).
In sets of. Groups of.
This type scenario is what you get at conferences and stuff. But notice that even at conferences and things you have break out sessions in smaller groups. There simply is a limit to what you can do in a large group setting. Not impossible, just different.
Actually I teach 175 a day. Seven classes a day.
I never mind your longer answers. I am just jealous you got a snow day. No snow here! Wow that is a large load as it is- and they wanted you to double it? Teaching is all about relationships and relevance. And the way I make it relevant is I have a relationship with the students and know their interests. I am still friends with students I taught over 20 years ago. I am even close with students whom I only have taught online. But I am not close with people who attended a lecture I gave to hundreds of people. I wonder why? 🙂
Diane,
I thought your readers might enjoy this video of Dr. Lodge McCammon swing dancing as a demonstration of “reflective” technique. This is from his web site. Notice the usage error in the description.
http://lodgemccammon.com/kinesthetics/dancing/
Just want to let Dr. McCammon know, I learned swing dancing with a very patient dance teacher, who was able to break steps down into sequential steps. For me, videos don’t work. Muscle memory and a variety of teachers definitely more helpful. And the community of dancers, much like a classroom, made the whole process joyful. Videos aren’t the way everyone learns. But keep on dancing. And smile….it’s supposed to be fun!
🙂
What is the ultimate End Game in this thinking? Make the US standard of living and education on par with a 3rd World country? Will ‘traditional’ schools be the new private school where publicly traded companies ‘own’ schools? I will pass this information to everyone I know in NC and will make sure that every ignorant politician including our Gov Pat ‘Cookies Anyone’ McCrory has to answer questions regarding this proposal.
The NC General Assembly members don’t think we are paying attention – but you don’t get 10,000 teachers marching on a Monday in August thru the streets of Raleigh if people weren’t paying attention. February 8th is a Moral Monday March on Saturday come to Shaw University by 9:00am to join in.
It’s funny how 32 to 35k pops up again and again as the race to the bottom wage in ed reform. DC and NYC aren’t representative of the rest of the country, where wages in general are lower, so (higher) ed reform wages there wouldn’t be a good example.
Charters in Ohio and Michigan pay around 35K, which is substantially less than public schools do. I have never been able to determine where the 15k (average, per teacher, per year) charters aren’t paying teachers goes. They aren’t paying teachers. What are they doing with that money?
32-35k must be the target for most of the country.
For the record, this article in NC Policy Watch was published before I had a chance to speak with the author. These are, in a sense, some of the ideas that I have been brainstorming over the past few years. However, this write-up (including the document) is taken way out of context. My main goal is to find a way to motivate teachers to flip their classrooms because I truly believe it can help every educator and student. In fact, I am so passionate about this idea, that I continue to offer free training for teachers. This article was published before I was asked about it and contains information that was part of a private discussion. Contrary to what the article states, to my knowledge, this is not being discussed by policymakers. These ideas are part of a brainstorming process, by a small number of people, and were not meant to be shared publicly.
How do you suggest flipping classrooms works if I still have students with no access to internet at home? They do not do written homework already- I just do not buy into this idea. Not until everyone has access to internet will I even consider trying it.
http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/12/26/1730586/how-new-teaching-merits-higher.html
Proof of your ridiculous idea is in your own words.
What context would make this sound a lot better than it does?
Unless you are currently a classroom teacher in an urban high school, teaching a subject the kids must take a state test in, your “passion” and your ideas are meaningless.
If you’re so passionate, get in a classroom and serve a set of kids.
Otherwise, you’re all hat, no cattle. Shame on you.
Lodge,
“. . . were not meant to be shared publicly.”
Why not?
What would be so drastically wrong to have any and all ideas out in the open, especially when they deal with PUBLIC education?*
Thanks,
Duane
*ideas would not include individual personnel discussions, decisions obviously for the purpose of this discussion.
I guess when you start with “the money follows the child” it’s fairly easy to get to the next step, which is money for the teacher based on a per “child unit” basis.
I imagine this will be very attractive to the low tax/no tax political and business leaders running these ed reform states. Art Pope in North Carolina must have thought he died and went to heaven when he met Michelle Rhee. He never wanted to pay for public ed anyway. Now he can say it’s “for the children”.
Michelle Rhee is a fraud – and anyone who thinks she has ‘revolutionized education’ during her time in the DC schools has been hoodwinked. She is a Fraud – and I point that out to anyone that will listen.
I’m so happy she’s finally been exposed and discredited.
I have heard of this flipped classroom method working successfully in certain situations, but it is definitely not a money saving proposition if done well. The method I know that has been successful is that students watch a lesson at home for homework, and the next day the students do problems, write essays, etc based on the lesson. The teacher(s) circulate in the classroom to provide individualized instruction where students are having problems. This way, students who are ahead aren’t having to sit through something they already know, and kids who are behind get extra reinforcement – video lesson and individualized help. Again, to work well, this approach may actually need more teachers circulating in the room. Also, teachers need MORE training and special skills for this to work well.
I’m not sure I understand the idea of making teachers leave after 20 years. Is it to limit retirement pay? I do believe that even veteran teachers should be required to continue to get training and continuing ed, but I also know that those experienced teachers who remain active in the field end up being some of the best. One of my kids is “difficult.” He has usually been placed with classroom teachers who are nearing retirement – they have lots of tools and tricks up their sleeve and nothing fazes them, so they are always great matches for that child.
There is a direct relationship between direct instruction and guided instruction – effective teachers are informally assessing during direct instruction and use these assessments to support/enhance guided practice. Separating them will diminish learning, not enhance it. The “tricks” (skills) that seasoned teachers possess are why ALL students succeed – difficult one’s included. They are successful because they are responsive and not prescribed. Don’t be fooled by these so called reformists – their motive is to privatize and make profits.
Susan: “I have heard of this flipped classroom method working successfully in certain situations, but it is definitely not a money saving proposition if done well.”
From what I have seen & experienced, I think flipped classrooms are worth trying, but not on a complete wholesale conversion. Some subjects and students work better in one format than the other. To convert all classrooms into flipped format is falling into the one-size-fits-all format.
And the one thing about relying on technology is what do you do if it fails? A teacher should have some experience in delivering a lesson w/ technology and also deliver the same lesson w/o the technology.
How are we going to ensure that the students watch the videos the night before?
About 3/4 of the kids at my urban school simply don’t do any homework. Detention, parent meetings, nothing works…
And what are we going to do if they don’t? We can’t expel them from the public system.
I’m sure Lodge will counter that with this flipped method, kids will be so inspired to soak up the particulars of ionic bonding in chemistry that they will fight their siblings for access to the family computer (if the family has one) to watch the videos.
What a disaster. If flipped classrooms are so awesome, why don’t the elite private schools across the country use the method?
“If flipped classrooms are so awesome, why don’t the elite private schools across the country use the method?”
Exactly. This question needs to be asked about every so-called “reform” being peddled. When I see said “reform” being used at Sidwell, Cranbrook, Lab, etc., then maybe I’ll consider it with more of an open mind.
Why the hell should students be expected to give their time to what should be classroom activities?
And then one gets into the whole who has access and who doesn’t justice concerns.
One big problem I see with this plan (among the MANY problems with this plan)is that people don’t understand the intent of a “flipped” classroom. First, not all lessons are conducive to a flipped atmosphere. Second, what he’s describing as a flipped classroom (more students because all a ‘teacher’ does is monitor individualized learning) is not the intent. Of course, administrators have jumped on this bandwagon and are asking teachers to do the same thing–but without proper understanding and training. A well-developed, meaningful flipped classroom requires lots of work and preparation.
http://cft.vanderbilt.edu/teaching-guides/teaching-activities/flipping-the-classroom/
https://ctl.utexas.edu/teaching/flipping_a_class/what_is_flipped
http://net.educause.edu/ir/library/pdf/eli7081.pdf (point #5)
“Do they hate teachers?”
No, of course they don’t. It’s like in the Mafia when they decide to whack you: nothing personal, it’s just business.
thank you, Michael. I’m so relieved to know they didn’t hate me!
The NC proposals are a case where two arguably good ideas are being corrupted by two very bad ideas. Career ladders and the use of technology to enhance instruction are good ideas. The notion that teachers are analogous to McDonald’s wait-staff and schooling is restricted to the dispensing of information are very bad ideas. Providing public education on the cheap is, alas, an idea that’s been around for at least three decades. For more see: http://waynegersen.com/2014/01/22/babies-and-bathwater/
This and all of the absolutely insane antics around the country seem to be happening because of mega rich indivduals with so much money that it must turn them into meglomaniacs. They, in turn, buy and influence our policticians. They seem to believe that, by virtue of having more money than they know what to do with, they have the answers to all the problems. Don’t you see… that word “mega” beginning with “mega rich”, automatically translates into every other “mega” word. They become “mega smart”, “mega powerful”, “mega experts”, “mega righteous” and for education…..”mega destructive.” Shame on us for not seeing that most obvious connection. Not to mention the big cookie jar effect of every reform scheme for every particpant except the children, families and teachers.
Its so stupid, I hardly know where to begin.
I find this laughable. I have high school students with classes that were supposedly flipped. They listen to the lecture on line and come back to school the next day to do guided and independent practice. It lasts about a week. The students simply choose to ignore the on line lecture. Or they don’t understand it, there are no opportunities to ask questions in an online lecture unless the teacher is also online at the same time. So students come to class unprepared to do the work. The teacher then has to give the lecture in class in order to get the students ready. Wasted time!
yup. of course.
of course
of course
Here is his words exactly- http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/12/26/1730586/how-new-teaching-merits-higher.html
Reblogged this on David R. Taylor-Thoughts on Texas Education and commented:
The worst idea I have ever heard in the name of improving education. What a morale killer!!!
They don’t hate teachers, but teachers are the low profession on the professional food chain — start with that profession and then work up the chain so each profession can be Mac Donaldized. You are seeing the same business mentality in the medical and legal profession where technology and some form of TQM mentality are eroding the professional judgment and standing of each profession. Of course, these same CEO’s/corporate types have made sure that the Doctors and Lawyers that serve them have been shielded from these corporate take-overs (i.e. those at the top now have doctors that are on private retainers to serve a few families), leaving other Doctors working in sweat shop clinics or emergency wards serving what is left of the middle class. The privatization of public services—what we called the common good—is a worldwide trend in all professions — the theory being that private companies can supervise the common good far better than public agencies. Some public services, like education and health care, will never be efficient or make a profit, because their services are designed to treat/help/educate/ individuals, not corporate entities or some production function. Treating an individual who is dying of cancer cannot or should not be viewed from a production mentality, but from a human mentality—how can I make this persons last days more comfortable–that cost money–but money that I would hope a society is willing to say–ok, I will to pay for that inefficiency, understanding that there will come a day when I am laying in that same bed. The same could be said about education–what our tax dollars should be paying for, and what the state should supplement, is having a qualified teacher, in a room with reasonable class sizes, teaching a subject he or she loves, and most importantly, cares about my child, honors the unique talents of my child, and works everyday to crete a learning environment where my child grows intellectually, socially, and emotionally. A Pearson executive who reads this (who probably sends his child to private school) is probably saying—what a dreamer — but public services and the common good they serve are about dreams.
I come from a family of educators. I convinced one of my children to change majors while still in college and another to go back to school after teaching 2 years. They are both now in stable and appreciated professions. Other family members are getting out as soon as they can including me. What a sad time for this profession. NO ONE should have to deal with this mess. I fear for our grandchildren in the future. What is happening in this country that these people can get this far?
Just when I think that the legislators of the state of North Carolina cannot possibly enact legislation more idiotic than that which they have already enacted, they exceed my expectations! Surely now these folks have earned the right to emblazon “Most ridiculous state in the Union” on their license plates!!!
Perhaps Ashville, Chapel Hill, and a few other places where the average IQ is greater than that of lettuce can secede.
BTW, someone please send this genius McCammon a middle-school student dictionary so that he can look up the word “apprentice.”
So … You graduate at 21 or 22 or 23 (maybe you got a masters) you teach for 20 years 41-42-43 and are out of a job with no experience in anything else. Mandatory retirement re Social Security is 66 (?) soon to be raised to 70 (?) because life expectancy has increased (not as much as in some other countries). Where is the confusion?
We all know that its easy to get hired after 40 especially in a new career so what’s the problem?
They shoot horses don’t they?
The French need a fresh supply of meat don’t they?
Note to self- Email the North Carolina bureau of tourism and tell them that due to their attacks on public education my family will NOT be vacationing there next spring as planned. Or ever again for that matter.
Good point. I’m saving my pennies for Europe. Maybe Finland should be added to the wish list.
Think: THE HUNGER GAMES!
I just had a look at McCammon’s video about his flipped classroom plan. My kids had gerbils smarter than this guy. How embarrassing for the people of North Carolina that the state’s legislators are taking this cretin seriously.
If I didn’t know better, I would think that this guy’s website describing his flipped education training had been written by the editors of the Onion. It would be a delicious parody if it weren’t so very much in earnest. Please tell me that this is all a joke!!!
Forget the 60-30-10 —
100% of teachers (Compos Mentis) will leave NC (Non Compos) just as soon as they can find comfortable shoes.
Don’t ask Obama … he’s still looking for his …
What in the world does Obama have to do with anything? This is a STATE issue (a state where the Governor and both Houses are led in a supermajority by Republicans, mind you).
Chuck L., Duncan and Obama were quick to applaud when the entire staff at Central Falls HS in Rhode Island was threatened with firing.
Duncan regularly intervenes in state and local issues, but always on the wrong side.
NPR Fresh Air’s recent interview with Roger Ailes biographer is informative in articulating some of the media narrative that is happening surrounding teachers and education. One thing that was articulated was how Ailes has used the technique of developing “whipping posts” as targets of venting and resentment. From a very rational sense, it may not make sense to vent against these targets, but it provides quick and easy blame for all that one doesn’t like about politics and society. Public school teachers and teachers unions have become a convenient whipping post. Unfortunately we are all hurt by the damage of such a strategy.
Link
Try that Fresh Air link again:
Link
Let’s have a daily 2 minute hate against teachers and public education.
Needed….Dienne’s wit 🙂 TY
Have not heard the piece or read the biography but have thought similar things many times recently. What does it say about us as a country that we let this caricature live this long? In the UK there is a long tradition of hating teachers that was hard to shed (there is some kernel of truth in pink Floyd’s “leave those kids alone”). How long before we shed this? Probably a generation.
While I can understand the rush to embrace the flip thing and khan academy etc (in my mind the warm embrace stems from the fact that the elites proposing it expect students are already well socialized to take responsibility for their own education and are thinking of the experiences of their suburban or priv school children), I CANNOT fathom the 20 yr limit on careers. Why bother calling the top paid teachers under the proposed system ‘career’? Someone help me out here!!?!?
Best I can figure is that the idea that teachers are breaking the states’ banks with their pensions is just too attractive right now.
100% of the teachers should leave TODAY and parents should support them! A mass exodus from the classrooms would show ‘someone’ that teachers and parents mean business.
I agree with you 100%. We should walk out and leave our classrooms empty! What will our legislators say then?
And leave the kids with what?
I find it interesting that most of the people commenting here (not to mention the author of this post) are more than happy to tear down an idea, but no one seems interested in offering a solution. “Talk to teachers” is not a solution. If you have a positive idea that might contribute to strengthening the teaching profession, share it! Send the idea to your policy makers! Create your own plan! North Carolina could certainly benefit from many people bringing their ideas forward. We should be supportive of people who have any kind of idea or suggestion because it (hopefully) gets everyone thinking about more ideas and suggestions.
I find comments like “that is dumb” disheartening, coming from teachers and advocates of education. I was taught to think critically about new ideas, even if I don’t like them, and offer critique and feedback. “Worst idea” is not useful feedback. As much as we (adults) stress that we should use our words for good, there are a disappointing number of people who are expressing targeted anger/frustration at a person who simply has an idea; an idea that, based on his comment here, was still being brainstormed and IS NOT being consider as a law (which the blogger states).
Furthermore, by doing a very small amount of research on Dr. McCammon (i.e., visiting his website), you can plainly see that he is a huge advocate for teachers. He has tons of free resources for teachers, including free training for teachers to flip their classroom (feelings aside on whether you like “flipping”), his educational music is freely available, and it appears that he himself was once a teacher.
It’s fine to not like a person’s idea, but some of the comments here are unnecessarily negative; not an ounce of healthy criticism/feedback. I think it rather harsh that because he had an idea (that apparently was posted online without his knowledge or consent) that you don’t like, you’ve decide to tear him down. If students in a class were responding and behaving in such a negative way as this, would you think it okay?
Let’s try to support each other and keep the focus on continuing to build on ideas that could improve education.
Dear P (brandyparker):
Here are some positive ideas to improve the teaching profession.
Pay your teachers a living wage, say, the national average, as former Governor Jim Hunt proposed a few days ago.
Stop passing laws to reduce the status of teachers.
Fund the successful North Carolina Teaching Fellows program and defund Teach for America.
Raise standards for entry into teaching so that all teachers in publicly-funded schools–including charters and vouchers–must have a college degree and a year of professional preparation, plus certification.
Evaluate teachers not by test scores but by the judgment of their peers and supervisors.
Show respect for education by restoring the wage increment for those who earn a masters degree in subjects they teach or special education or administration.
I have lots more positive ideas which I will share at the Emerging Issues forum in Raleigh on Feb 11.
I feel like I am giving advice to a man who is beating his wife and asks me, “do you have a better idea?”
Thank you, Diane. This is what we teachers know and have been saying for years now. We have been attempting to share our ideas. That is the very source of our frustration-no one seems to listen to us. The experts, few of whom have much actual classroom experience, seem more concerned with advancing an agenda tied to creating profits for private firms. And “P”, we have thought critically about these ideas. Free materials and training films do not make him a huge advocate for teachers. They make him a huge advocate for his ideas. I create and give away free materials too. Lots of teachers do. One difference is that most of us know that our way is not THE only way. When I teach workshops, I tell other teachers to pick and choose, integrate what works, disregard what doesn’t. After 33 years of teaching, I know how to differentiate. One size does not fit all.
Amen!!! Very well stated, dianeravitch!!
Question, “Evaluate teachers not by test scores but by the judgment of their peers and supervisors.” Why should a teacher NOT be evaluated on the ability of that teacher to teach the subject to their students (and the way to evaluate if the students have learned is their test scores)?
Tara, test scores reflect who was in the class, not teacher quality. There is quite a lot of research about this. Start by googling Linda Darling-Hammond “Getting Teacher Evaluation Right” in Washington Post.
I disagree with P, not Ravitch.
I will be going to hear her ideas in Raleigh. And I have some off own.
And when I hear dumb ones I will say they are dumb.
Some of my own.
Wait, did you just say that test results do not reflect teacher quality? Like, at all? Wow, way to throw all those classroom success stories out the window. All those stories of the teacher, that goes in the failing classroom, and turns it all around. All false? Talk about insulting teachers. Because when I was a public school math teacher, I worked my tail off to teach my math students in a way that they would learn the material well, and in turn, produce the answers on the test. I brainstormed constantly, ways to get that information into their brains.I had students write me letters about how they never understood math or liked math, before me. But you are telling me, telling them, that they were confused. That nothing I did impacted what they learned? Obviously, there are many factors. And there were those that failed despite my best intentions. But. Don’t you realize that what you are saying is just as insulting as those you are lambasting? Kind of like if my husband told all his friends, that me, homeschooling mom of his 5 children really had no impact on the children’s success or failure? Wow, thanks for the encouragement, thanks for the faith, thanks for taking my job and rendering it meaningless.
Peers and supervisors have been evaluating teachers for years. And yet we still have the same problem. At every school there are great teachers and there are horrible teachers that stay for decades. Is this really new information? All teachers aren’t great. So what do you do? Just allow the kids to keep suffering through the classes of the ill equipped and under performing teachers?
Do I think its the teachers’s fault entirely? Absolutely not. I think our whole education system needs an overhaul. I think children bouncing around from broken families are a little distracted in schools. I think parents working full time jobs have little time to help their kids with their work and invest in their lives. And I don’t see any of that changing anytime soon.
I totally agree. Don’t forget, stop eliminating every healthy benefit from teachers and take into account that NC teachers are unemployed during summer months. Why not allow unemployment benefits during those months. We have to make a 10 month sub average salary last 12 months. Summer break is not a benefit, it is stressful for us.
Amen! Thank you, Dr. Ravitch!
Ditto to the positive comments just posted by Diane. I also must say that it is hard to offer other positive solutions because there is no clear “problem” with public education that has been offered by the legislature. In regards to “teacher tenure” this is a misnomer. Administrators can fire a teacher at any time for any reason just like any other person working in NC. “Tenure” only requires that the person gets a hearing, if they ask for it, upon their firing. This is something that any company should do for someone that has been loyal to them for more than 4 years, when a teacher in eligible for tenure. Not to mention that when a teacher moves to a different county in NC they forfeit their “tenure” for at least 1 year. In regards to test scores, there was an article in the News and Observer a few weeks ago about how NC performs among the top 5 states and very high among other countries on the international tests. High school graduation rates are improving by leaps and bounds along with SAT scores. Many of the leaders of the most prominent businesses in NC have publicly questioned the legislature’s motive. For a group of politicians that ran on campaign promises to create jobs, all they seem to be doing is destroying jobs for a huge voter pool.
I disagree.
There needs to be more “that is dumb,” not less.
If you don’t read this blog or its comments often, I can see where you are coming from.
When did “fixing the teaching profession” become such a high priority? Had I known it was broken I’d have not bothered to borrow $20,000 to get trained as one fifteen years ago (on top of a degree from a top tier school).
The problem is that not enough people have said “that is dumb” in leading up to this fixation on reforming education because they were too duped by the taste of money to realize all the dumb things going on around them.
I like hearing “that is dumb.” It is not disheartening. It is wonderful. When something is dumb and is projected onto people, affecting their lives and their communities it is disheartening to not hear more “that is dumb.”
Stick your finger in a flame. That is dumb. We need to be able to say, ” that is dumb;” when it is.
Firing the entire teaching force in a state is dumb. I am not dumb. And it is not disheartening for a not dumb person to know when something is dumb!!
“borrow $20,000 to get trained as one fifteen years ago (on top of a degree from a top tier school).”– The college you went to for an edu degree is not as fundamental to you’re effectiveness as a teacher or beliefs on this topic as is your mindset and passion for the work. Your ambition seemed to be founded upon superiority, not wholly the profession.
Um… It’s “your effectiveness” not “you’re effectiveness”
Be extra careful when criticizing teachers.
Signed,
Just a Math Teacher
Thank you! At least someone is reading and responding appropriately–(ie. criticizing facts rather than bashing opinions.) Seriously thank you–(no sarcasm.)
Do you mean “your effectiveness?”
You don’t know me. I don’t know you. I don’t understand your point. But I am going to let it go.
I don’t have time for stuff like this.
Superiority? Whatever. I am a teacher. I signed up to be a teacher.
I will fight for education for my children and my students.
Superiority.
??? Go away.
P,
I promise, you… this author has plenty of real solutions to offer! She is very sensible, knowledgeable and prolific where education is concerned!
Tear down? Hardly! As a teacher, my life’s work is building. Every day. Twenty-five years. Building lives. Building knowledge. Building hope. Building futures.
One thing most teachers neglect? Themselves. We too often foolishly believed that our singular focus would speak for us.
Now we know. We must speak for ourselves.
P:
Offering a solution to what? To what problem, exactly, do you think we should be offering solutions? McCammon says in the opening of a recent newspaper piece that he wrote that U.S. schools are failing. Is that the problem you mean? If so, here’s a news flash: If you correct for the results on international standardized tests for the socioeconomic status of the students taking those tests, then U.S. students lead the world.
We are all experienced teachers here. We do not need someone to make this silly invariant prescription. We’re aware of this as a possibility for our instruction, but we are no more likely to do this ALL THE TIME, WITH EVERY GROUP OF STUDENTS, IN EVERY SUBJECT, FOR EVERY TOPIC IN EVERY DOMAIN, than we are likely to, say, have our kids do nothing but gathering of oral histories from this day forward.
Flipped classes and making videos and teaching what one has learned are a few of the thousands and thousands of possibilities in a teacher’s toolkit, no more, no less.
So very well said!
P..You must be new to these boards…Diane Ravitch has offered many solutions…..Have you read her book? You can not jump on this band wagon without doing your own research.
Gee, if only the stakes were low enough for teachers to be so nachalant about such a bad idea. You have stumbled into a war zone where teachers are attacked everyday. I did examine the idea critically, and came to the thougtful conclusion that it is stupid. Would you prefer a euphumism? It is ill-conceived. It ignoes reality. It is impractical. It is insulting to me as an educator and a human being. Shall I go on?
See you have started from the unstated premise that our schools are broken and must somehow be “fixed” with new ideas. I suggest you educator yourself on the reality of the situation and you will see that our schools are not broken. You are being feed that lie by those that stand to profit from destroying schools and who wish to distract us from the real problem for students, poverty.
“P”,
North Carolina +had+ been a beacon of progress in a stagnant South. We were moving forward and improving our educational system for over 40 years. The Research Triangle is evidence that our PROGRESSIVE IDEAS have been highly successful. This recent Teabagger group of thugs has spent the past 4 years destroying everything that has made NC a jewel of progress in the SE. We have GREAT IDEAS AND HAVE HAD THEM FOR OVER 40 YEARS. Get the teabaggers out of NC and all will be well again.
I believe “P” is a paid teabagger thug and should be tried for treason and crimes against humanity.
It’s DUMB because he wants to pay teachers more in exchange for forced retirement and hence lower pension overhang. It is pretty likely unconstitutional.
The flipped classroom is one among thousands of pedagogical formats that can be used by teachers for particular purposes, with particular students and particular material, when appropriate. The idea of making this the full-time format for schooling is so ludicrous, so preposterous, that, again, I would have thought it had been suggested in an Onion parody of education “reform” craziness. McCammon seems to me to have flipped out. This, together with the “three-castes” plan for teachers, is just over the top crazy. Completely, utterly looney.
Eloquent……Love it ! 🙂 Again you are right on target !
One sees this sort of thing again and again from education deformers. They take a decent idea that could be part of a teacher’s toolkit and reify it, turn it into an invariant prescription. The flipped classroom is a useful tool. So is the Socratic seminar. So is the quizbowl competition. So are in-class, in-person demonstration followed by guided practice. One chooses the technique to fit the students and the material being taught. Obviously.
cx: So is in-class, in-person demonstration followed by guided practice.
I agree completely!! I have my Instructional Technology Master’s and learned all about the flipped classroom. It is not just about showing video clips at school. Students are to watch them at home and come to school ready to discuss or ask questions. How can that be done in a class of 40? Also, what about those students who do not have internet at home? We have plenty of those in my neck of the woods. How does this help the kinesthetic learner and others? This has got to be a joke. Someone said this was proposed to make the bonus for only the top 25% in each district (while giving up tenure) to look better. Neither are good ideas. We have lost three teachers at my school this year alone. That was unheard of as we never had that many openings. Teachers are leaving, and it is the good ones.
NC Policy Watch UPDATE on this story: http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2014/01/22/update-nc-teacher-compensation-plan/
“McCammon explained that his plan is nothing more than a brainstorming project between himself and a number of teachers and researchers.”
Dr. McCammon, I apologize for my outburst, above, and for the name calling. I thought, based on this story, that these ideas were pending legislation in North Carolina, and I was outraged that the autonomy and professionalism of the state’s teachers would be so undermined by legislative fiat. We have seen far, far too much of that sort of thing of late.
Brainstorming or not, the notion of firing every teacher in the state should not even enter the conversation and should elicit a response that is emotional.
I try hard to be respectful to both sides too, RS, and not get personal. I respect you for apologizing here, but even a brainstorm on all teachers having to reapply for their jobs is absurd.
Dr. McCammon,
If your “group” was following the brainstorming protocol that encourages any and all ideas be put on the table without critique, the attack here must sound a little over the top. The misinformation helps explains most of the strong feelings; I hope you realize the extreme pressure under which teachers are operating. However, it should be of great concern that the misinformation seems close enough to reality to have been credible to most if not all of us. With the variety of classes I have observed and taught over the years as a substitute and a special education teacher, I cannot remember one that would lend itself to flipping as a major component of the program. Given what we now know about attention and maintaining focus, lecture and direct instruction without any student participation were limited in length.
Dr. McCammon, so you are saying that this proposal has not been discussed with North Carolina legislators by you or others who work with you? We are skeptical, for we live in a time when these sorts of notions are routinely cooked up in backrooms and then foisted on the rest of us with no discussion, no debate, no scholarly critique and no mechanisms for critique and revision going forward–as the Common [sic] Core [sic] State [sic] Standards [sic] clearly were, for example.
So, again, are you saying that you have NOT discussed these proposals with North Carolina legislators or other government officials? And are you these ideas merely proposals that schools and departments and individual teachers can adopt voluntarily, or do you intend that they be legislated, for them to become invariant mandates? Inquiring minds want to know.
Thank you, Robert, for your queries. I have a tendency toward unwarranted trust with which I have probably screwed myself in the past. It was, however, a good characteristic to have with students who had generated little faith in their good offices. Surprisingly, while they too took advantage of me on occasion, they did not like to disappoint me.
And the idea of having kids make videos about everything they learn, also to be found on Dr. McCammon’s website, is another hoot. Hey, I have a brilliant education reform idea: Every time kids learn something, they write a rap song about it. You haven’t really learned something until you have learned it well enough to be able to explain it to the beat of a Dr. Drey tune.
Again, having kids make videos, having them teach what they have learned–these superb practices, in their place. I, for one, would love to see kids learn to design and edit videos (and research papers and lab reports and short fiction and slide shows). But asking students to make videos to teach everything that they have learned–turning these into an invariant prescription, a quotidian modus operandi, which is what Dr. McCammon suggests–is entirely unworkable.
The proposed legislation in NC is just the latest example of a huckster masquerading as a reformer. Mr. McCammon, like most of the “let’s fix public education” crowd, just happens to have a program he wants to sell the state that meets the legislation’s requirements.
We will put a stop to the shredding of our public schools only when teachers realize that they hold the power of the ballot box. Irrespective of what Faux news and the rest of the rightwing echo chamber say, teachers are still well-respected in their communities. People, particularly parents, listen to teachers. Too many teachers have ceded the stage to the reformers, retreating into their classrooms as refuges, hoping to make it all go away.
It will not go away. Not without a fight.
If teachers want to reclaim their profession, they must come out of the classroom and organize. Teachers have to re-engage in the political process. They have to be willing to use their voices to call out politicians who use public education as a whipping post to get elected to office. Teachers have to advocate loudly in front of school boards, legislatures and anywhere else policymakers gather to hold them accountable for their actions and words.
NC is an example of the problem teachers face. Neither the AFT nor the NEA have a strong presence in NC because of teacher reluctance to engage in politics, particularly in a conservative state like NC. So, teachers are mostly unorganized and isolated, and the NC legislature is exacerbating the problem with legislation intended to make them vulnerable to immediate dismissal. NC teachers are in this fix because they were unorganized and politically weak or nonexistent. They, like teachers in many states,, especially in the south where collective bargaining is prohibited or watered down, have no collective voice, and the reformers are stripping away what few protections teachers in those states do have.
NC teachers have a choice. Stand up, organize – and fight. Join the local AFT or NEA chapter, sign up colleagues, organize parents, register voters, pressure the decision makers, and VOTE.
-OR-
Retreat into the classroom, draw the blinds and hope for the best. In the meantime, study or train for a different line of work.
Well said! I have always been vocal about the politics of education. So many wanted to put their heads in the sand. And for many, it isn’t appropriate to speak up or against anything. But I am finally starting to see the quiet ones speaking and sharing posts on social media which is informing parents and other community members. The final straw for many parents is the third grade Read to Achieve legislation. Parents are starting to waken! I am trying to inform those who will listen.
To add on to your thoughts…I am a parent of two children in public schools. We too need to mobilize & make that same stand in support of public schools & teachers. We cannot sit back any longer & the strength is in numbers (& voters).
“Hate teachers?” That’s just a part of the equation. They clearly have a different notion of public education. They replace master craftsmanship for the more efficient assembly line. It’s about “getting a job done”; schooling rather than educating.
Those promoting these policies have little regard for the many children affected by them, nor for future societal consequences.
The plan isolates learners, rather than build communities of learners, and this, i believe, is central to the wants of big business. Socially isolated workers.
Such a tiered system for teachers would do the same. Isolate the worker, own him.
I’ve seen it on a small scale as administrators plan teachers’ duty rosters, planning times, lunches, teaching assignments. Where there is unity, the purpose is to divide. Where there is community, create suspicion and envy.
NC just plans to do it on a larger scale, and right out in the open.
Why the 20 years and out? Who would possibly do that for a career? Is it ageism? At 20 years in, a teacher is still in his/her mid forties. What then? Said teacher would spend her whole career improving her craft only to be booted out at the top of her game. This plan is ridiculous.
I wonder how they would sell the 20 year maximum limit on teacher careers. I know why they want to do it, and how it would sell in the backrooms, but how would you spin this for public acceptance?
I have 5 years experience as a flipped classroom teacher, after 15 years in a traditional classroom. Based on my first-hand experience, I would reject out of hand the notion that flipped classrooms allow a greater student/teacher ratio.
This is just another instantiation of the deformer dogma, promoted by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and the Thomas P. Fordham Foundation, that class size doesn’t matter. What an insane notion that is! But these people long for the day when teachers can be replaced entirely with curricula created by Amplify and Pearson and a dozen Gates startups and disseminated via the Orwellian inBloom portal. This is a nightmare technocratic vision of the future. I haven’t read anything this repulsive since I read Ray Kurzweil’s rhapsodic descriptions, in one of his recent books, of a future in which intimate relations between human partners would be replaced by interactions with feelie devices.
I saw Bill Gates being interviewed on MSNBC earlier this week and he was asked about the research on class size. He said a “good” teacher with 30 students was as effective as an “okay” teacher with 20 students. (sorry, I am paraphrasing, and I hope you get my point.)
My question for Mr. Gates is: What about those of us with 40 students in our classrooms on a regular basis? 30 students would be a dream for most teachers I know.
What age group(s) have you used the flipped classroom with? Would it work with Preschool, Kindergarten, 1st grades?
Disgusting…… I’d like to comment, but its not worthy of my time….
Teachers of the past sure failed the good Dr….. Any good teachers would have never let anyone with that kind of idiotic “fill my pockets” thoughts get anywhere near Education of our youth and surely not a title…of dr…… intentionally in little letters….
Find a rock and crawl under it…..preferably in a place far far away…..
This is an atrocity towards NC Teachers!! Flipped classrooms only work if the child(ren) have internet at home! I can tell you out of my small class of 15, I have 5-8 without a computer at home let alone internet access. The population in poorer counties can’t afford internet and computers.
My son had to write an article summary for social studies tonight. He is 11 and in the sixth grade. I think I may not be the best influence on him.
How crazy is Dr. Lodge McCannon’s new educational policy?
This summary was based on two articles, both by Lindsay Wagner of the Progressive Pulse January 21, 2014, January 22, 2014
Summary by J.C. R
There recently are crazy things that the policy makers have been doing to public education, but this one possible policy may be the silliest of them all. A “self-proclaimed educational pioneer” named Dr. Lodge McCammon is a musician (as if that gave him any right over other people) decided that he was going to try to forward his idea to NC policy makers:
• All teachers would not be allowed to teach for more than 20 years before they were forced to retire, chose a different career, or go to a different place entirely to teach.
• Salaries would be classified into 3 groups, Apprentice, Master, or Career. Each one giving more money to the teacher on a per pupil base standard. To get from Apprentice (the first stage) to Master you must have been teaching for at least 3 years, completed an online training program ( in flipped classrooms) and can get a high score on some customer survey. You must be able to lead as well as have an advanced degree to get to the highest level of salary grouping.
• All classes must be in a “flipped” form.
Another thing that they were going to do was make a lot less teachers and more students in those teachers’ classes.
An update to this was that McCammon was going to revise his earlier draft by not putting the “Teachers may only work for 20 years” after having an argument in the comments about his earlier draft. This article relates to social studies through the field of economics. His proposal is meant to save money and be more efficient rather than concerned with any care toward the quality of education.
Oh my goodness! A flipped classroom works really well if the students home has at least:
1. a computer or ipad
2. Internet connection
3. Supportive parents – parents who can assist their students at home
While I am sure that there are many privileged students in this fine state who have at least 2/3 of the above I know that a large number of my students do not have internet or computers. They are unable to meet basic needs such as rent payments, clean clothes, food.
And small families. With three or more children at home all competing for one computer to all do their flipped classroom homework, that could be a huge problem. I’m from Utah–land of large families.
We the people need to stand up. Teachers, parents, students, administrators, College professors and administration, citizens who are not parents but who do care about the future of our state and country and world. I know the Moral Mondays have been held but I believe we need more than this. This dire situation calls for a multitude of actions:
1. Non violent protests (Moral Mondays)
2. Written petitions
3. Letters from EVERY person in the state who does not agree with the actions of the government. This is at least 75% of the population who disagree with the insanity.
4. Letters every month or week or day from EVERY person in the state who does not agree with the actions of the government.
5. People must get out and VOTE these politicians out of office!
6. University presidents must speak out against this ignorance and travesty.
Interestingly enough, I first heard about this yesterday in a Facebook post from a fellow tech facilitator. She is FB friends with McCammon and he soon commented on her post. He says that the article that ran in Ncpolicywatch was not a finished policy and was “part of a brainstorming process.” He claimed that his main goal is to motivate teachers to flip their classrooms because he things it will help students and teachers. He also say that as far as he knows, the plan is not being discussed by policymakers.
I take him at his word. I don’t think he’s out to destroy public education in NC like many of our legislators. I do know he has some pretty good ideas on flipping. I’m not sold on flipping as the be-all-end-all of teaching tools, but I think it has some promise.
As for the 3-tiered pay system, I took him to task on that. I think it would created an Educational Hunger Games with teachers constantly trying to sabotage each other to get to the pay scale that actually lets you live a normal life. I’d like to know more about how the brainstorming document “got out,” before I condemn him too hard though. We’ve all knocked around crazy, stupid ideas because we knew they wouldn’t see the light of day.
My worry now is that our fine legislature will latch on to his plan regardless, even though they won’t give us the funding necessary to by the technology that mass classroom flipping would need. Why? Because all they will see is that this plan cuts teacher salaries by 10%.
Sigh. It’s a sad time to be an educator in North Carolina.
When are we going to put the decision making power back in the hands of teachers? We are the people who work directly with the children, and we have the most insight on what will and will not work with kids.
Other than the emphasis on technology (literally rotting brains and numbing social skills), it’s actually is seemingly descent plan. Think about it, how many bad apples are land-locked in a district with tenure, wasting students’ time and diminishing growth? Additionally, those who have been in the biz for 20-30 years with little to no education in newer trends or emerging curricula cannot be as effective as those who continue to cycle in and out of workshops or higher edu. (Lack of funds and attention on staff development are to blame for this.) It would help to retain those in for the kids–not the comfort, easiness, or hierarchical feeling of ohhh I’ve been here 30 years and I’m queen/king of the castle.” Additionally, even if the proposal was to send all teachers to Mars for a seminar– we should at least give it some thought–some of what is going on right now isn’t doing us any more good than being on another planet. Those of you who are analyzing and responding to the rationally (either in support or against the matter), awesome–critical thinking is key in such an idea. Those who are displaying the utmost ignorance of the matter A.) I hope you are NOT educators and B.) if you are, are you afraid? If so, perhaps you have some inner-infidelities to improve on.
Now, whether or not the proposal can be implemented effectively is a whole other story.
-an inspired/empowered educator of NC –commited
When I first started reading your post, I thought it was sarcasm. But sadly it was not. Are you serious? There are many outstanding teachers I know who put their whole heart and hard work into teaching longer than 20 years. They are still effective. Also, saying that they are rotten apples just hanging around just isn’t the case. Much of what is going on has come from years of No Child Left Behind and Race to the Top. Education if being bought by the rich. But scrapping the whole system, over-testing our children, and demoralizing teachers are great ideas we should consider? I do not demoralize my students to get them to try harder or do a better job. And no I am not afraid. I am willing to learn new ways of teaching, have 19 years of experience, a master’s in Instructional Technology and am a NBCT.
That was for J.
What is with the Mc names and this idea. I have always been proud of my Scotts heritage. Not so sure right about now.
Being that I am superior (per you), no not afraid. You cannot be afraid and be a teacher. Even trying that argument is so cliche! Good grief.
“Is your refrigerator running?”
“Better go catch it!!!”” Ha ha huh huh. That’s the level you are on.
Get with it.
People who care about their state don’t like dumb ideas.
I dont like dumb ideas. For my state. Or my children. And I am superior (per you).
I wonder if your students/family find you as cynical as you appear on a blog. Perhaps anonymity of the web is eliciting your big-bad-bulletproof approach. Either way, I didn’t think we were here to be sarcastic or rude. Clearly, you missed the meaning of my response, I assume because you immediately were offended and dismissed my thought without any reflection. By the way (and perhaps our pedagogies defer severely) but there is never a dumb idea–I hope you don’t tell your students that–reduces student interaction during discussions, Q&A, etc.
Prohibition. Not a dumb idea?
Prohibition. Not a dumb idea?
State funded casinos. Not a dumb idea?
Race to the Top. Just another dumb idea.
J.–
when you are the one being attacked, it is logical to respond with emotion
I work for, utilize and support public school
Therefore I will get angry on behalf of public school
cynical and sarcastic are not terms used in describing me, ever. But standing up for something is.
You throw a rock at someone, don’t expect a thoughtful conversation.
And we are not in a classroom discussing theories. We are talking about real decisions that affect real people. You are not one of my students. And neither is McGammon. I understand the difference, as I understand decorum. I am not sure you do.
I will get angry and I will not apologize for that and that does not make me cynical, sarcastic or a bad teacher.
Selah
Can you imagine? Who would want to go to school? There wouldn’t be much of a personal connection. They don’t pay teachers enough as it is. They need to quit trying to throw the baby out with the bath water. NC will end up being the bottom of the barrel when it comes to education. Who would want to work in such an under-appreciated environment.
I am a natural born North Carolinian with a Masters Degree in Curriculum Instruction and specializations in ESL. I am currently working on my PHD. Honestly I agree with the person who said it may take something drastic to get the attention of people. When I was growing up I was so fortunate to have teachers who were amazing rolemodels and so passionate about Education that it fueled my desire to become a teacher. These innovative and passionate teachers helped fuel my desire to become a teacher and are the reason I am a teacher today. These teachers who for so many years kept North Carolina in the top 10 of US rankings for my entire school life in North Carolina. From the way teachers are being treated in North Carolina there won’t be any wonderful educators left to nurture the fertile field of future teachers. Students are not clueless. If they see that teachers are unhappy, and unappreciated they will not choose to become teachers themselves. This will leave a drastic blight in North Carolina. Maybe not now- as most teachers can not simply just pack up and leave the state due to family obligations, property and other reasons, but, It will eventually catch up with North Carolina. If this downward spiral continues, in 10-15 years there will be a HUGE shortage of teachers in North Carolina, with very few newly qualified educators coming out of the universities to fill the voids.
Now in all fairness I have to say that I left NC and moved to The United Arab Emirates and I am not teaching in the mess that you have been left to deal with. If you can make the decision to leave know that the grass is not just greener on the other side. It is very lush and filled with respect and admiration. Teachers are very respected here and Culturally it is considered as one of the highest honors to be a teacher.
The schools here are wonderful and you are treated with appreciation and respect. Sure you work hard, but most of the kids here are excited about learning. (All schools are private so people are paying for their education). They pay all ticket cost for your travel to the UAE. You are given a shared apartment so your housing is taken care of (this would never happen in the states)- You also make a decent tax-free salary (that you don’t have to worry about paying for housing out of) and top notch health care. A first year teacher here makes around 3000 a month. If anyone is looking to make the move overseas to a less hostile enviroment, Overseas schools are recruiting heavily for next year at this time.
Becareful of scams though- No real school would ever ask you to pay anything (other than the fees to have your degrees attested through the state department) up front. A real job will not ask for any money.
My school is currently recruiting for next year as well. We are a wonderful American International School Located in Dubai, UAE.
For our school you should be a Native English Speaker with an Education background and at least a bachelors degree. We need k-12 teachers. If you are interested send your resume to saisd@emirates.net.ae
I appologize for any typos in the above message as I typed it on my phone and apparently there is not an edit button. 🙂
I am not a teacher but I home schooled my child from K-8th grade. He is now in public school in IB classes. I have seen first hand in the two years that my son has attended public school that there are some real problems that need to be addressed for all children receiving a public education. I wish I had some creative ideas or bind blowing ideas for fixing the problems that are in the public schools today but unfortunately I do not. Even though I may not have the answers I can tell you I do not believe that the general ideas being supported by many of the teachers commenting. Basically they propose that the answer is better teacher pay and compensation for masters degrees, etc. for teachers. Also that teachers should be judged by their supervisors and peers. Although I do not necessarily disagree that teachers deserve the compensation I do not think it is the answer to the problems that public schools are facing. A degree does not make a good teacher. A masters degree does not make you a better teacher and I do not agree that teachers success should be judged entirely by their peers and/or supervisors. For example, my son’s two worst teachers had several advanced degrees. One in particular has so many letters behind his name it makes me wonder why he is even still teaching. Let me say he could not teach a dog to bark. He is arrogant and could care less if he reaches every child in his class. I get the impression that he thinks his degrees make him immune to criticism. His peers think he is great because he is big man on campus and he chairs his subject. I can tell you the students and parents are not of the same opinion. I agree that teacher deserve more money but how is that going to make better teachers. The best teachers I know do it for the love of teaching not for the pay. Paying teachers more is not going to fix the problem. In my 10 years of homeschooling I saw many mothers with not formal education become wonderful teachers, not because they were educated to teach but because the education of their children was their primary motivation. I do not have the answers but compensation is not the answer. It is the right thing to do but it is not the answer. I do know that a system cannot work that bases all its success on tests for tests sake only. This system is not good for the teachers or the students. What good is a test when it is only used to judge a student or a teacher. You crash children’s self esteem and grades but do not use the information to benefit the child. So you teach for two week on a subject and you give a test on the subject and 5 out of 20 children flunk the test. What happens? Do they reteach the material or give those five students a chance to improve or even master the material. No, those five children get a failing grade and we move on because the majority of the children “got it” even though another 5 cheated and 5 more of the class would have passed even if the teacher never stepped into the classroom. So what benefit is the test? The sad predicament is that our whole public education system revolves around a test and not around “the child.”
Until we find a way to teach and measure success without a “test” we will never find a solution.
I hope that in the future that teachers will be rewarded for the often thankless job they do but compensation and advanced degrees are not the answer to a very complicated problem.
The best teachers I know do it for the love of teaching not for the pay.
And these are mutually exclusive? And teachers do not now do it for the love of it? In most places, one can make as much or more running a department at a big box store as one makes teaching.
and
The notion that advanced education of teachers doesn’t matter is mind-blowingly absurd, on the face of it. You can’t teach what you do not know.
That ridiculous idea comes from the Gates Foundation studies that showed no relation between standardized test scores and teachers’ advanced degrees. Now, should one conclude from that that having educated teachers is unimportant? Clearly not. You can’t teach the English Romantic poets unless you know the English Romantic poets. You can’t teach phonics unless you know phonics. You can’t understand how to teach grammar and vocabulary unless you know something about the science of language acquisition.
Such a study should lead one to question the validity of the tests AND to look carefully at what teachers are studying when they take those advanced degrees. But to draw the conclusion, from this study, that advanced degrees don’t matter is completely absurd. When people willingly latch onto something as absurd as this, one should look for what is motivating them to do so. There, the answer is clear: People don’t like paying for more highly educated teachers. They want teaching on the cheap.
You want to teach a child anything? First, teach that child to teach himself. If a child learns to teach himself he can overcome poor teaching by reading and learning. I was homeschooled. My mom had two associate degrees that were not in teaching and my dad never passed the first semester of college. Neither my mom nor my dad were particularly good teachers. What they did do well is they taught me the importance of not allowing others to limit or cap your capacity for learning.
Technology is a good way to teach a child to learn without the limitations of waiting for a class. When I went back into a brick and mortar school I was often pages ahead of the rest of the class. Teachers are great. They are of pivotal importance for many, but a good parent can teach their children how not to depend on them. That is one thing of many lacking today.
Follow the money..$$$$$
I saw the author of “Extortion” on one of the talk shows last night.
After listening to this author and the former CEO of some oil company saying this is true…I had a sick feeling….This is what is happening in education…It is the money.It is the greed ….i
Education is now a Political Money Making Extortion ring of Greedy Politicians…
Robert Shepherd has it correct..”Education Deform”……..
This is PURE GREED…..
Author of Extortion……
Peter Schweizer
Extortion: How Politicians Extract Your Money, Buy Votes, and Line Their Own Pockets,
Dr. Lodge McCammon’s FIZZ
December 16, 2013
.
Our education system will crumble if we keep allowing politicians to tell us that learning content is more important than establishing positive relationships.
What inspired you in school? The content? A standardized test? Not likely. It was probably a teacher (hopefully more than one). If teachers are forced to spend all their time rushing through the content in order to prepare students for high-stakes standardized tests, then there won’t be enough time left for building/strengthening relationships. Relationships are the source of inspiration and the key to student success.
So, what can we do about it?
http://lodgemccammon.com/flip/research/relationships/
ok, so there must be some kind of conspiracy or a contradiction about/from this person?
I agree… It’s all about money. They already are doing all they can to make public schools look bad by testing are kids with way higher expectations and with read to achieve for third graders- having a result kids driving themselves to school in seventh grade! It’s ridiculous! Do they not care about the child? Teachers can endure or leave the profession… But the children… How sad. The children are our future. We are not giving them the people, the materials, and logic it takes to learn. They are going to see a drop out rate like never before with what they are doing. They only want parents to switch their kids to private schools by treating the children so poorly in public schools. Great teachers are leaving the profession and will be able to be okay. But the children they are hurting will never be okay. Instead of worrying about how they can get great teachers to quit or leave the state, they need to worry about those poor children.
This is (hopefully) false. What is more accurate is that the current NC legislators do not want an educated population. They want to return to the days of uneducated “minions” who will do exactly what they are told. The more highly educated a citizen, the more likely they are to think for themselves–and probably be more aware of what s going on politically. What the legislature wants is for the schools to continue to produce low skilled workers who are satisfied with their X-boxes and American Idols, and pay no attention to what the wealthy businesses are doing with their money and to their environment.
I have a wonderful cartoon in my room which all in one picture explains testing in the US–it is a picture of a line of animals-an elephant, monkey, fish (in a bowl on a base), frog, cat, dog and a couple of other animals. Behind them in a tree. In front in a man telling them “it is important that everyone be tested the same–you all have to climb that tree”
Where to begin…
First, it is highly unlikely that Mr. McCammon’s reforms will ever become policy in the form he originally proposed them. After a cursory reading I believe some of his ideas have merit, while others do not. There are any number of proposals, studies, books, etc being discussed among educators nationwide and thus far, the only consensus I’ve found among them is an agreement that our educational system is in need of a major overhaul. The standard models employed in most school systems do not meet the needs of most students and as a result, they are falling through the cracks in ever increasing numbers. Any discussions regarding such overhauls will bring the entire spectrum of ideas to light, some extreme, some traditional, and the solution is often found somewhere in the middle. I suspect that will be the case in North Carolina.
Paying teachers more money will not make them better teachers. If a bigger paycheck is the only thing preventing you from being a better teacher, then you have no business in a classroom.
Advanced degrees, certifications, etc are only one metric for measuring teacher competence and should never be the last word on one’s ability to teach. Case in point…
In 2004 I was hired as an adjunct faculty member at a small school in a rural farm community here in Ohio, teaching applied music to students, grades 6-12. I am a professional musician of 22 years with an education based largely in private instruction. I am a graduate of a music trade school, equivalent to an Associate’s degree, but is by no means a BA or other advanced degree. I possess no teaching certificate, nor am I eligible to receive one with limited formal education. In the 48 years of the school’s existence prior to my arrival, the music program had never achieved any rating, in any class, above a 2 in Class C. For those unaware, music ratings are graded on a scale from 5 (lowest) to 1 (highest) in four classes from D (middle school level) to A (advanced/collegiate level). In my first year, my students received a 1 rating in Class B. Within 2 years, we were achieving 1 ratings in Class A (highest possible rating) at both the district and state levels. In short, my students were performing at a level beyond hundreds of schools statewide with much larger student bodies and much greater resources. I left in 2009 after being told that despite my success, I would never be hired on full time. The reason given to me was I lacked the degree and teaching certificate the state required. In the time since my departure there have been two individuals who replaced me, both with college degrees (BA, MA), both with certificates, and neither one has come close to the success we saw during my time at the school.
There are a lot of people out there like me. People ready, willing, and able, to successfully teach the next generation of Americans a wide variety of academic and artistic disciplines. Locking us out because we didn’t follow the usual paths is a tremendous waste of talent.
“Paying teachers more money will not make them better teachers. If a bigger paycheck is the only thing preventing you from being a better teacher, then you have no business in a classroom.”
Do a find and replace on the word “teachers”, and replace it with “bankers” or “CEOs” or “Commodities traders”, and the word “classroom” with those jobs’ places of work.
Do you still believe your statement? I’d be willing to wager you do not. And if not, why not?
Remember all the chatter that we heard about the “brain drain” that limiting corporate compensation (compensation given them, mind you, from TAX DOLLAR BAIL-OUTS) would cause?
Apply that same standard to teachers. In fact, you don’t have to do that. You just have to be minimally observant, and you’ll find that this is EXACTLY what is happening.
The only difference is, the people in charge of wrecking our economy were entirely at fault, where teachers bear only a part of the blame for poor schools. And NONE of the blame for overcrowding, underfunding…and good teachers leaving.
I’m in my 43rd year of teaching. I’m a better teacher than when I started, not only because I have a wealth of experience, but because I don’t have to juggle 1 or 2 part-time jobs along with teaching to support my family.
I used the phrase “the only thing” to address a specific attitude that I have seen among some teachers I have known (not many, but some) who only do the bare minimum required by their job because they don’t feel their paycheck warrants anything above the minimum effort required to keep their job. These individuals are not focused on teaching, but on maintaining their income and in my experience it is the students who suffer the most from this.
Do I believe that teachers should make more money than they do? Absolutely. Do I believe that increasing teacher pay makes it easier for them to focus their precious time and energy on being the best teacher they can instead of worrying about feeding their families? Absolutely. Do I think higher compensation will attract more qualified candidates that might otherwise seek an alternate profession? Yes I do.
“Paying teachers more money will not make them better teachers. If a bigger paycheck is the only thing preventing you from being a better teacher, then you have no business in a classroom.”
No….I do my best for my K kiddos no matter the paltry sum I am paid. But I have been in the classroom for 20 years and have too much invested to change to another profession where I am valued.
However, paying more money WILL attract people who are brighter and better to the classroom. Otherwise, when those of us who are invested in the children retire, you will be left with those who are just marking time until a better career opportunity comes along, Don’t our child deserve the best?
You Matthew are an idiot — you have sour grapes because you are attempting to enter a profession you never prepared for and because of that you are bashing public teaching requirements. Frankly, I’d rather not have you teaching my children. And you won’t get the two years of education in teaching you need because who would go to school and pay that much money for that low pay?
Considering what my education is and what I am paid yes, I should get paid more. Will I be a better teacher? THAT ISN’T THE ISSUE. I should get paid according to my worth. I have two degrees, a masters, my National Boards and am a Master Teacher of the State. Currently, when you consider my 12 hour days, weekends, after school activities, grading in the evening at home, giving up my lunch everyday to tutor, materials I pay for to upgrade my materials to current standards, summers writing curriculum and taking classes — I make less than minimum wage.
I am an outstanding teacher and my district does not rate above satisfactory in fear of having to pay any merit money. Don’t start me on the evaluation system. For the first 12 years of my job I was rated outstanding by 3 different principals. My OAAs are always 95% and above in an inner city school. My kids make AYP. Don’t start talking about something you don’t know. I’m tired of people saying ALL schools are failing, ALL students can’t make it, ALL teachers are awful. Your generalizations suck.
Well, no… I’m not an idiot. I used generalizations because I was speaking of what I see as a general problem within the system as a whole. Had I been speaking of a specific instance, I would have addressed it with specific examples and ideas. Every school and school system is different to some degree and each requires different solutions. I am not so naive as to believe there is a one-size-fits-all solution for NC or any other state.
As a point of clarification, I do believe that teachers should make more money than they do and I have nothing against increased teacher pay. What I have an issue with is teachers who don’t put forth their best effort because they don’t feel their paycheck is sufficient, i.e. “I’m only making $28K a year, so I don’t want to bother making sure my students know their material, but for another $10K…” Teachers like this exist, and I grant they are the exception rather than the rule, but they exist nevertheless. Would you want a teacher with that attitude teaching your children? I wouldn’t.
With regards to my preparation, or lack thereof, I would point you back to the example in my original post. I got results that no one before me or after me, all of whom had a traditional background and training, did. My kids learned, and in the end, that’s what it’s about. Isn’t it? I didn’t leave public teaching because of sour grapes. I left because I have a family to support and I needed a full time job with a full time wage.
Although this proposal is an absolute insult to teachers, they/we/you must own the fact that schools are turning out graduates that would not have left middle school when I was taught in North Carolina schools. Several years age, I had two children in North Carolina universities at the opposite ends of the state. In the runup to exams, and on exam day, it was not unusual for either or both of my children to call me and ask for help with a particular subject. Any subject. I am the proud recipient of a high school diploma from the early seventies, and on any given subject other than advanced math I am still able to school my children. There can be no argument that the quality of education has fallen. Although I remember when the demise of education began, it would be not politically correct for me to comment further. We MUST do something to improve the quality of education in NC, but this is certainly not the answer.
It actually has very little to do with schools and the teachers….sure, there is accountability for us…
But look at society as a whole. You really think it is all belonging to teachers causing the problems and not doing there jobs?
“In a 2011 op-ed in the News & Observer, McCammon explains that flipped classrooms, in which students can view videotaped instructional materials at their own pace, should allow teachers to accommodate larger classroom sizes–and be paid according to how many students they can teach in one classroom.” The “flipped” classroom does not work this way. The idea is to have students view lecture materials and read at home and then come to class prepared to work on porblems related to the course material (to demonstrate mastery of the material through problem-solving). This requires class sizes to stay the same or even to be reduced!!! One cannot effectively work with young students on problem solving in classes larger than 20-25 students. Legislators who are proposing this idea should be required to provide DATA that a teacher can effectively work with students in larger classes using a “flipped” classroom pedagogy. Where’s the data that drives this ridiculous proposal?
I flipped my classroom this year and I can say with certainty that this method required a smaller class size. Traditional methods like lecture and book assignments can be done with huge numbers of students without much adjustment. But flipped classes require the teacher to engage students individually, where each extra student demands more attention from the teacher. With 30+ students in the room, the teacher then becomes irrelevant and the students would be better off just taking the course online off campus or in a computer lab.
If this proposed model is ever adopted, it would be a fundamental shift from classroom teaching to online learning. This in turn would create an even greater shift towards private education.
The GOP HATES education (it allows students to think for themselves, something which both the GOP and all churches find unacceptable) and it hates women (the majority of teachers.) And, of course, it hates paying ANYTHING for services which do not generate immediate PROFIT.
Thus the plan to marginalize teaching and education. More destruction of the pitiful bit of America remaining after the hostile takeover of 2001, and after Republicans decided, during the Viet Nam war, to eliminate education budgets so students would NOT question authority. That was the beginning of the Great Dumbing Down, which was GREATLY exacerbated with the founding of Faux/Goebbels Propaganda Programming, sometimes laughingly referred to as “news” (they themselves only refer to it as “entertainment,” to keep the lawsuits at bay.)
But David, what do you really think? LOL. 🙂
Apparently, he is unable to think.
If you have a problem with the plan, defeat it in North Carolina. Stop looking to political cronies and sitting puppet presidents. The federal government has no authority over, or responsibility for public education, Arne Duncan should be fired and the rest of the department abolished.
Right on, David Phillips!
If a teacher is earning $30,000 annually and has a salary increase to $60,000 annually, are they suddenly better teachers? Probably not, but it will encourage more people to become teachers thus increasing the pool of applicants which should result in better teachers.
Money isn’t necessarily the issue when recruiting teachers.
I can’t speak to another state, but here in Ohio there are at least 20-30 applicants, if not more, for every teaching position that comes open. The universities turn out far more certified teachers than we have jobs for. I know a number of them and the majority are forced to find work in other fields until they get a teaching position. I know a few that have simply given up looking.
There are some teaching positions in the Pittsburgh area that have hundreds (some 500+) applicants, especially elementary in districts with strong reputations. Some districts only look at teacher applications with very high GPAs ) above 3.8 and above 180 on the Praxis test for Reading. There is no shortage of qualified individuals and PA has higher Praxis scoring guidelines of many other states. That said, they still continue to knock the teaching profession saying we aren’t qualified or working hard enough. I hope all of the NC teachers plan on voting in the next state election!
Wow, if Ohio turns out such fine teachers then why when they come to NC to teach they fail. As a NC teacher who is a mentor the teachers from your great state that I have worked with have not been very good at all they are not prepared or even capable of doing what is needed to teach students. The reason your state has 20 to 30 applicants for each job is because they have unions and teachers never leave their jobs not because you state produces the “best” teachers. Please do not comment on education or teaching until you yourself have spent time teaching in a classroom not subbing but teaching. No one knows what it is like to be a teacher or what we deal with on a regular basis unless you yourself have taught we deal. Teachers not only deal with mounds of paperwork, bigger classrooms, and changing doctrine on a daily basis but we also now have the threat of shootings and crazy parents and we do this everyday with smiles on our faces and hope in hearts for the 48th lowest pay in the US. I deserve a raise because I am a professional with a degree.
Exactly.
Beg pardon, but your hypothetical seems to suppose the opposite of the plan described above. Where is that increase that you suggest would attract more teachers?
The plan described above suggested demotes teachers to video kiosk monitors who verifies the attendance records of some classroom management software. While opportunities for advancement are strictly curtailed by the three layer stratification.
The single best way to increase the quality of education is to decrease classroom sizes. Too bad the opposite is the easiest way to create short term savings.
Being a former North Carolinian and longtime educator, I was deeply saddened at the thought that a group of supposedly educated people “brainstormed” and came up with this idea. I thought I was reading the sequel to Logan’s Run when I reviewed this plan. Would rank right up there with Swifts’ “A Modest Proposal” if this plan, too, was satirical. Seems like the McCammon has a “death grip on sand” when it comes to teacher pay and teacher motivation.
The “flipped classroom” is the latest fad. It’s catching on everywhere, and I am very wary of it. We have two teachers in our school who are trying it out.
My son had the joy of experiencing a flipped classroom for Honors Algebra 2. He passed…not because of the teacher, but because of the private tutor that I spent $40.00 an hour on to help him learn the material. It boggles the mind to think that someone, somewhere thought “Hey, let’s teach math as a flip class”! With 40+ students in his class, there was little opportunity to have questions answered.
Please see update @ http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2014/01/22/update-nc-teacher-compensation-plan/.
How sad. I am curious to know what other profession is treated like this.
Brainstorm? No, this is idiot drizzle.
And how exactly are they supposed to find a new career after 20 years?
My thoughts exactly!
As a college student currently seeking a degree in education this saddens me. This should not be about the teachers, it should be about the students. What works best for each student in the classroom? If a classroom is “flipped” into a video/ techonogy based classroom then how will there be modifications or adaptations for students? What about the inclusion students? How would that benefit them? Classrooms require teachers that can help each student learn to the best of their ability. Every student learns differently. We aren’t raising robots that think, act, and learn the same. This is a terrible idea. We need to stop making things about the money and about the teachers. The purpose and goal of education is to educate the upcoming generations.
Oh, sure…it seems this “independent educational consultant” McCammon has NO shame. In my opinion, he is just another self-promoting profiteer from the ivory tower who could not survive in the regular high school classroom(he taught only TWO years.) He gets a gig at a college; becomes a “Doctor” in Curriculum (yes one of those who has to mention he is a doctor…sigh); and now he is the expert of all things. He knows how to use all the buzzwords from “flipped classroom” to “differentiate.” Now he wants to make a name for himself.
He stands on the shoulders of the strong, brave teacher labour force that came before him–his elders who fought so he could even make a decent living. He stands on their shoulders while spitting right on top of them.
This CHARLATAN, SNAKE OIL SALESMAN has a blog that shows his corny educational songs…wow he’s really qualified to dictate salary schedules for teachers. In the fifties he would be called a pinko, communist or fascist. Today he just gives creedence to “Those who can teach, teach. Those who can’t teach, teach others how to teach.” Of course, all of the above is just my opinion.
I know Lodge McCammon, and this was taken out of context. Not saying that North Carolina isn’t looking into such legislation, but Lodge has nothing to do with it. He is a very pro-teacher, musician professor….not a politician or legislator. I have used his music and ideas for years — for free. He is not how he is being portrayed.
Wow. For years we’ve all heard the old adage about those who teach doing so in spite of the poor financial reward – they do it for the love of teaching and the desire to make a difference in the world. This proposal would take even that away! If this proposal is enacted, why would anyone hoping to raise a family or build financial security for themselves want to be a teacher in NC? Looking at this, my first questions have to do with the 20-year limit. Assuming a teacher begins out of college, he/she would be forced to “retire or move on to another industry” in their early to mid 40’s. It would then be necessary to build a successful second career in something else. They’d be competing with other applicants who are 20 years younger. If he/she has done the extra work necessary to earn at the 52k level, where could they find a comparable beginning salary with no direct experience? Even though the 72k level sounds attractive, what motivation is there for someone with an advanced degree to come into this profession that will only last half their working life? Especially if it takes nearly half that time to pay off the college loans it took to earn that Ph.D.?
This is just another example of the devastation that is going on in North Carolina in regards to public education. As the son of two teachers, education is in my blood. I left the teaching profession in NC ten years ago because I could no longer, in good faith, be part of a profession that is treated with such disregard. Here are some of my other thoughts on the current education situation in NC.
There are many issues that can be debated when it comes to education reform, but most of the experts will agree that raising the level of teacher quality can have the greatest immediate impact on students. Nothing can influence the student achievement levels more than highly qualified, gifted educators. Unfortunately, legislators in the state of North Carolina have failed to grasp this concept.
Instead of finding ways to attract the best and brightest into the teaching profession, the state has done everything in its power to turn a once noble profession into a disgrace. In a state where teachers’ pay ranks 46th out of 50 states, legislators have decided it is a good idea to continue a five year pay freeze, remove master’s pay, reduce the number of assistants, and take away tenure. Sure, we can argue the merits of tenure. Most good teachers would tell you they don’t want or need tenure, but don’t continue to take away from an already downtrodden profession.
You can continue to abuse the teachers in the state of North Carolina, but at what expense? Many of the most talented teachers have already left the profession, and many future stars will never enter the teaching profession in North Carolina. Then we sit around scratching our heads trying to figure out why the quality of our children’s education is so poor.
One could argue that there is nothing more important than educating the youth of our country, but yet we treat teaching as a profession where anyone can excel. That’s just not the case. The gift to educate at the highest levels is not an ability that everyone is born with or can learn to master. We must find those that are blessed with this ability, get them in the classroom, and keep them there. The only way we can do that is by raising the bar, not lowering it.
I agree with your comments regarding quality teachers, but you fail to mention why teacher assistants have been reduced & why there’ve been pay freezes. It’s the economy. As a state employee who also hasn’t had a raise in 4/5 years, I’m happy to still have a job after all the cuts that have occurred over the last few years. I could never figure it out about this country as a whole, but when times are hard economically, it’s always education that they start cutting first.
Today NPR had coverage of education issues in NC politics. More of a neutral tone to my ears, but impressive that they gave it coverage:
Here & Now, 1/24/14: As North Carolina Grows, Public Education Shifts
There are more words wasted on describing the failing public eduction system, and the need for reformation, than grains of sand on the beach. The biggest reasons our schools cannot perform better than they do are related to social and economic factors, and the pressures of increased demands – without funding. Poverty is a huge issue in many school systems, and it shouldn’t take an educational specialist to understand why. Also, our culture has changed drastically in the last generation or two. Busy working parents, with exhaustion inspired apathy, and haywire reasoning that doesn’t allow them to accept that their children need to accept some of the responsibility in becoming educated are becoming more the norm. Nobody wants to do homework, or read anymore. Children miss an inordinate amount of school;much of it for vacations. Excuses run rampant – and it’s the parents making them, not just the students. Then there is the brilliant political agenda of making the teachers the scapegoats. Teachers are greedy, lazy, and uncaring seems to be the slogan of today. They work short days, and not enough days a year. I frequently wish that every parent, pundit, and politician would have to spend one week doing the job of a teacher. Opinions and support might fall in the realm of reality then.
You are Spot On!!!!!!!!
You must be a teacher…they aren’t listening to us:(
Not to mention the solid research we now have on how poverty and stress from neonate through 5 years old changes the brains of these children. They literally don’t have the same brains as children from more privileged backgrounds, yet teachers are supposed to get them to learn then same material at the same rate? Science is proving that this is impossible. But politicians aren’t very good at science, are they?
While i believe that the culture of poverty has an impact on school achievement, how do we explain the “exceptions” that rise out out of poverty to great success, like Tyler Perry, and Dr. Benjamin Carson, for example?
What lessons can be learned? What mindsets can be promoted? I often share the stories of these successes with my students, hoping that something will spark inside of them.
For the most part, society sells something different to these children, giving them unrealistic notions, like becoming a professional athlete, when at the age of 13, they have never even played a regulation game- of anything.
It is not my intention to criticize, but to work toward answers.
This is funny and sad at the same time. I am a fan of flipping the classroom and it is a great “tool” but not the answer. Unfortunately, they did not give you all of the concept in this article. It is a true that there are some horrible teachers out there and they need to go do something else, but given the varying needs of students, you need a caring, competent, “all-in” teacher in the classroom. So, I am not against getting rid of sub-par teacher. The other half of the issue are the students. I just want all of these people who have all of the answers to spend one week in a classroom and see what we deal with on a regular. We cannot turn water into wine yet we are expected to do so. Students come to school to socialize or because they have to versus wanting to, which is half of our battle. Disrespect and social issues plague classrooms from students who have to be in school. If you try to discipline them, your hands are tied. Then the parents side with their child about what you are not doing. Here lies the problem.
This link updates the 60/30/10 plan Ravitch writes about. It was posted after Policy Watch posted the plan. My sharing this doesn’t mean I support the plan. I was curious about McCammon, researched him, and found this. http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2014/01/22/update-nc-teacher-compensation-plan/
Dude’s an idiot. Might as well let ’em all stay home and watch tv. So much for the point if learning or being taught. If this goes through NC is on the fast-track to #50 in US education.
“I fear the day technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots.”
― Albert Einstein
Quote from Goodreads.com….
Forgot to footnote
The idea of flipping your classroom is to allow you more time to HELP your students. It isn’t going to be successful if you up the class size. The intent was to relieve already packed classrooms so teachers could get to each child and assist….what a nightmare in a state that used to be the standard and now is coming apart at the seams.
Even with excellent students, who have access to the technology to participate in this type of class it isn’t the perfect situation.
When are we going to realize that the best situation for kids is a classroom with a knowledgable caring teacher in the room with administrators and parents who support hard work and discipline? The poorest, least prepared child can thrive in this setting and children who are cared for at home and more affluent will flourish. Caring is a basic human need and frankly a video tape can’t cut the mustard.
My condolences North Carolina.
You don’t need the flipped classroom if you were teaching a centers-style classroom. Centers support the learning while the teacher works with a small group. Let’s reinvent the wheel again and see how it works this time…
This is completely unacceptable. What about ESL students, students with disabilities, and students living in impoverished conditions with little-no previous computer experience. This is not differentiation and it can not be equality!
I feel bad for the students more in this decision than any one else.
My daughter is a 3rd grade teacher in NC schools. She has a Master’s Degree. She has been there for 10 years and that is only a part of her experience.
She could come to Ohio to teach and make almost double what she makes there, however, she loves teaching and wants to make things better. She is not paid a lot to do her job. Her children love her and she loves them.
She is not married and puts a lot of her energy and her money (and mine) into making her classroom a better place to learn.
I also have many friends and family members who are teachers. It is very hard to find and keep real teachers (those who have the children’s learning interests at heart and will do whatever it takes to help them learn), there are way too many of the other kind (the ones who do the job requirements and only that — sometimes not even that).
I am in favor of teachers being paid more everywhere. They are severely disadvantaged in the economy and society today. Either that, or businesses or organizations need to come to the aid of needy school districts. They could adopt a school/class and just help them. Volunteer their time for tutoring students who cannot afford tutors outside school, buy the classroom supplies, bring lunch once a month, provide rewards for incentive based activities, provide teacher aides that are not on the school district payroll (room Moms?). There are so many ways the schools can be assisted besides throwing cash at them.
The issue here is the revamping of teachers classifications. Do they really need revamped or do they need a better way to approach a situation that needs to be addressed in every community in the nation? Teacher qualification and commitment?
The Junior League of Greensboro is doing just what you described at a local elementary school.
A fellow educator suggested to me at a District-wide training this past Thursday that all of this madness (RTA, pay freezes, Teacher Evaluation item #6, lack of Charter School expectations) is coming from Mr. McCrory and his friends’ hope to dismantle public education in order to go to a voucher system. I had never considered that angle, but as all of these things continue to show up, I am forced to consider the idea. If only the public knew the real difference between public school and charter schools.Our complacency over the years has lead us to the brink. What will be the outcome? I don’t know the answer but what I do know is that only children will suffer ~ our future.
Most ideas, even one’s that seem dumb on the surface, have a grain of truth within them. We Baby Boomers sat in class rooms with 50+ yet created the greatest economic boom of all time. Good parents? Or, did we have less government interference in the economy that allowed us all to get jobs when we got out of HS. Were our teachers better? Were we just better kids?
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One thing we need to take into consideration is NOW we have many alternatives to delivering education via electronic media. The 1800’s class room model, where we bus all the kids to a physical class room is no longer the ONLY way to get many children exposed to one teacher.
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Does that mean we get rid of schools completely? Of course not. Does it mean we can provide CHOICE for those children who fail to thrive in the Big-Box-School model? We surely should.
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My daughter trained to teach, but isn’t. Her dream was to open a small school for teen-age parents, the mom’s and dads, and provide them with the environment that would meet their singular needs. IF there was a Tuition Allowance where every child’s public education funding portion could be taken to ANY school, public and private, then she would have been able to start such a school.
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Because parents do NOT have the ability to shift their child’s funding to an alternative environment TEACHERS are locked into a government system that is not always fair to them.
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TEACHERS are not the problem, the funding mechanisms’ are the problem as they restrict the opportunities available for both teachers and children.
BOTH the teachers and children are enslaved together within the big-box-school model and we need to free those slaves to a government administered process.
Do they not have charter schools where you are? Schools like what you describe are flourishing in many states, to the detriment of public schools. As these charters open and close rapidly, public schools that used to be the bedrock of a community close. Call me a dinosaur if you must, but I don’t like the here today, gone tomorrow climate of charter schools.
That is truly absurd. I do believe in the flipped classroom; but this is a ridiculous distortion of a great thing. Making class sizes bigger defeats the purpose. The goal of a flipped classroom is that the teacher has more time to interact effectively with individual student or small groups of students, as opposed to lecturing them (boring) them with group instruction. This is just stupid. A huge class of kids left unmanaged will not be productive – they will play computer games or watch videos all day. Duh.
I can not believe the thoughts coming out of the minds of these politicians!! Teachers, you certainly need advocates & lobbyists to monitor and work on your behalf while YOU are working to shape the future for the coming generations in the classroom. Join your Professional Organization (NCAE is one of them) for the sake of your chosen profession/career, your livelihood,; for YOUR family!
I can not believe the thoughts coming out of the minds of these politicians!! Teachers, you certainly need advocates & lobbyists to monitor and work on your behalf while YOU are working to shape the future for the coming generations in the classroom. Join your Professional Organization (NEA is one of them) for the sake of your chosen profession/career, your livelihood,; for YOUR family!
As one of the pioneers of the flipped class movement and the author of two books on the topic of the flipped classroom, I want to say that I don’t agree that the flipped classroom in any way would or should create larger class sizes. In fact the hallmark of the flipped class is to get more one on one time with students in the class. Thus, a larger class size is detrimental to flipped classes.
I believe that teachers are of paramount importance in all classes and especially in a flipped class. I recently wrote a blog post entitled: “Why Teachers Matter More in a Flipped Class.” You can read it at: http://jonbergmann.com/whyteachersmattermoreinflippedclassroom/
Very glad to see this post. I flip classrooms at the college level. It is a good reason to keep classrooms small. That is where the true learning from flipped classrooms takes place because it allows teachers to focus on active based learning in the classroom. Of course, classrooms must be manageable to effectively use active based learning approaches, particularly in primary and secondary education classrooms. If classrooms increase in size and students are learning online, I don’t know what the teachers would be able to contribute. In such a case, our educational achievement would just plummet at the very time when we are trying to raise it.
Well said, Jon!
This is one of the most absurd things I’ve ever heard. Teachers in NC, if something like this ever passes, get the heck out and go to another state. At the very least, get yourself some representation! Your pay is embarrassing and it’s no wonder with thinking like this, teachers are flocking to another career opportunity. You’re making minimum wage as it is.
Wake up NC legislators – take a look at your turn over. You want well-educated youth? You’d better wake up. Try teaching for a week and then we’ll have a conversation.
“The man behind this plan is self-employed and self-described “educational pioneer” This means he is lost and trying to find where he is… Dr. Lodge McCammon. A former Wake County teacher, This means he is part of the problem, not the cure. When you are that close to the center of government, you are influenced by others to keep your job….. and Friday Institute specialist in curriculum and contemporary media, …WOW, I am impressed…I am an Engineering Technology Specialist , GSEC(SW) from the Navy Department … McCammon heavily promotes the use of video recording to transform teaching and learning…..We have been doing that for years, so what is new? You still need the One-On-One of a skilled teacher, and with larger classes, you loose the ball every time. For an alleged educated man he sounds s……….
Did you see the complete plan? I apologize if this was already posted. But seeing it in its entirety it is not making me feel any better. Also it does not look very “draft” to me. I love that Dr. Lodge McCammon is the only provider of any teacher training. Not too self-serving huh?
No surprise that McCrory’s team would do something absurd. That has been true since January 2012.
I am currently a graduate student pursuing my Master’s in Public Administration (MPA) in the Department of Public and International Affairs at the University of North Carolina at Wilmington. I am contacting you to seek your participation and assistance in distributing a statewide survey that will serve to evaluate how teacher evaluation and merit pay reforms are impacting teachers across the state of North Carolina. UNCW Professor, Janna Siegel Robertson, Ph. D., is noted as the principal investigator (PI) who has worked with me over the past couple of months on this project and is continuing to guide me in my research.
Our goal is to collect enough data to fairly represent the opinions of NC teachers that will later be combined with other statewide data and relevant literature to make appropriate recommendations to the state legislature. So please feel free to forward this message to any NC schools or teacher organizations that you feel would be interested in participating!
To participate in the survey go here:
http://20.selectsurvey.net/uncwmpammo/TakeSurvey.aspx?SurveyID=96KH4l7
As stated in the informed consent section of the survey, the data collected in this survey will serve as a component of the Master of Public Administration (MPA) Capstone project. Of course all 28 questions in the survey are voluntary and information that is collected is completely anonymous. Permission for this statewide study was approved by UNCW’s federally mandated Institutional Review Board (IRB) on March 31st, 2014.
If you have any questions you can contact me at mmo2074@uncw.edu or Dr. Janna Siegel Robertson at Robertsonj@uncw.edu.
Thank you for your assistance in this endeavor!
Regards,
Megan Oakes
Human Resources Intern | New Hanover County
MPA Graduate Student Association | Social Chair 2013-2014
Masters of Public Administration 2014
University of North Carolina Wilmington
my husband has been trying to convince me to move…anywhere but wisconsin…he hates snow. knowing i REFUSE to go to florida, he says, “what about the carolinas?” i already said no, but this story makes me want to go back and ask him if he’s high!