A reader with the anonymous sobriquet “Kindergarten Interlude” writes:
For my kindergartners distance-learning was never fun. And Lord knows for me it is not just a challenge but truly sad. How do you connect with five and six-year-olds through a computer screen? And the parents are losing it. I give them a lot of credit!
Of course I am trying to make the best of this for my students, but gone is the essence of teaching and learning in kindergarten: The human touch, the facial expressions, the spontaneous moments, the joy – reading and singing and dancing and yoga and Simon Says and Thumbs Up at the end of the day. And Discovery Centers (my code word for play centers)- teamwork and problem-solving and using one’s imagination and learning basic social skills like taking turns and sharing. There is great satisfaction (and joy!) in learning and practicing these skills and working together as a team. It is how friendships are planted and take root over the weeks and months of working and playing and learning together. Deep feelings of security and acceptance come from belonging to a community. A REAL community, not a screen.
So no, this was never fun and it is an untenable way to teach kindergarten and I imagine pretty much every grade.
Because at the end of the day, it is all about that beautiful community that is established. That’s the essence of successful teaching and learning in kindergarten.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
Distance learning is no substitute for real human interaction in any grade. Building community is the essence of good teaching. Some distance learning is more inappropriate than others like trying to teach kindergarten students through their senses online. It fails most students in purports to serve including the young, poor. and ELLs . Online learning fails in both the delivery and content. It works best to help master rote, discrete elements. If you want to learn how to hang a door, watch a Youtube video. Then, you can do it. It cannot teach the humanities, social sciences and the arts well. Human teachers are far superior in teaching “big idea” subjects. Another reason why cyber learning is inadequate is that it eliminates humanity from human learning. There is not engagement or sense of community with online products. It is not an equivalent experience as being in a real community of learners.
Many college students are considering taking a semester off if classes if instruction is online. A recent poll of NYU students showed that over 70% said they would likely sit out a semester if all instruction is online. Other college surveys showed similar results. Students are paying tuition, and some of them are suing their universities for a rebate for lost instruction this spring since online delivery is inadequate. It is not equivalent instruction, and college students know it!
It should also be mentioned that there is a spike in the number hotline calls made by children to report child abuse. Many children live in unstable homes, and some children are stuck in small quarters with abusive parents. Likewise, there are more reports of spousal abuse as well. Public schools are obliged to report any suspected cases of child abuse to CPS. In a pandemic there is no way monitor vulnerable children.
Here’s a review essay on keeping young minds engaged during this pandemic: https://wp.me/p50jv5-56F
What a wonderful resource. Thanks for sharing.
Thank you bethree5.
There are three choices:
In-person school (far too dangerous – teachers (and maybe even students) will die!)
On-line school (it’s horrible, children are miserable, it’s no substitute for in-person school (see #1))
No school
So what’s the verdict?
Maybe there’s a way we can turn in-person school into a prison experiment of masks, temperature screens, heavily restricted movement, and no physical contact at any time, do that two days a week, and then combine it with on-line school? That way we can still have teachers catching and dying from the virus, but kids are even more miserable. I’m just spit-balling here.
See there? I shouldn’t limit myself. There are always other options.
The verdict: FREE THE CHILDREN.
I’m with “none.”
Thank you both for taking a clear position. I don’t entirely disagree – certainly better than online schooling or prison-style “safe” schools, But I think full-on Sudbury is going to be a hard sell to the nation as a whole. And I’d still be very concerned for children’s mental health if they’re going to be confined to home without age-peer social contact.
I have not jokingly described “remote learning” as a purported educational environment in which there is a remote possibility that learning is taking place. This is, of course, something of an overstatement. Obviously, it is possible for some people to learn some things remotely. I recently learned how to make phyllo dough from scratch from a Youtube video by a Greek grandmother, for example. The W3 Consortium offers a step-by-step, complete course, online, in the latest version of HTML and has done so for years. A motivated person, young adult or older, can pretty easily learn the language thoroughly from this course.
But obviously, remote or distance learning is entirely inappropriate for many subjects and for children generally–for kids in elementary school or preschool. And all people, of all ages, benefit much, much more from learning environments with real teachers and other real students in face-to-face interactions. Some tasks are difficult to learn remotely. I’m a baker and a woodworker and an amateur chef who makes a lot of Italian and Latin dishes, and in both cases, much of what I do there is done by feel. I’ve been baking long enough that I know what a sponge for a sourdough boule is supposed to look and feel like, and throughout the process I have a sense, by look and feel, of what the end product is supposed to look and feel like, after the first kneading, the autolyzing, the continued kneading prior to proofing, the end of the first proof, the shaping, the end of the second proof, etc. I can write out a recipe and instructions, but it’s a whole lot easier to get this stuff right if you can stand beside me and I can show you, when you can get your hands into it and feel when it’s right.
Computers are tools. They are good for some things, like providing ready access to a vast library of obscure texts, for example, but they are terrible at others. The claims by widely used programs to grade essays by computer or to diagnose reading and mathematics ability are basically scams. If you believe those, I have some land on Mars to sell to you. The schemes used by educational software programs to motivate students–multimedia, gaining points, getting to play games if you complete certain tasks, racking up points, etc.–turn out not to be motivating. Kids typically HATE these programs after a week or so. And virtual classes and virtual schools have TERRIBLE completion rates because people find these long-term interactions with machines boring. The extrinsic motivation systems used by computerized instructional systems turn out to be highly demotivating for cognitive tasks. For cognitive tasks, people respond to intrinsic motivators of the kind that emerge when people interact.
Think of it this way. A pencil is a great tool. But don’t try to use it for eye surgery. A computer is a great tool. But don’t try to use it as a primary vehicle for delivering instruction. Computer instruction systems have a terrible track record.
The kind of thing that is going on now–students and teachers interacting virtually–is somewhat better than using so-called “educational” software programs, but only slightly so. And it’s fraught with a great many problems that I won’t detail here but that we all know about now.
We need kids back in school. Obviously.
But we can’t do that at all safely until we can FREQUENTLY test, THOROUGHLY track, and when necessary, isolate. And we need to be able to do this not for the 2 percent of the population that has been tested once, but for EVERYONE. And we need to be able to do it OFTEN.
An article I read in Forbes, today, says that of the two kinds of tests being used for SARS-CoV-2–the serologic one and the genomic one–experience in Egypt, which tested everyone–65 million people with similar tests for different diseases, suggests that these could, if mass produced, and if sufficient laboratory resources existed (including enough trained technicians), be done for five cents and fifty cents per test, respectively (unit cost).
If we are to open up safely, we need a MASSIVE program, directed by the federal government, to create enough labs and train enough people and produce enough of these tests and train enough tracking personnel and so on to test everyone in a school frequently and then isolate anyone who gets sick.
But we have no leadership. We have the Moronavirus trumpinski orangii and Pence the Dense. And so we’re going to open up schools in the fall, and a lot of kids, teachers, administrators, staff, and parents are going to die. And this is inevitable.
“…to test everyone in a school frequently….”
I’m curious, have you had a COVID test yet? I have. It basically involves having a chopstick with a cotton ball at the end shoved up your nose and halfway into your brain. I had to park afterwards and pull myself together for about ten minutes before I could drive home and even then I missed my turn-off from the expressway because I was so rattled. I’m not sure I’m willing to repeat the experience ever, let alone frequently, nor would I allow it to be inflicted on my child “frequently”.
Yes. It’s awful. My head hurt. My teeth hurt. I was standing and actually had to sit down because I nearly blacked out from the pain. Of course I had a sinus infection at the time, but still…there is a very sensitive nerve in the nasal cavity that is disturbed for the duration of the test.
Hopefully, there will be other types of testing available at some point. What they would entail, who knows?
There are several types of tests now available. You had one of the early molecular tests. https://www.goodrx.com/blog/coronavirus-covid-19-testing-updates-methods-cost-availability/
From this article:
The FDA authorized the first at-home collection molecular test, called Pixel by LabCorp, on April 20, which is available online here. The test kits contain supplies to collect samples, including a nasal swab which you send back to the lab for testing. Unlike other swab-based tests, Pixel uses swabs that only need to go as far as the nostril, instead of deeper into the nasal passage. Since then, the FDA has also authorized an at-home collection test from Everlywell that also uses nasal swabs. According to their website, the kit will be available for purchase by the end of the month. A study led by the UnitedHealth Group suggests that results from self-collected swab tests are similar in accuracy to provider-collected swab tests.
Several companies, including Hims and Vault Health are now offering at-home collection tests online using a saliva test developed by Rutgers’ RUCDR Infinite Biologics. Test kits include a collection device to collect your saliva (instead of deep nose or throat swabs) and the sample is then mailed to the lab for processing.
I had the test two weeks ago. Hardly “early”. My roommate – who was exposed to COVID because his essential job involves caring for mentally ill people in their home – had the same test a week ago, as did a friend who got tested in advance of a medical procedure. It seems to be the standard test in my area anyway.
Again, Dienne, this is not the only kind of test now available. Please read the article. You had the type of test that was the earliest one developed for this.
Well, it appears that at least for right now, the deep nasal swab is the standard test and I personally cannot support frequent mass testing using that method. If these other methods become widely available, then perhaps I could get behind such mass testing.
A common thought experiment given to students in Philosophy 101 is this: suppose that aliens offered you this proposition: everyone, worldwide, would be free of pain and suffering but one person would have to experience horrific torture at all times. Should you take them up on their offer? The question is posed to get at issues related to utilitarian (greatest good for the greatest number) ethics. Well, here we are with a similar, real-life issue. The Trump maladministration seems to have decided that if we just open everything up, a certain number of people (mostly brown, mostly poor , mostly elderly) will die. But it’s worth the tradeoff because the economy will be buzzing again and Trump might have a chance at being reelected. So, how many deaths will that be? 300,000 more from now until we have a vaccine? Is this an acceptable calculus? Or should we use the resources of the federal government to force the creation of universal testing, tracking, and isolation? This is the real question that we face.
cx: or isolation, when necessary. Ofc.
Women experience pain and discomfort all the time in childbirth but nobody suggests they shouldn’t have children. Cancer patients experience pain and discomfort but doctors don’t suggest not having treatment because of it. Could experiencing some discomfort for a short time be worth getting a test for Covid? I don’t know. I’m just asking.
True, we should also get rid of bone marrow aspirations, stent procedures, and colonoscopies and any other diagnostic procedure that’s inconvenient and potentially painful. See, I can be as uselessly sarcastic as our pity party duo. Pathetic.
The word “kindergarten”is not necessary in the title of this important post.
Agreed
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-denmark-reopening/opening-schools-in-denmark-did-not-worsen-outbreak-data-shows-idUSKBN2341N7
What’s your verdict?
Let’s re-open schools just as they were before?
It is odd to make a comparison to Denmark, a country where Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen established an extensive lockdown on March 11, before any deaths from the virus, which had huge public support.
Unfortunately, the US elected a president who opposed lockdowns and even mask wearing.
Denmark spent quite a bit of money to make schools safer. US spent quite a bit of money to make private schools richer.
It’s a shame that we don’t have real leadership like Denmark, but that simply proves that the people who didn’t realize that refusing to vote for the Democrat because “Trump is no worse” were wrong. Blame them.
It’s hard to open schools in any safe way when we live in a country with leadership like Trump. Too bad we don’t have good female leadership like New Zealand.
South Korea just closed schools after trying to reopen.
“Denmark spent quite a bit of money to make schools safer. US spent quite a bit of money to make private schools richer.”
That’s the difference between investment and disinvestment.
The notion that a disease that is transmitted by interaction among persons, especially in enclosed spaces (some of whom are asymptomatic but nonetheless disease vectors) would not be more widely transmitted by increased interaction among persons in enclosed spaces (e.g, in schools) can only be described as MAGICAL THINKING.
It’s different if you have tested WIDELY and contained the disease. We haven’t.
“What’s your verdict?”
Well, I asked you first, but anyway, my verdict is what I have said all along: education is essential so I would open schools as normal, just with more deep cleaning and disinfecting. (Testing too, but not if that involves jabbing people up the nose on a regular basis.) I am opposed to any kind of regimentation that turns schools into prisons. Children fundamentally need to socialize, interact and play with each other in order to maintain their well-being. Forced social distancing, especially for the pre-school and early elementary set, is tantamount to torture.
Children themselves are at statistically zero risk of contracting the disease or suffering serious effects thereof. Out of 73 million American children, fewer than 30,000 have tested positive, a few hundred have been hospitalized and fewer than 30 have died (the vast majority of the latter two categories have had underlying conditions).
Yes, there is greater risk to teachers and certainly some precautions are in order. But the majority of teachers are young and very few are in the 65+ highest risk bracket. As I said, I think actual in-person education is essential, just like healthcare and food delivery. Children’s well-being is worth the risk. If nursing home workers and grocery store stockers can be expected to work for the pittance they get, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect teachers to work. In fact, by August/September when schools go back, I expect that most workers will long have been back to work facing the virus (my office is starting to gradually re-open in staggered shifs next week, FWIW).
I’m aware that my position is unpopular on this blog and I’ll brace myself for your 15 paragraph rant in return (which, TBH, I probably won’t read). Nonetheless, I stand behind it.
So, your turn. What’s your verdict? Shall we continue with online “learning” even though children are “miserable”? Should we go with FLERP!’s hybrid, worst of all worlds model above? Should we just cancel school for the foreseeable future?
A false dichotomy. The alternative is to develop sufficient testing and tracking to test everyone regularly, track the contacts of anyone positive, and isolate those people. Then we can open schools reasonably safely. Not until then. This is what I have argued throughout this thead.
I, for one, don’t want to be reading the stories in August with headlines like, Entire B-Day AP English Class Dies of Covid-19. Students Mourn Eight Beloved Teachers at Horace Mann. Principal Breaks up Fight in Hallway, Now in ICU Fighting Covid. But hey, I think these lives matter enough to take a different approach to all this.
So your verdict is NOT to be anything like Denmark, which made far more changes than “more deep cleaning and disinfecting”? Of course, Denmark was making those changes and locking down when the great president Trump was doing nothing except lying about how tests were readily available to all and causing 100,000+ deaths and counting.
So if you don’t like that schools aren’t opening, why aren’t you raging against Trump whose response was exactly the opposite of Denmark’s, including massive lying while his pals enriched themselves at a pandemic. Instead you seem to be rather angry at the public school teachers and administrators who aren’t doing Trump’s bidding and demanding immediate reopening?
My solution is to get Trump and every Republican out of office so that the democratic party can handle this pandemic better and we don’t have to make a choice between reopening public schools cheaply – with only “deep cleaning and disinfecting” – and people’s lives.
There are plenty of other options if Trump is removed from office and the Republicans are disempowered. Imagine, schools might even be able to reopen – WiTH PRECAUTIONS – as in Denmark instead of opening the way you and Trump believe is more than enough for public school students.
If your children are not in public schools but are in private schools, well, that speaks for itself.
^^This was a reply to dienne77.
I am not sure why dienne77 and FLERP! are offering this false dichotomy — I have seen Trump supporters offering that in terms of sheltering in place and the Trump supporters who offer that are clearly misinformed.
There is something truly dishonest about those who are mimicking the right wing propaganda that there are only 2 choices: opening up this country exactly as it was before (with more “deep cleaning”) or locking everyone up until a vaccine is discovered.
Those are the two choices that the Republicans are offering. That doesn’t mean that they are the ONLY choices and I wonder at the political beliefs of those who keep insisting that the choices offered by Trump and his Republican acolytes are the only choices.
Give me a list of precautions that you think would be adequate. I’ll warn you, though, for any precaution you can list, I bet I can find commenters on this very blog saying why those precautions won’t work. Social distancing? How are you going to keep 5 year olds 6 feet away from each other? And what about hallways and entering/exiting rooms? Masks? How do you make a kindergartner keep his mask on all day, especially without touching it and getting it all dirty and goopy and making it worse than no mask at all? What about bathrooms? What about lunch?
Plenty of people on this blog have made it perfectly clear that schools should not re-open no matter what precautions are implemented because such precautions will invariably fall short and teachers will still potentially be exposed. If no precautions are adequate, and no amount of risk is acceptable, what solutions are there besides indefinite remote schooling or no school at all?
But Dienne, aren’t these important questions to ask in order to reopen schools safely? I’ve posed a lot of questions on this blog which I believe need to be answered based on what scientists and doctors tell us we need to be doing to decrease the spread of the virus. I haven’t heard any good answers. I mean, we’re not even allowing fans to sit in outside stadiums to watch sports. I think we have to think about HOW we are going to reduce the spread of the virus in an enclosed and, frankly, germ-ridden environment like a school. I don’t know if we can do it. I’m asking questions.
“I haven’t heard any good answers.”
Exactly. Because there aren’t any. Unless people are willing to go to extreme lengths (probably cages), you’re simply not going to get students to maintain social distancing. So what does that mean? Does it mean that we don’t re-open schools until there is a vaccine? Or is there some level of risk that people are willing to take, even knowing that social distancing isn’t going to work
I fall on the side that says, with extra cleaning and disinfecting, we take the risk to re-open schools, even knowing that social distancing and masks will fail, because children’s mental health is too important to continue to confine them to their homes. But the consensus on this blog seems to be that schools can’t re-open so long as there is any risk. There might be reasonable arguments for that position, but then it’s on you to come up with the alternative. When FLERP! points out that that will require substantial investments in tech and other remote learning methods, people point out how horrible online schooling is. Yes, it is horrible, but if we can’t re-open schools, what’s your alternative?
Dienne,
Not very often that we are on opposing sides in a debate. I can’t agree with you on re-opening before proper safeguards are in place. Those safeguards include testing for all, frequently, that is paid for by our government, contact tracing (and oh boy does that open up a 3lb coffee can of worms) including strict quarantining as appropriate and multiple facemasks per day for all, again all paid for by the government. No ‘reopening’ of anything ‘non-essntial’ (and again, a very debatable proposition) until then.
My verdict: FREE THE CHILDREN!
I would hate to see anything happen to your intelligent, beautiful children.
Duane – I have great respect for you, and I respect that position, but what isn’t being answered is, so what then? I believe you are basically on record as saying no school, let the kids play. I don’t want to misrepresent you so correct me if I’m wrong.
As noted in the exchange above, there are basically four possibilities:
Open schools pretty much as normal, albeit with more cleaning/disinfecting
Open schools on some kind of hybrid/staggered schedule basis with strict social distancing, wearing of masks, etc., perhaps supplemented/alternated with remote schooling
Fully remote schooling until it is safe to re-open
Close schools and give up on remote schooling
The problem is that people on this blog don’t seem to want to commit to any of the above. It’s too dangerous to open schools. No amount of precautions will make it safe enough. Online learning is “horrible” and students are “miserable”. I’m just trying to get at what people think an appropriate solution is, since the virus is going to be with us for the foreseeable future. If it’s too dangerous to meet in person for school, what do we do for children’s education and mental health needs?
dienne77,
You linked to an article about Denmark but you don’t seem to have read what Denmark is doing and the extra precautions they have taken.
And those precautions were taken AFTER a country was led by a leader who ordered shelter in place before there was even a single death, and thus was faced with a situation that was very different than the ugly situation we have in the US.
As I said, getting Trump out of office is plan A if you want to reopen schools. If you keep empowering a government led by people who only care about money and lives of anyone who isn’t a Trump supporter are expendable, then why would you ask the people whose fault it is not to pay the price?
Instead of demanding that teachers put their lives on the line because Trump has caused this horrendous situation, why not put the blame where it belongs and instead of condemning teachers for not being willing to put their lives on the line because of Trump, you condemn Trump and his Republican enablers for creating this mess and being unwilling to spend the money to properly open schools?
Are you angry at teachers who won’t agree to teach under the conditions Trump demands, instead of being angry at Trump? Why?
Why are you looking for scapegoats to blame because Trump caused this horrendous situation? It isn’t teachers’ fault that Trump lied about testing, about masks, about health care, about everything.
The Danes also agree that it is not realistic that young children are practicing social distancing and no one is wearing face masks in Danish schools. Would the teachers here be willing to teach under the same conditions? For a discussion of practices in Denmark, see https://www.bbc.com/news/education-52550470
I think dienne77’s list of possible choices is about right. Denmark has reopened under something between the first and second options.
NYCPSP – you keep talking about the precautions Denmark has taken, but there is nothing about that in the article I linked to and you have posted nothing else. Cite your sources and we’ll talk.
Dienne, your numbers are way off. Out of 73million what– children in the whole country? They’ve all been tested & only 30k are infected?
As of 5/14, about 11million Americans– total– had been tested. How many of them were children? As of a 5/1 Intercept article, something over 24,000 kids under 20 total had been tested at all [incomplete, excludes upstate-NY & Nebraska]. Same article reports due to “very limited testing in children,” the Covid Kid epidemiological project “used clinical data from China to gauge infection rates in the US and estimate that the total number of children infected in the US is now [5-1] at least 478,000.”
Dienne,
I think you know me well enough, eh, that when I say Free the Children, it’s what I mean. While the following is anecdotal evidence, it is very personal but speaks to my thinking that schooling isn’t the end all be all of childhood and that having all the students miss a half a year is not as big of a deal as many make it out to be.
Does it take a bit of work on the parents part? No doubt to a degree. But what we as a society have done to childhood by taking the locus of control from the children (everything is adult mandated and controlled it seems) has left them vulnerable to not being able to do things that I used to do on my own with my peers, spontaneously sometimes and planned out others.
That said, my main basis for saying that missing a semester or more of schooling for the vast majority will not be a problem. Hell everyone will be in the same boat in contrast to the following anecdotes that I experienced when my youngest had to miss over a semester’s worth of work in sixth grae due to two major-6hr & 8hr cut to stitch surgeries, one in October and the other in March. While we had a home school teacher I can say that it certainly wasn’t the same as being in class. But he was able to move on. And certainly learned a lot about non-curricular/academic life.
The other was a freshman girl student that I had that same year and who was in the same hospital for cancer treatments at the same time as my son. Now she’s quite a bit more conscientious student than my son, and did all the work in Spanish, and every other class, and came back in fine shape. . . and is now the proud mother of a boy and girl.
As much as I believe in schools and the teaching and learning process, I don’t believe that it is the end all be all and that by giving our children free time to learn to handle themselves may actually be a silver lining in a very dark cloud that hovers over all at the present.
Our district have considered the idea of dividing the classes in half to allow for distancing-then teaching in person 2 days per week and 3 days on line. All children in the school have ipads and there are wifi hot spots all around the city for those without internet. The on line teaching has been going well with a few exceptions because parents are confused and that is understandable (it confuses me). We have a large ESL population. I suspect some children will stay with home schooling by parents or the state K-12 on line program that parents seem to like.
My little one turns 5 today, and the sobering truth about her first public school experience is that she will most likely be starting Kindergarten behind a screen.
When my daughter was born, I remember Diane and I exchanging email messages where she said she hoped the world my child grew up in was a world that was different from then—a world where young children were not subjected to drill and kill testing programming and the overdrive of digital learning.
It appears she will be starting her school career with a computer, devoid of the environment she and other Kindergarten students absolutely need.
When this pandemic is over, let’s hope that school officials never forget what is most important to learning—the people, the nurturing and the relationships between teachers and fellow students.
Thank you, LG.
We must redouble our efforts to bring that better world into existence. Not a perfect world. A better world.
Amen, Diane
“. . . is that she will most likely be starting Kindergarten behind a screen.”
Man, is that sickening or what. I wouldn’t subject my kids to it, that’s for sure.
Again, I say that TEACHING and learning will be different with in person classes back in session. With everyone in masks and staying 6 feet away (Although I’m not sure how to do this with young children. It’s probably impossible.), there won’t be human touch and recognizing facial expressions, sharing supplies, getting in groups, working as a team, etc. Have elementary teachers even thought of HOW they would teach and what they might have to NOT teach with some of the recommended safety measures in place? I teach middle and high school and I’m already thinking about it. I’ve often thought that in this whole situation, we are going to have to revise not only HOW we are teaching but WHAT we are teaching. We may not be able to do the things we’ve always done in this new situation. And , of course, we’ll be expected to do it at the drop of a hat. Another thing that hasn’t been mentioned too much is how students will deal with the fear they may be having about going to school. This goes for adults, too. It’s hard to learn when you’re in a fearful or stressful situation.
I also wonder if everyone- students and staff will be tested before returning to school. I doubt it, but I think if we were, we might be astounded at how many test positive.
The echo chamber are still marketing ed tech:
https://www.the74million.org/article/listen-class-disrupted-podcast-why-is-my-child-doing-so-many-worksheets-right-now/
“Larry Berger, CEO of curriculum and assessment company Amplify, joins Diane and Michael…”
Now there’s a diverse group! The CEO of charter company that relies on ed tech, an ed tech promoter who wrote a book, and a salesperson who sells ed tech. Perhaps unsurprisingly, the “discussion” is one long advertisement for ed tech.
“Rigor!” 🙂
Not rigor. Profit.
I feel as if the “debate” about reopening schools completely ignores 90% of the country, who are definitely planning to reopen schools.
NYC is a fine place, but it isn’t really representative of the whole country. My Ohio district is operating under a plan that includes “open” as the default. I don’t think they’re alone in that.
I’ll make a bold prediction right now. The most damage done to public school students will not be a result of the virus or even the result of the shutdown- the most damage done to public school students will be the budget cuts to public schools, along with the financial stress that comes when their family members are unemployed.
Of course, the powers that be in education have an ideological belief that funding doesn’t matter, so none of them will advocate to keep funding level, and the harms to public school students will be magnified and made worse.
Just like in 2009-10, when all of ed reform abandoned public schools after the financial crash and a whole generation of public school students suffered. They’re doing the exact same thing again.
Maybe there is a silver lining with the looming budget cuts? Ed tech and ed deform are very expensive and the testing to support the deforms is very expensive. Cutting the budget means that things will have to be run on a shoestring. Teachers are the BEST when it comes to doing more with less. Let the teachers get back to the basics so that all the kids will get a better education. I don’t know….maybe that’s thinking things can get better? Just a thought.
Shut it all down. 100% remote learning until we have a vaccine. It is definitely not ideal, but it will save lives. Why risk teachers, maybe even students, dying?
Other countries have devised plans for reopening safely. Are we so inept and incompetent that we can’t do the same?
Probably, given the patchwork nature of authority and administration in this country. Even if we weren’t inept and incompetent, there is no way those plans can ensure that no lives will be lost. The risk of death may be reduced, but why take the risk? Why force teachers to take the risk?
I just read FDR’s “A Day That Will in Infamy” address to a joint session of Congress and the nation. Try as I might, I just can’t track down the line, “I urge our citizens to curl up in a fetal position and wish this all away.”
https://www.ourdocuments.gov/doc.php?flash=false&doc=73&page=transcript
Also can’t find the Jonas Salk quote, “I give up, this is too hard.”
Not sure if that’s addressed to me, but if it is, I’m not saying we should give up. I’m saying we should keep schools closed and refocus on making remote instruction as good and accessible as possible. Keeping schools closed until there’s a vaccine will ensure that nobody dies because we opened schools prematurely. Improving remote learning will be hard work and require tech investments. It has big drawbacks (as does any approach), but at least those drawbacks don’t involve teachers dying. We can’t give up on remote instruction just because it’s not ideal or because it’s really difficult. It is the only safe option.
Was absolutely addressed to you, one who went from “panic all the time” to “resignation all the time.” How about some creativity and ingenuity? I remember seeing in another post today (sorry, can’t remember who wrote it) that all places are not New York City. How about rethinking how teachers can teach in this environment? For example, bring small groups of children to wilderness parks where they can take walks and have one teacher teach about botany, zoology, and geology, have another teach about the history of the area, another about literature, and so on. And they’ll get fresh air and exercise. Think, identify and solve problems, etc. This either/or mentality is not productive in any way.
Holding classes in wilderness parks might work in some places and is probably safe. Reopening school buildings for students in the fall is not safe. It is a guarantee that some number of teachers will die from the virus.
We underestimate the effect that underfunding and bad policy have on the decision re: opening or not opening. If we properly funded public education, we would have small class sizes and adequate spaces. I’m on the board of a progressive school that focuses on experiential and outdoor education. We will “open,” because we can have proper social distancing and abundant outdoor work, much as you suggest. Schools everywhere could do similar things – except they can’t. Because they are understaffed, under-resourced, crowded and unimaginative.
When schools are designed and run like prisons for small people, the options for protecting kids during a pandemic are very, very limited.
I will add, since I opened my comment box, that some of the intentions are fantastic – and I don’t mean that with the positive connotation. The idea that large numbers of kids will be compliant with social distancing and other protocols is nearly delusional. I move through my community and see crowds of kids skateboarding, giggling together, skipping down pathways holding hands and sharing snacks.
I’ve read of school designs with tables and chairs at proper distance, recess parceled out to minimize groups, etc. I then envision all those kids at dismissal, running together to the playground, the skate park or the convenience store, spreading joy and blooms of coronavirus.
I don’t have any answers, but the best laid plans of man will be amusingly inadequate.
Yes to this: “The idea that large numbers of kids will be compliant with social distancing and other protocols is nearly delusional.”
And teachers left to enforce social distancing rules in schools will find themselves in the role of prison guards.
GregB,
I’ve thought about having teachers in a local area meet with students in that specific neighborhood. I think the problem with a lot of this is that it will take time to plan. We will have to do things in a different way -teach in a different way and maybe learn new things as you are suggesting. The other problem is that teachers aren’t often asked for their input. It all comes from the top down. Perhaps just elementary school children could go back to school. Districts could then use all their buildings to spread out classes. I think online learning is easier for older students to navigate and they would be able to stay home alone easier than young students. Just ideas.
I agree with you Marie. I don’t have the answers, but we’ve never had the answers to any project or initiative for large goals we have set, regardless of issue. Nor am I advocating for putting people needlessly at risk. We could do theme-based days once a week that would support independent learning or small group learning. Rather than have buses take large groups to schools, can we hire bus drivers to use their own cars to pick up one or two students and bring them to a gathering place? And have some parents and teachers do the same? I don’t have the answers. But if we, as a people, can’t figure this out, then what is our purpose? If the president and political leadership will not lead, then we need to lead from below and the community and grassroots level. That’s why I posted this earlier, using a bell cast from the same mold as the Liberty Bell. It says it in a more succinct and catchy way.
I think it is likely that the teachers in other countries are willing to tolerate a higher level of risk than the teachers (and former teachers) commenting on the blog. No one has plans for reopening safely, their plans reduce the risk, but do not eliminate it. The only way to eliminate the risk of people being infected with COVID-19 in a school is to not allow any people in the school.
Reopening isn’t just a matter of following a set of procedures trialled by Denmark. In fact, given our size/ diversity of pop density & covid stats– & most importantly, the way we govern the public sphere– doing so seems impossible. Wave a wand to disappear Trump, McConnell, et all dittoheads/ sycophants, it still couldn’t happen. Denmark is small– total school enrollment 700k [compare LAUSD 734k]– & governed in a way that promotes national discussion/ consensus.
A Guardian 5/17 article describes the week leading up to reopening for elementary schools last month: “The VP of the Danish Teachers’ Union spent a lot of time on Skype… was responsible for detailed negotiations with the education minister, the health authorities, and other teaching unions. The aim was to make sure everyone was happy with measures put in place to ensure an orderly return of younger pupils…”
A 5/21 CNN video clip (“Denmark schools are reopening…”) shows community meetings, noting “with many Danish parents fearing for their children’s safety, the govt worked with parent and teacher groups to build support…” and the education minister says “without that dialog, I think the guidelines we would have made wouldn’t have hit the target and we would have had outbreaks…”
Hard to imagine any of that happening or being said here. As Mamie says, “teachers aren’t often asked for their input. It all comes from the top down.” And Steve Nelson, “We underestimate the effect that underfunding and bad policy have on the decision re: opening or not opening.”
sadly, yes
Teaching economist- I am a kindergarten teacher in Newark, NJ and I would go back today. In a heartbeat.
We have an inept and incompetent federal government with a president who has no concern whatsoever for anyone but himself. Why hasn’t he ordered that more PPE be manufactured for essential workers? Why don’t we have more testing? Why aren’t we planning for the end of summer when this thing may spike again and may be worse because we’ll have the flu to deal with? We have no federal government to help us. If we did, I might feel better about opening schools. But we don’t. We have NO plan whatsoever it seems to me. I don’t know what the answers are but I know we can’t rely on our federal government to help us.
Money for reopening schools is the big hurdle and that will be complicated for public schools by the continuing flow of money to charter schools and varieties of choice, especially with vouchers and kindred money follows the student programs.
The federal government, meaning ten-yacht Betsy DeVos and her staff, has a nudge-em plan for the near future in K-12 education.
DeVos’s “Rethink K-12 Education Models” is funded through the Education Stabilization Fund (ESF) authorized by the Coronavirus Aid, Relief, and Economic Security (CARES) Act.
The “Rethink K-12 Education Models (ESF-REM) Discretionary Grant Program” has at least $180 million available to eligible states. All programs support “remote learning” (a euphemism for online INSTRUCTION because learning is not guaranteed) or programs with “deliverables’ such as packets of materials for students who have no Internet access.
Priority one in this grant program are “Microgrants” for parents. The prototypes for the microgrants are Florida’s trademarked MYSCHOLARSHOP DEBIT CARD with a variant called CLASS WALLET available in Arizona, North Carolina, and Tennessee.
Both schemes offer parents a prepaid card for use with pre-approved on-line services. The Microgrant program from DeVos’s “Rethink K-12 Education Models Discretionary Grant Program” sends money to states, who then must then (direct quotes follow)
(a) Provide the parents and students with a list of (approved) service providers from which the parents and students may select.
(b) Include more than one education service for remote learning that parents and students may choose, which may include–
(1) Tuition and fees for a public or private course or program, especially online;
(2) Concurrent and dual enrollment at a postsecondary institution particularly for career and technical education experiences;
(3) Special education and related services including therapies (but these services do not alter a local educational agency’s obligation to provide services to a child the Individuals with Disabilities Act (IDEA) and Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973.
(4) Contracted educational services provided by a public or nonpublic school;
(5) Tutoring;
(6) Summer or afterschool education programs;
(7) Testing preparation and examination fees, including Advanced Placement examinations, industry certification exams, state licensure exams, and any examinations related to college or university admission;
(8) Academic, college, and career counseling services;
(9) Application fees, including for public and non-public school students;
(10) Textbooks, curriculum, or other instructional materials; and
(11) Other education-related services and materials that are reasonable and necessary, which may include: (i) Computer hardware, software, or other technological devices including adaptive devices; (ii) Internet access or hotspots; (iii) Textbooks, curriculum, or other instructional materials; and
(c) Provide an online and other method to enable parents and students to select services and ensure that the parent’s microgrant account. (end direct quote)
A second priority in this “Rethink K-12 Education Model” program will fund new statewide online “virtual” schools or an expansion of these. This is hardly a rethink challenge. As Ohio has proven, virtual schools offer wonderful opportunities to get money for students who are ghosts–not there. The for-profit K12 Inc may find a way to tap these funds or be a template for others. Online lessons mimic workbooks and exercises in textbooks. Some virtual schools have humans who appear on screen to offer help.
A third priority, and the last in “Rethink K-12 Education Model” grant program is for “field-initiated ideas for remote learning.” This is another way of saying that DeVos and her staff are out of ideas.
These grants are for projects with an expected average award of $15 million. About 13-14 awards are expected to made by July, 2020. Projects must include public and non-public (private) elementary and secondary schools. Eligible states are rated on several factors, including percentages of students in poverty and COVID-19 rates. Details at https://oese.ed.gov/files/2020/04/ESF-REM-Notice-Inviting-Applications.pdf
This is a great description of what K is– or should be– all about. It applies to preschool as well, the age I teach. The stark inappropriateness of online teaching for youngest kids is just the tip of the iceberg. Online teaching distills & delivers the essence of bad, age-inappropriate pedagogy invading PS/ PK/ K classrooms in the last decade. All stemming from NCLB (now ESSA) and CCSS (re-branded but still there)– it just took some yrs to trickle thoroughly down. It’s… bookwork! Delivered to an age that, biologically speaking, needs hands-on play to learn, & whose “bookwork” needs to be focused on listening comprehension, & just a bit of nudging the just-budding interest in letter [& number] symbolism, the beginnings of aptitude for abstract thinking that will bloom at age 8+. [Ludicrously, the CCSS for both math & ELA promote abstract as well as concrete reasoning].
Granted, some play-based et al preschools have pushed back [Montessori & its ilk most successfully], but don’t be fooled by lip-service. Just look for yourself:
Do you see sand- & water-tables, plentiful rhythm instruments, blocks, play-kitchen/ workshops, picture-book libraries w/room to stretch out, dress-up cabinets w/ mirrors, & lots of rug/ floor-space to use all that stuff? [These are all features which encourage not only play, but group play, hence socio-emotional learning].
Or do you see classrooms (yes, even for 2.5yo’s) dominated by tables& chairs, w/ a small rugspace flanked by a compressed set of play eqpt? [This means the bulk of classtime is occupied w/ teacher-directed paper and pencil academics, supplemented w/ pre-fab cut&paste “art” — all based on indiv, comparable stud-to-stud work at conformist production. [In the worst preschools, “play” is segregated to some other area– playground (2x/day if you’re lucky ) or rainy-day “multipurpose” rooms– emphasizing play/ work dichotomy].
For a couple of decades I’ve been a visiting “special,” which gives me a peek into how various area preschools do things. There has been tremendous change since the trickle-down of standards/ annual testing [I peg that at 2010]. It has been implemented by directors getting their Masters’ since 2005-ish, & the young lowpd teachers who must do as they’re told [they have neither the ed-level nor the fin flexibility of the boomer-era teachers just supplementing the major breadwinner], &– evident in any preschool qualified for state-subsidized tuition studs [the poor kids!]– state [/fed] govt. Look at any state’s “approved PreK stds” & you’ll find a handful of pre-approved, canned, branded “preschool curriculums” which incorporate the worst of age-inappropriate testable academic stds– basically, K CCSS [already absurdly age-inappropriate], barely watered down for PS/PK.
“Online K learning” to me is a dog-whistle for the sort of age-inappropriate importation of 3rdgr-&-up abstract academics down thro 2nd, 1st, to K that has been going on, truth be told, since even before NCLB & CCSS (at least in NJ) – since the ’90’s. Perhaps the real culprits date back to ’80’s “A Nation at Risk,” & the stds/ assessment movement that sprang from it [Gates-funded Achieve]. Aided & abetted by civil-rights activists who foolishly thought “accountability testing” would result in equitable ed-funding.
So much for opening schools again.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/29/asia/south-korea-coronavirus-shuts-down-again-intl/index.html
Thank you so much for posting this. Related to this, the German Bundesliga (1st division professional soccer) has restarted in front of empty stadiums and quarantined teams and referees. Lionel Messi, the best soccer player in the world–and history–who plays at Barcelona said if the Germans don’t get this right, nobody can. In that vein, if the South Koreans are responding in this way, we need to heed their experience, because if they can’t figure it out, nobody can. And in the U.S., as long as we have no national leadership, we never will. Vote, berate your friends and family who won’t vote or are considering voting for any Republican. If we don’t defeat and kick them out of the decision-making process now, we never will.
GregB,
Here’s another article from the BBC. It’s interesting that the article says that the virus was found on clothing. You know, when I was young and trying to make a decision about something, my mom would often tell me that perhaps I didn’t have enough information to make the decision. Perhaps we don’t have enough information about this virus to make a lot of the decisions we are making about reopening. We don’t even know how this disease will affect people who have recovered from it. What kinds of medical care might they need in the future? We don’t know. We certainly don’t have the information we should due to lack of testing.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-52845015
To say that I’m devastated for her is an understatement. She had a very part-time preschool experience and did summer camp last year. Ironically, what she really wanted was to stay home with mommy since there were times where she claims she was bored, which really meant she wanted to play with her toys. She learns a lot from us at home: Her fine motor skills have been off the charts since before her 1st birthday and her curiosity, like that of most preschoolers, has always been a boon to her learning new things about the world. However, peer relationships are what I fear she is missing and needing the most. As an only child (and with older parents), she craves being around other children. Now this experience has been robbed from her and all children.
Of course, while she is home, I will have to find a way to teach beginning band (the Kindergarten of instrumental music) remotely. It’s hard enough to virtually teach/learn when students have some sort of background in a skill…and now we have to start them in a hands-on class with the disadvantage of little to no in-person feedback. The only way to effectively virtually teach some of what is needed to get started is to do it one-on-one—there is so much trial and error involved—and there simply isn’t enough time in a teacher’s schedule to do that. Then there’s the problem of not being able to play together virtually. Band is like the playground in the sense that everyone is doing their part together.
So I worry about my child and my students who are all having brand new experiences this coming year because none of them will be getting the best of what they need.
I often wonder about the comment that many have made that we or children have “been robbed” of whatever it might be- some way of living, some thing. There are no deals or certainties in life. My mom always used to say that you have to play the hand you’re dealt. I remember many times in my life when something was lost. Something new always grew in its place. I’m reminded of that quote by Matisse who said, “Il y a des fleurs partout pour qui veut bien les voir.” There are flowers everywhere for those who really want to see them. No doubt we are facing many losses now, but can we take some time out to find something that may be gained in this situation?
Problem is this can be used to justify or rationalize anything.
“Is there a risk that you’ll catch a virus and die? Sure, but there are no certainties in life. You have to play the hand you’re dealt.”
“Is 100% online good for education? No, but don’t focus on what you’ve lost. You have to play the hand you’re dealt. And there has never been a time where it made more sense to invest heavily in remote learning and work hard to make it better.”
But I see no silver lining to this crisis, apart from the (true) truism that things can always get worse.
Flerp! I hear you. And I am silent.
I opted for the Swacker no-school option. But there is another choice and I plan to further explicate this in a newspaper column.
Schools can divide into thirds. Average class size in most states is about 20, although my proposal would work at 30. Each group would attend school 2 days a week with somewhat longer hours, perhaps 9-5. Rather than requiring a 6th day of work for all classroom teachers, the 6th day in rotation would engage the arts and extended physical activities. Imagine a day where music or theater was a four hour block of creativity and fun, rather than a 40 minute class with time lost in transition. Imagine a physical class as a day that kids would design for themselves. Research shows that a typical school day loses 15 to 20% in transitions. Much of that time would be regained.
Each day would consist of two long blocks, each dedicated to significant project work. Much evidence points to the value of long blocks of engaged work as opposed to a day filled with physical and cognitive transitions. Language and mathematical learning can be embedded in the project work, whether it be fantastic simulations, writing and producing plays, planting and tending to gardens . . . As many Ravitch readers know, the outdoor-type approach to education in many places – Japan, Germany, Sweden and others – is already having great impact. And, while winter in many climates makes it challenging, outdoor activities are good for the heart, mind, spirit and, as a bonus, reduce the transmission of coronavirus.
Imaginative teachers, freed from conventional expectations, would develop learning experiences with far greater impact than traditional curricula and classroom tedium. Working with class sizes of 7 to 10 would allow much greater attention to each child’s unique strengths and give much more opportunity for each child’s expression.
I would argue that such a model would produce more powerful learning in two days per week than currently possible in our antiquated, mechanistic model. The ability for children to “social distance” would be much greater. From an epidemiological point of view, the possibility of transmission would be exponentially lowered in a school with 1/3 the students.
Screening of all students entering the building would be mandatory. Testing and contact tracing would be ubiquitous.
This could work in a 5 day week as well, with slightly larger classes and 2.5 days of school for each child.
There are complex staffing and scheduling problems to solve, for schools and families, but they are far from insurmountable. This approach would also give children more time for free play and family engagement (although I know child care issues would be difficult for many). In addition to the power of blocks of highly experiential work during the school day, children’s “home days” can involve preparation and continuation of the deep work done in school.
The idea requires more explication, but I think it is a model that can work and may lead to post-pandemic improvement in what is now a pretty dismal educational system.
“Imaginative teachers, freed from conventional expectations, would develop learning experiences with far greater impact than traditional curricula and classroom tedium.”
Steve,
Would that it were.
One can hope!
Sad and true.
my kindergarten child has had more of a bad experience and now does not want to do anything on the tablet at all. its been more of a fight to get him to do anything and more of a negative experience. I have stopped him from doing it yet I feel u am doing something wrong by not making him do it. over all I am not going to traumatize him to get him to do the work making him cry. I feel like I am going to be judged by the school for not making him do it anymore..I am located on oregon
I love how you said that the essence of kindergarten comes from the beautiful community. My wife thinks we should be safe and have our kid attend an online school. I’ll show her this article and hopefully convince her to let our kid go to an actual kindergarten classroom even if that means we have to be super cautious.
[…] That seems to bolster the case for in-person instruction for elementary schoolchildren, who appear to struggle the most with computer-based remote learning. High school students, who are better equipped to utilize online learning platforms and less likely […]