The Washington Post reported that the CIA concluded that agents of the Russian government intervened in the presidential election to help elect Donald Trump.
This is the first time that a foreign government played an active role in an American presidential election. Thus, we have a nativist, nationalistic president who defends Vladimir Putin and appoints right wing extremists, generals, and billionaires. Putin no doubt wanted an inexperienced and naive American president whom he could manipulate with flattery. He got what he wanted.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
He should not be made President. He has to be stopped. Stopping him, stops Putin.
Agree…we need a do over.
Ellen Lubic
December 10, 2016 at 7:12 pm
As Right Wing and religious fanatic as Pence is, and he is all of that, after considering all the elements of Trump’s behaviors with Putin, The Apprentice, his appointments, his choices of Himmler and Goerring aka Conway and Bannon, and more, I prefer Pence to Trump.
At least Pence knows how to legislate and how to work within our nation’s laws. He has run a state govt. and does talk with others across the aisle. However, he is still a corporate weasel…but I doubt he would set off a nuclear weapon.
I am certain Trump would have no compunctions to nuke others. And I am certain that We the People will never hear any truth out his filthy demented mouth.
Fortunately, the vote of the Electoral College was intentionally delayed until December 19th to prevent a foreign power from influencing an election. This is the moment Alexander Hamilton warned us about. We now know that the Russian Government actively worked to elect Donald Trump. The Electoral College is our defense against this attack on our sovereignty.
There is a growing movement called the Hamilton Electors who are trying to influence the members of the Electoral College use this safety provision within our Constitution to vote against this dangerous demagogue from becoming President. A few of the Electors have already said that they are going to vote no for Trump, including a Republican from Texas. Here is their facebook page, https://www.facebook.com/HamiltonElectors/, and hashtags, #HamiltonElectors, #ComradeTrump. They are asking for everyone to call everybody they know and contact every media outlet their community. The Electoral College must be our defense against Russia.
The great grandson of Alexander Hamilton is asking for sundown candlelight vigils at local courthouses every night across the nation until Dec 19th. If we could could get a few dozen candlelight participants to grow to a few hundred, then to a few thousand, and to a few million, everynight, maybe we could send a powerful enough message to our Electoral College members that voting against Trump is essential to the survival of our nation as it was intended
Here is the sight that finds a candlelight vigils near you. http://www.hamiltonelectors.com/find_a_candlelight_vigil Yes, it’s small, for now. But it’s also new, so you can also help organize a candlelight vigil for your community here. http://www.hamiltonelectors.com/find_a_candlelight_vigil
In news today, I read that Trump is moving toward Russia to make them a buddy and away from China.
Lloyd, does that mean we will help the Russians bomb every hospital in Syria? Will we look away when Russia invades the Baltic nations?
Diane, we have no business talking about Russia bombing hospitals. Log in our own eye, after all.
That all depends on the leadership in the Republican Party since they hold the majority in both Houses of Congress. What the GOP does in Congress will reveal how spineless, racist, greedy, and deplorable the party of Lincoln has become.
For the next two years, the primary defense against Donald Trump is the Republican Party. Will some Republican senators and House members cross over and stand with the Democrats, and will any Democrats side with and support Donald Trump?
The survival of the Republic depends on them. Only they can limit the damage Trump can do to the Republic as he roles back more than a century of progressive reforms that were meant to make the United States a more humane and safe place to live for all ethnic and religious groups and even those that live in poverty. Today no one has to starve to death in the U.S. But with Trump in the White House, that becomes a big question mark.
Will Trump eventually call for a return to slavery for minorities and servitude for children and women who will be stripped of all the rights they spent more than a century fighting for?
With the support of about 15 million deplorable voters, and the deplorable cabinet of billionaires he is organizing, it is arguably obvious that is where Trump is headed.
Is there anyone in this country that holds a position of power that will step in and stop this narcissistic psycho from running rampant like the few who stepped up and dared to confront McCarthy and stop McCarthyism?
“The journalist Edward R. Murrow had aired a documentary that showed how McCarthy’s charges were groundless and how he had used bullying techniques to harass individuals.”
https://www.mtholyoke.edu/~lillsie/McCarthyism/downfall.html
But will the same method work now that we have this huge Alt-Right conservative hate media machine churning out conspiracy theories on a, assembly line built on lies, misinformation, and cherry-picked facts that has captured an audience of fools, million of them who refuse to open their minds?
I don’t see any advantage for Russia to invade Baltic nations, or likelihood, with NATO on their border. NATO’s “Regime change” came to Ukraine by violent fascists in a coup, which threatened Russia’s border security, which it moved to protect in the Crimea region with an election and annexation. Trump understands that and not looking to pick a fight. He is greatly feared in the US for wanting to get out of the “regime change” business, which leaves us with endless wars, which may bring our own regime change, which is why he has the support of the exhausted and depleted military, the Russians learned their lesson in Afghanistan about putting boots on the ground.
Joseph,
You are so misinformed I don’t know where to begin. Read this article in the New York Review of Books:
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2016/12/22/russia-nato-trump-the-shadow-world/
It begins like this:
“NATO and Russia are close to war, according to General Sir Richard Shirreff, recently NATO’s second-in-command. In 2017: War with Russia, he writes that Russia could invade the Baltic states, which are NATO members, while NATO does nothing. When crisis strikes, the British prime minister is at the pub, the Germans are paralyzed by anxiety, and the Greeks and Hungarians are in Russia’s pocket. The Americans are raring to go, but three countries have to fall before they can persuade their European partners to share their sense of urgency.
“And one could almost now say that Shirreff’s alarmism has been overtaken by events, which are conspiring to demolish even the outward show of solidarity on which NATO relies for its deterrence. Britain’s vote to leave the European Union and Turkey’s post-coup crackdown call into question the strategic direction of two of NATO’s major military powers. As for Donald Trump’s argument during the presidential campaign that America’s richer allies should pay adequately for their protection, it was a fair point in principle, but a fatal thing to say in public. It made clear that America’s commitment to NATO would not be unconditional under President Trump; and if America’s commitment is not unconditional, then fairly obviously it will not extend to nuclear war. The cat is out of the bag. Seen from Moscow, the West has not been in such inviting disarray since the Suez crisis of 1956. Whatever constraints Putin may now feel upon his land-grabbing instincts, they must be entirely domestic in nature. NATO is no longer one of them.”
Russia has had boots on the ground many times since Afghanistan.
There was its brutal suppression of Chechnya, and its invasion of Ukraine most recently. Putin is not a pacifist.
Will we look away as our own military kills hundreds of thousands innocent children, women, elders as this country has done since Vietnam (actually also before). We indiscriminately kill many civilians every year.
It goes back long before Vietnam. In World War II, the US and its allies firebombed cities in Germany and Japan killing hundreds of thousands of noncombatants from infants to the elderly. In fact, these bombings killed more people than the two A-bombs dropped on Japan.
Go back to the Civil War and discover who suffered the most when Sherman took his army and tore through the South destroying its railroads, farms, cities and crop lands in total war.
Diane,
Russia going after the Baltic States would be utterly horrible. But please don’t incomplete (is “incomplete” a verb in English?) the conversation by omitting all the imperialistic war campaigns the USA has had its plutocratic hands on in the last 60 years.
Russian oligarchs are villains. So are American ones.
Why is it necessary to continually beat our breasts about how bad we have been when any discussion of anyone else’s perfidy or possible perfidy is brought up? Yeah, we have done horrible things and will do more in the course of history. Human beings don’t seem to have an aptitude for peaceful coexistence. So we ignore the possible consequences of other’s actions because we are guilty of past sins as well? Hey, we might have never joined the fighting in WWII if the Japanese hadn’t bombed Pearl Harbor. Got any ideas on how that might have played out?
The same goes for smaller sins. He did this, but she did that last week. We are going to ridiculous lengths to paralyze ourselves.
“…the conversation by omitting all the imperialistic war campaigns the USA has had its plutocratic hands on in the last 60 years. Russian oligarchs are villains. So are American ones.”
This is one of the Russian propaganda themes, to reveal our hidden history to our youth via Alt Right networks like Breitbart and Alex Jones of InfoWars, but leave out the Conservative’s role in our checkered past, which was much worse.
Paralyzing us is their objective, which they have done, as they try to shift the debate from “left vs. right” to a “top vs. bottom” conflict instead, where the deprived lower class overthrows the elites. At least that is what many are being led to believe, as Trump fills his cabinet full of the billionaire class which is even more elitist.
But the propaganda only tells half of the story blaming the liberal globalist for everything and letting the conservative war profiteers who really got us into this mess off the hook.
The endless wars created by American oligarchs has made these weapons industry billionaires the voice of Trump. All of it, allowed if not aided by the Dems, brought us to today.
Diane,
The way I’m reading the Russian propaganda, especially at Alexander Dugin’s site is that his Eurasian fascists movement is winning elections all over the world. His movement is trying to change the left/right conflict into an top/down conflict, thus all of the references to overthrowing the establishment. On his post entitled “Drain the Swamp”, Dugin isn’t calling for Putin to invade the Baltic States. He is calling for each country to eliminate their liberal globalist once they win the election. (I tried to include a link to article, but I had to leave it out in order to post my comment.)
I think that a lot of the anti-establishment and anti-CIA comments you are getting here are repeating some of the Russian propaganda themes, those designed to undermine experts in the field like yourself. Although they are right about some of the horrible things the CIA has done, we don’t want those tactics of terror that were used to intimidate the citizens of other countries, to start being used within the United States, which Steve Bannon as Chief Strategists and his Alt Right followers are now set up to do. Hopefully, we can put an end to all of it and make America good again instead.
“Although they are right about some of the horrible things the CIA has done, we don’t want those tactics of terror that were used to intimidate the citizens of other countries, to start being used within the United States, which Steve Bannon as Chief Strategists and his Alt Right followers are now set up to do. Hopefully, we can put an end to all of it and make America good again instead.”
Agreed in full. We’re at a point where many are discounting the knowledge and findings of our nation’s experts in favor of opinions spouting out of the mouths of fools like Trump. It’s pathetic.
Speaking of “Alt” Right:
A friend of mine who’s parents were holocaust survivors informed me that the “Alt” does not stand for “Alternate”. It is German for “Old” and the full term, “Alt Right” is a reference to the old Nazi Party.
And Steve Bannon is Trump’s right hand man.
This must be stopped.
Perhaps “Alt Reich?”
Do you think anything will come of this? I hope like hell something good comes out of this. Having another country influence our election, is so disturbing. Looking at the half wits Trump has for cabinets members is giving me nightmares. So truly frightening. Not surprised by Trump’s team response.
Not just half wits: billionaires who never have enough.
just “different” billionaires who never have enough, this is a battle of the oligarchs, I will go with the ones who look for peace with Russia, as JFK did after the Cuban missile crisis. I have many sources of information besides the sable rattling at the NY Review of Books. There is big money in talking war with Russia.
Joseph,
Putin is an oligarch. He does not wish us well. He is much smarter than Trump. He never loses sight of his strategic objectives, that is, to re-establish the USSR without the facade of Communist ideology. Just plunder.
I would be happy to have detente with Russia. But verify before trusting. At present, they have secured the victory of the Syrian dictator over his own people by providing him arms and an Air Force with which to bomb hospitals and civilians.
This is an interesting video that shows the growth of Russia as an empire. The Communists did not create this empire. They just inherited it after a blood bath.
The Russians spread east and slaughtered natives and conquered other countries with smallpox an/or war just like the U.S. did to the native Americans as it spread west across what is the United States today.
In the 18th century the Russians ran into the Qing Dynasty in China (when it was at its highest power), and they were stopped. That’s when they went further east and crossed to Alaska and spread down the North American west coast into what’s known as California today. Too far from the center of power, the Russians pulled back out of North America and sold it’s Alaskan colony to the U.S.
It’s obvious that Putin wants to keep that empire growing and expanding. What’s in his way: China, the EU, and the US. Trump is clearly a pawn in Putin’s agenda. With Trump he is switching America’s focus so China becomes more of an adversary then it was before Trump. Will Trump close the door for Chinese students wanting to attend U.S. universities?
Putin’s end goal is to destroy China and the US as world powers by pitting them against each other while dismantling the EU. Trump is a pawn in that dangerous and bloody game of empire, and the deplorables that support Turmp in are unwittingly helping Putin achieve his dream, a powerful Russian global super power.
Joseph, JFK did not pursue peace with Russia after the Cuban missile crisis. If anything, he became more aware of the Soviet Union’s desire to build a military presence that could easily strike our shores. Where did you learn your history? The Soviet Union was not our friend. Putin is not our friend. Don’t use JFK to defend Trump’s naivete. He is what Lenin would have called “a useful idiot.”
Oh, honestly, WaPo has zero credibility on this issue.
Site Behind Washington Post’s McCarthyite Blacklist Appears To Be Linked to Ukrainian Fascists and CIA Spies
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/12/site-behind-washington-posts-mccarthyite-blacklist-appears-to-be-linked-to-ukrainian-fascism-and-cia-spying.html
We Demand That The Washington Post Retract Its Propaganda Story Defaming Naked Capitalism and Other Sites and Issue an Apology
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/12/we-demand-that-the-washington-post-retract-its-propaganda-story-defaming-naked-capitalism-and-other-sites-and-issue-an-apology.html
PropOrNot’s Grandiose Fabrications
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/12/propornots-grandiose-fabrications.html
Washington Post Promotes Shadowy Website That Accuses 200 Publications of Being Russian Propaganda Plants
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/11/washington-post-promotes-shadowy-website-that-accuses-200-publications-of-being-russian-propaganda-plants.html
Naked Capitalism is one of the most respected economic blogs, as is this blog . This is all really destructive propaganda. Do we really want a hot war with Russia? Syria? Or anywhere? Please, people, be careful about all this.
Kim,
This is not about the Washington Post. It comes from the CIA. Central Intelligence Agency. Remember them?
Diane,
Don’t know if you’ve ever read much of Glenn Greenwald, but he is the definition of a true journalist. Here is his take on this supposed “news”:
You’re not a big fan of democratic elections, I see.
Pulitzer prize winner Glenn Greenwald from the Intercept:
Beat me to the punch, RTBH!
Kim Kaufman, you might find this interesting:
Thank you. I hadn’t seen that. Turley said “Now the Washington Post has published a rather cryptic correction to the fake news story.” and proceeded to break it down as a non-correction of anything. Naked Capitalism has issued a demand for a retraction in a highly visible way and she will proceed to litigation if necessary. She has an experienced DC first amendment attorney doing pro bono work on this. Discovery should be very enlightening.
The Ron Paul Institute is one of specific targets for Russian propaganda machinery. Watch at 15:25 in the following interview with Putin’s political advisor and leader of the Eurasian fascist movement Alexander Dugin where he reveals that Ron Paul and Pat Buchanan push the same sort of right wing isolationist ideas that Russia would like the US to adopt. So it’s the organizations such as the Ron Paul that Putin has been feeding pro-Russian propaganda too.
Kim,
No, I don’t want a hot war with Russia. But I don’t want Putin’s fascists movement to grow into the United States with the election of Trump, who is Putin’s puppet. There is way more evidence of Trump’s connections to Putin and Russia than the Washington Post. Check out this report that reveals all of Trump’s Russian connections going back to the 1980s.
Hopefully, if we recover from this, and our nation still survives as our founders intended, we can drop our never ending wars against Russia and the Middle East, and put our efforts towards something productive like educating our children how a democracy works or building our alternative energy infrastructure.
LOCK HIM UP
Thanks, Joel.
He pulled a fast one and now we will have the most reactionary government in our history.
Yes,,,lock him up…
More info on CIA, FBI, Russia…and all for Trump
http://crooksandliars.com/2016/12/harry-reid-russiagate-james-comey-j-edgar
From before the “election”:
http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/11/is-donald-trump-a-manchurian-candidate
So, then, should the US declare “war” on Russia? Fire up the nukes? How do we know that this information is “true” — who has verified it? How reliable the source (s)? Who has a hidden agenda here? BTW, I abhor Drumpf so don’t go accusing me of some kind of bias for the Hair Furor.
We should acknowledge that Putin elected Trump. No one forced the CIA to reach this conclusion. We have a president who won 46% of the popular vote compared to the loser, who won 48%. She won nearly 3 million more votes than he did. And he has appointed people to attack unions, the minimum wage, healthcare, the environment, and public education. Putin gets what he wants: an ignorant fool as our president.
Russia will be designated as Too Big To Fail and be on the receiving end of US taxpayer funds to finish the job of hacking into every possible American account.
We wont know that the reporting is true till the reports are released . They probably are. The Trump team is not denying the veracity of the reporting. They are slamming the CIA .Now I have no love for the CIA but they are pretty good at what they do. If anyone can tell you how to alter the results of elections they are the pros, ask any Latin leader. . Trump claims the CIA blew it in Iraq so what do they know. . Well that’s only true in Republican and Trump land . The Bush administration cherry picked the intelligence turning we can not prove he has no WMD into he has WMD. Then they committed war crimes.
But there are two larger questions here
What role did the future Trump administration play in this act of espionage. Was it espionage in collusion with Trump, making it TREASON.
What role did TRUMP play in the FBIs unprecedented assault on the democratic process. Did Giuliani conspire with Agents out of the NY office to force Comey’s hands, 10 days before an election.
A long history slime in the Republican party that they have never been held accountable for, Not only attempting to altering elections but possibly costing thousands of American lives starting with Nixon in Vietnam Then Reagan and the Iran hostages. . … …. .
.
Agree Joel…Trump made a public statement early on in the campaign for Putin to keep hacking Hillary’s emails. And Giuliani bragged to the world about his connection/direction of the FBI.
So, are Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan just going to hide their heads in the DC sand and giggle about all this since it turned out better than they could ever have imagined?
Holding mass protests is fantasy with the ability of Trump to call out the military with an Executive Order, as directed in the Military Commissions Act, to put down any insurrection by The People any where in the US. Our country has never been in such dire straits.
And Trump loves violence.
He also said early on that he will pick the best people to actually run the country, and he will just be in the role of overseeing them. So while we were laughing at his braggadocio and nonsense, he was telling us know exactly what he would do…and it came to pass…..
..and yesterday the reports were that the CEO of Exxon Mobil is his fave choice for Sect. of State…
Will,
What is your take on the Dworking Report, it reveals all of Trump’s connections to Putin and Russia going back to the 1980s.
So now we’re trusting the CIA?
This is pretty big. Treason, perhaps…
Trump is illegitimate
Putin elected him
Is this the same CIA that sold crack in LA’s black communities to fund the Contras?
Pretty good at what they do!!!!! . You didn’t need the CIA to tell you this. An uninterested hacker without a national agenda would have been releasing information on both parties just for the fun of it.
The same CIA that has engineered coups in dozens of countries (including those which were already our allies) in order to install right-wing pro-U.S. dictators.
Allen,
I take the CIA seriously. You seem to despise every part of the US government.
Allen,
Of course, you can choose to believe Putin, whose army invaded Crimea, whose KGB has murdered joutnalists and dissidents, who longs to restore the USSR. But I assume from your comments that you never lost faith in the CCP.
Count me as one with zero credibility. I believe the CIA and the 16 other intelligence agencies who concluded that Russian government operatives were behind the hacking, that they hacked only one party, not the other. Why? Duh. An ignorant, embarrassing leader of the western alliance.
Dienne
And your point is
More weapons have been sold to foreign governments during this administration than any other, including Bush-Cheney:
https://www.thenation.com/article/the-obama-administration-has-sold-more-weapons-than-any-other-administration-since-world-war-ii/
The shady and secretive K-Street firm Beacon Global Strategies, made up of Clinton friends and advisors, brokered the deals.
In September, the corrupt DOJ dropped charges against the American arms dealer who illegally sold weapons to Qatar and Saudi Arabia (some ended up in ISIS) while Hillary was SOS. In fact, she approved the deals after her husband was given $2.3 million in speaking fees and donations. Interesting the WaPo and NYTimes refused to publish this huge story.
Anybody here ever read about the Iranian Coup of 53 engineered by the CIA and MI6?
Again we are not talking about the record of the CIA
Were the Emails of the DNC hacked? Yes
Were the Emails of John Podesta hacked ? Yes
Who would have hacked them ?
Why were the emails of Republicans not hacked (ignoring that they were ,but not released)
Go on the web and type in hacks and cracks . Let me know what you come up with. To pieces of information you should know first .
One: have a very good updated antivirus program.
Two : Learn a little Russian first
two
I don’t what to believe here …
But I do know that IF unfriendly nations wanted to weaken the United States, make it the butt of daily ridicule, and torpedo the esteem it enjoys among nations then they could hardly do better than helping to make that hot-air buffoon DJT our Commander in Tweet and Twitular Head of State.
Bingo!
It is easier to CON people than to convince people they’ve been CONNED and this is exactly WHY the ELECTORAL college exists, to take ACTION and Save DEMOCRACY from CORPORATOCRACY and MILITOCRACY. SING & Listen to Other’s Songs to Learn to hear Other’s Words; #Sing1Voice Share Your Song https://youtu.be/lDg2DxeV6kE
So when the Electors vote net week. they should all vote for Hillary.
Better chance praying for the meteor strike.
Trump is the epitome of, “corporatocracy and militocracy.” Looking at his cabinet appointments is all one needs to see that.
Actually not . Clinton ,Obama and Bush 1 & 2 were the corporatocracy Far more sophisticated than “F—face von Clownstick”. And all the critiques of the CIA mentioned here are correct. All of the posts about about neo liberal policy at home and abroad are correct .
But what “Donnie Little Hands ” is going to deliver is Fascism.
“a political philosophy, movement, or regime that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition ” Webster
“An inherent aspect of fascist economies was economic dirigisme,[4] meaning an economy where the government exerts strong directive influence over investment while often subsidizing favorable companies, as opposed to having a merely regulatory role. In general, apart from the nationalizations of many industries, fascist economies were based on private individuals being allowed property and private initiative, but these were contingent upon service to the state.” WIKI
There is one positive. We finally got to see the transcripts of those speeches that Hillary made to Goldman Sachs for 200K.
And they were true!
Hillary made speeches to Goldman Sachs. Trump handed Goldman Sachs the keys to the kingdom.
I think that subverting a presidential election counts as treason–on the part of Trump & co.
And we get the knee jerk reaction that the CIA is not a credible source… Come on people! The CIA gathers intelligence from multiple sources including foreign intelligence agencies. If every time a government agency comes out with a report on a high impact issue we question their ability to do their job without cheating, we have bigger problems than Trump. In essence, by dismissing the CIA assessment you are also questioning the ability of your elected officials to make responsible decisions. After all, how could they possibly rely on our intelligence agencies for “intelligence,” when everybody knows they are all corrupt and always have been? If this summarizes what you really believe, then stop whining about your democratic rights because, by your own assessment, you have never had them. Is it anyone surprised that we have Facebook as a major news source? I wonder if the CIA uses them.
cx: is anyone surprised..
When it comes to Trump, no one is a credible source. Unless you praise him.
The research of Princeton Prof. Gilens proved the U.S. is an oligarchy, not a democracy.
Linda,
And Russia is a democracy? In whose fevered mind?
Agreed :, so would we prefer a party , because it is not just Trump .
We had the spectacle of the Senate leader from a coal state denying health bennifits to retired miners last night. A party who throws bones to the eighty percent of Americans who are struggling or the party that turns over the keys to the house in order to serve the people for lunch.
Joel,
I would prefer any party that was not Trump.
dianeravitch
Trump is them and they are Trump they have created and pandered to that racist deplorable base since Nixon.
With rare exception there is no insult that he could throw at them to get them to take their eye off the ball. My fellow lefties talk about Oligarchy. We are about to see what unbridled Oligarchy looks like.
While I tend to agree with him to a certain extent, his research PROVES nothing. He is defending an opinion. However, we, the people, have certainly done nothing lately to preserve the democratic institutions we still have.
The WaPost is not a credible source.
The Washington Post is one of the best newspapers in the country. WaPo and the New York Times. Totally credible.
People who claim that the Washington Post is not a credible newspaper are people who rely on Fox News cherry picked, misleading crap for their information and/or some Alt-Right hate media talking head like Rush Limbaugh. All of these far right freak sites repeatedly teach their deplorable followers to trust no one but them until that distrust and hate is carved into their rancid brains.
And Rush Limbaugh actually calls his loyal followers ditto head and tells them he will do the thinking for them. At least he did years ago when I listened to him until I decided to actually fact-check his claims and discovered what a fat lying turd he was. I wonder if he still calls his deplorable faction ditto heads.
I want my country back!
Then Trump should not be president. Bernie should be president.
“Intelligence agencies have identified individuals with connections to the Russian government who provided WikiLeaks with thousands of hacked emails from the Democratic National Committee and others, including Hillary Clinton’s campaign chairman…officials described the individuals as actors known to the intelligence community and part of a wider Russian operation to boost Trump and hurt Clinton’s chances…’It is the assessment of the intelligence community that Russia’s goal was to favor one candidate over the other, to help Trump get elected,’ said a senior U.S. official…The Trump transition team dismissed the findings in a short statement…Trump has consistently dismissed the intelligence community’s findings about Russian hacking… agency officials cited a growing body of intelligence from multiple sources [that] it was now ‘quite clear’ that electing Trump was Russia’s goal…”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/obama-orders-review-of-russian-hacking-during-presidential-campaign/2016/12/09/31d6b300-be2a-11e6-94ac-3d324840106c_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_russiahack-745p%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.4c917734dfdd
“the Russians hacked the Republican National Committee’s computer systems in addition to their attacks on Democratic organizations, but did not release whatever information they gleaned from the Republican networks…In the months before the election, it was largely documents from Democratic Party systems that were leaked to the public…Trump has repeatedly cast doubt about any intelligence suggesting a Russian effort to influence the election.”
I think it’s clear that (1) the rubes got duped and (2) fake news and rampant misinformation helped to sway them, and (3) this is a very real danger to the very fabric of democracy.
Anybody now think that democratic citizenship should NOT be a primary focus of public education?
Anybody?
Yeah, the CIA.
Except, it’s not just the CIA. It’s the whole range of American intelligence agencies and western intelligence agencies.
That’s why Obama called for the “review.” It will put into print and into the public domain all the evidence that Russia was behind the hacks of both the DNC and RNC files, but released on those of the DNC to embarrass and hurt Clinton. It will explain the Russian role in creating and disseminating false and misleading information via fake news – which the Trump campaign engaged in multiple times. It will document the role of Russia in giving information to WikiLeaks in order to spread misinformation and sabotage the democratic process.
The “review” will help to make it clear that those who’ve lied and distorted about all of this — like Mitch McConnell and Republican party officials like Reince Priebus — have aided and abetted the subversion of democracy and the Constitution.
It ain’t pretty. And it sure is dangerous.
Ok so who did it that had no interest in releasing RNC emails
.
Why stop at 1990: Honduras, the ,Ukraine , Argentina, Brazil Venezuela .
A record like that makes them pretty credible. Doesn’t make them nice people.
Editors, in the media, made a decision to publish the hacked e-mails of Democrats, when they had reason to believe they were obtained illegally. Hacked e-mails from the Republican Party were not published. Going forward, it’s clear that media is, in tacit collusion with those who commit crimes, and the stakes, are high- the world’s survival.
Mass media in the US cannot live without the cash cow of a Citizens United-ized political system. That’s why all they do is cover the horse race. It mean’s more money for ads that affects no one but the most uninformed, disinterested voters who have little if any civic education. The hundreds of millions in biannual campaign expenditures go primarily to consultants who come up with this dribble and the media outlets that run them ad nauseam.
When most of the media is owned by Rupert Murdoch, Emperor of Yellow Journalism, and a Trumpster billionaire, and he can slant the world’s leading business news at the WSJ, how can anyone be surprised that we get NO honest reporting?
The continued consolidation of media, as with banks, oil, pharma, communications, etc., with no one in Congress pressing for obeying US anti Trust laws, shows that we have long been living in an oligarchy…this is not new news. Congress has been owned by these oligarchs for most of the decades since Reagan, as is the majority of SCOTUS.
It’s actually worse than you describe. Local newspapers will likely be as quaint a memory as cellophane shirt collars if the current trends continue. Consolidation means no original reporting. Virtually everything they print is based on whatever syndicate they belong to decides is important. Remember the good old days when cities had competing morning and afternoon papers with differing editorial views? I’m having as hard a time explaining that to my boys as I am telephones with dials and long chords.
Exactly, Greg.
Attacking and discrediting the mainstream media is another Russian propaganda trick. Listen to Alex Jones bad mouth the mainstream media (including Fox News) as he tells them that he is going to be their replacement, after he gloats about how Trump called him to thank him for his help. “Couldn’t have won the election without you.” Trump tells Jones. Alex Jones goes on to say that it was his InfoWar followers that made up the cheering section of Trump’s rallies.
http://www.infowars.com/donald-trump-thanks-infowarriors-for-the-win/
The media published one party’s hacked e-mails, blame is due.
The media should never have published stolen documents. As I said before the election, Watergate was the same as Wikileaks
Also listen to Alexander Dugin, Putin’s political advisor and leader of the Eurasian fascists movement growing out of Russian thank Alex Jones for his help and congratulating him for getting 20 million viewers on his InforWars channel since Trump’s election (5th paragraph down).
http://katehon.com/directives/donald-trumps-victory
For what it’s worth, Allen, i, for one, appreciate your efforts around here lately. But I’ll warn you from experience you’d have better luck talking to a wall. The Trumpphobia around here is so thick that people simply cannot hear the truth. Trump = bad means, apparently, that everyone and everything else = good, regardless of proven record. Don’t drive yourself nuts trying to explain that around here. You’ll only end up in the next room over from me in the loony bin.
Dienne
You are a working class hero . A true warrior for the oppressed . I don’t recall seeing you at the Democracy Awakening Demonstrations in DC last March. I didn’t see you at the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations . But then again NY is a bit closer to Washington and it was the focus of Occupy.
Anyone who can see the cabinet this demagogue has put together and not have” fear for all of those you claim to care about” is really a disingenuous individual. It is getting old . Yes the Democrats have sucked the have sucked up to Wall street . They have brutally suppressed dissent. But I plan on being in Washington on the 21st of January to tell this fascist that he did not win this election . He lost it by near 3 million votes. Will you be joining us to defend.
Public Schools vs Private religious schools,or subsidies to the wealthy to send their children to Private Academies “Public Charters” is old hack now.
American’s right to collective bargaining. Unions
Our children’s right to a livable climate with clean air and water .
A woman’s right to equal pay and to control her own body.
A workers right to a livable wage. To get paid for mandatory overtime and at an overtime rate.
The rights of workers to return home safe from work .
The rights of consumers to safe products and drugs.
The right of investors or borrowers to honest information
Obama care sucked especially for those like my son who make enough to not be subsidized. But it expanded healthcare to a whole segment of the working poor who received medicaid .
Our stupid elderly whites who just overwhelmingly voted for cuts in Social Security and Medicare. .Of course these cuts will not apply to me They may apply to you . I like the majority of white working class retirees will see these bennifits diminished by inflation . While younger Americans will be thrown to the wolves.
But you know I have been to many Demonstrations in my 65 years .
Starting with anti war demos in the late sixties. The reason the long johns will come on is looking at people like Flyn and Bannon not to mention Trump, for the first time I am concerned about going to Demonstrations. Not after Kent State not after witnessing the violent crushing of occupy . Nor even the long spectacle at Standing Rock.
I will be there to protect this.
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Will you be there .
Or will you be at your keyboard saying they are all the same. .
Hate for Hillary Clinton is not the basis for political and policy strategies and tactics, especially now that the electoral college victory has been decided. To claim that “Trump = bad” and “everything else = good” borders on ideological sophistry and does not help build a pragmatic approach for the future. Rehashing past history is only effective if it informs how we act in the present and think about the future. If all one does is recite the wrongs of the past over and over again, then it’s hard to learn from history to forge collective action against the reality of a fascist American oligarchy. The time for hating the Clintons–I was in that number until August–now belongs to the dustbin of history, not our futures. Time to get out of that gutter, brush off the dirt, and figure out if and how we can get the hell out of where we are.
+1
Hmmm….need to be careful reporting fake news these days. This is the gang that brought us into Iraq with phony reports about WMDs. The Washington Post has already retracted its fake news story about having any facts about an organization that is listing fake news web sites. Assange has already said that Russia played no part in the DNC leaks, interesting how he appears to be possibly getting his day in court at this moment.. I think we need proof before making these statements, not a “high confidence”, since we are dealing with a nuclear power. Like in Iraq, this could be used to bring “regime change” to this country, chickens are coming home to roost.
Joseph,
We have regime change happening in this country right now. The anti-worker, fascist right is taking over. Assange has zero credibility as he engineered this coup in plain sight. You have consistently supported Trump so of course you would see Assange in a positive light. I think he is a thief and his actions will harm millions of Americans who will lose their healthcare and not get a raise above $7.25 an hour, whose air and water will be polluted. Thanks, Julian, for helping to elect the most reactionary government in our history.
Diane
Here is a great piece by Naomi Prins on the fat cats in Trumps cabinet, here is a great time for the Dems to return to their roots, Hillary was not going to get them there.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-09/trumps-bait-and-switch
Joseph,
Stop bashing Hillary. We are facing a horrible future under an ignorant man and the best you can do is keep knocking HRC?
Joseph, have you ever spent time comparing what Hillary Clinton actually did to improve the quality of life for women and children to what Donald Trump has never done for anyone else but him and his family?
Donald Trump destroyed e-mails that were evidence that judges demanded he turn over, repeatedly, for court cases Trump was involved in.
Donald Trump has been linked to the mob, not once but many times with witnesses, video’s and photos.
Donald Trump is a serial liar with a history of lies that goes back decades.
Donald Trump is a bully, the evidence is overwhelming.
Donald Turmp is obviously in Putin’s corner. The evidence is mounting.
Donald Trump has done everlasting that he accused Hillary Clinton of but there is little or no evidence that Hillary is guilty of any of those allegations.
Donald Turmp sets up a non-profit foundation that ends up benefiting him and his family and no one else.
Donald Trump has cheated partners, banks, and people who worked for him by refusing to pay what he owed them.
Hillary Clinton, no matter what her actual flaws are (and they aren’t as many as many think thanks to the Alt-Right hate media machine that manufacturers conspiracy theories based on lies and cherry picked facts designed to fools the deplorables), would have been a much better choice for president than Donald Trump.
Julian Assange has 100 percent credibility and integrity. He has published 10 million truthful documents without any proof of errors. I’m sorry he showed the world the depths of the corruption behind the Democrats and the Clintons. I want to know the truth even when it rattles my faith.
Is the CIA that’s telling us that Putin elected Trump the same CIA that told us that evidence of WMDs in Iraq was a “slam dunk?”
Michael,
Why do you think that only the DNC was hacked? Only one candidate was targeted? Or was that my imagination?
They did not tell you that.
Are you referring to the CIA that testified that “we did everything but pull the trigger on the gun we were holding to Condoleezza Rice’s head to get her to tell to get the President to take action” . Before 9/11 and was told “he has bigger fish to fry”.
They told him there was no conclusive evidence that that Saddam had a nuclear weapons program. He turned the absence of conclusive evidence into proof.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/05/michael-morell-bush-cheney-iraq-war
How quickly we forget the build up to the Iraq War, when weapons inspectors were begging the Bush administration to allow them time to investigate. The careless and corrupt MSM is to blame for war propaganda.
https://www.thenation.com/article/eleven-years-how-washington-post-helped-give-us-iraq-war/
Dick Cheney didn’t like the CIA’s original conclusion, so pushed his own “intelligence” that Iraq did have WMD.
Remember how Bush blew Valerie Plame’s cover when her husband Joe Wilson tried to expose how the bogus evidence? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
You believe Russia hacked…no one else, eh? All that “high confidence” eh? As reporters say, “show me the car fax” because right now we’re in the “evidence free” zone. Anytime the “CIA concludes” something we need to be on Red Alert. I’m open to the notion but “high confidence” by the CIA and “intelligence agencies” and a story in the Ol’ Gray Lady ain’t jack. Because Judith Miller, Judith Miller, Ol’ Judy Miller. Capisce? But hey, I’m open. Standing by for the evidence because, you know, fake news. Makes for a great excuse in Palm Beach for those elite billionaire Dem donors next month…hell, David Brock has to have some excuse. Ooo….maybe you get a glimpse of the evidence at the $1 m and above level? Nice donor benefit idea right there.
It’s a serious charge on the part of the CIA. No doubt.
It’s not “conspiracy theory” when we say that the CIA has a checkered history.
GW Bush’s war on Iraq was, imo, not much better than what we’re seeing in Syria. YMMV. There are no choir boys or girls on the international political stage.
All of this doesn’t negate the fact that our political representatives were hacked and the Dems bore the brunt of the damage in this election.
I’m going to try to be pragmatic on this one. What are we going to do? At least lend some credibility to a well documented CIA report or take the word of Trump and Bannon that the system’s rigged unless its favoring their agenda?
I’ll side with the CIA report on this one. The ramifications are too severe to ignore.
That’s another thing about the Russian propaganda, it blames the liberals alone and let’s the conservatives who are guilty of much worse war crimes completely off the hook. That’s because Putin is selling himself as the world’s greatest conservative leader, and is making new allies with Pat Buchanan who was one of the architects of the Reagan-era ‘Moral Majority’ movement which heralded the rise of the Christian right as a political force.
Now Buchanan is full of praise for Putin’s ‘paleo-conservative moment’. The great ideological struggle of the 21st century will be between ‘conservatives and traditionalists in every country arrayed against the militant secularism of a multicultural and transnational elite’, Buchanan wrote in a recent blog post. ‘While much of American and western media dismiss him as an authoritarian and reactionary, a throwback, Putin may be seeing the future with more clarity than Americans.’
http://www.spectator.co.uk/2014/02/putins-masterplan/
I remember Buchanan well. They were not a “majority” and the rest of us were not “immoral”. He’d fallen off of my radar until you just posted this. Thanks for the heads up. What a snake.
One of my co-workers was saying how happy she was that Trump had won, citing an article in which Putin had said he’d have cut all ties with the US if Hillary had won. I asked her, “Since when did we become beholden to and fearful of Russia?”.
What’s going on here, people? It’s like the world’s been turned upside down.
I wonder if this can all be a lead up by the insiders to a nuclear engagement, to an end game? So many Generals, so many ‘mad dogs’ now in charge…and it is all true reality TV.
Obama announced a thorough investigation into the Russian hacks and their supposed influence to be concluded in January. Finally finally finally our President is stepping up. Enough with anonymous sources and zero evidence from both sides.
Yes
Allen, you’ve lost what little credibility you had left. If you don’t retract this, then you have no shame.
Allen,
Move to Canada.
Allen
You’re the one commenting as if you have lost your mind. The CIA does have a checkered past that it needs to be called out upon. But I don’t see Vladimir Putin, Russia’s former KGB chief as having a better history. Why are you only pointing out the war crimes that Russian propaganda machine wants pushed, but leaving out all of Putin’s?
Diane isn’t supporting war criminals, you are.
Allen,
This blog is open to civil discussion. It is not an open mic. It is my blog, my living room, my classroom. All are welcome so long as they follow a few simple rules. Don’t insult your host. Be civil. No four-letter words beyond hell and damn. No conspiracy theories like 9/11 Truthers or Sandy Hook hoaxers.
You have repeatedly insulted your host. You are rude, obnoxious, and uncivil. I don’t want you in my living room. Go away and don’t come back.
Diane, “Where is the evidence based information?”
Don’t like Assange? What are your thoughts on Snowden?
My initial reaction to Snowden was to feel admiration for his revealing the extent to which the government was watching all of us.
But now that he is helping Putin, I think he is a traitor.
It is one thing to be a whistle blower, which is heroic.
It is another to help a ruthless tyrant who wishes to destroy the western alliance and harm our country.
Maybe Trump will now pardon him and he can return. I would rather see him live out his life in Moscow.
Putin is not our friend. I never want us to get into a war. But Russia’s interests and ours are not the same.
Hmmmm….. Seems to me that revealing information to the public is what democracy is all about. How can people make an ‘informed’ decision without information?
And, on that same line of reasoning, has anyone said that the ‘Russian hacked’ emails, or whatever, were fabrications? If those emails weren’t there, they couldn’t have been hacked.
So, the arguments against Snowden and the ‘election breach’ go back to a manufactured bigotry against the ‘evil Russians’. And, who is stewing up that toxic brew? And, why?
John,
There is much more going on with Russia that has not been disclosed yet. The Russian influence is obvious once you look into for yourself. http://warontherocks.com/2016/11/trolling-for-trump-how-russia-is-trying-to-destroy-our-democracy/
When it comes to politics, there will always be dirt if you dig deep enough. That’s why the Russians were digging into the Democrats. It’s also the reason Putin suppresses/controls the media in Russia.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/act-four/wp/2016/02/09/how-censorship-works-in-vladimir-putins-russia/?utm_term=.12af188f29ae
If someone else had hacked the GOP for the same reason they would have found dirt too. The Russians did hack the GOP but supported Trump instead of Hillary for a reason. Trump is their perfect Kremlin candidate, a weapon to destroy or erode the power of the United States in the world.
Do you know about Transparency International?
Click the link and scroll down to discover on the map where the press had more freedom. Even the media in China has more freedom than it does in Russia.
http://www.transparency.org/cpi2015
Having read through all these comments, what I see is a lot of fear and not much actual information. I have seen no evidence of what the CIA is anonymously asserting. So I will wait for that.
In the meantime, there is a war going on in Syria that right now is centered in Aleppo. Why is Aleppo important? Because that is the place where a pipeline is supposed to go through (or maybe not supposed to go through, depending on which side you are). The US appears to be aligned with Al Quaeda or ISIS or whatever. Hillary repeated called for a no-fly zone which by all accounts is tantamount to a direct encounter with Russia, aka war. Through the campaign she derided Putin and made it clear he was evil (which he may be – but relative to what I’m not sure). Her state department helped overthrow the government of Ukraine, see the Mark Ames piece I posted above. Trump says we should try and work with Putin. I dunno except that I don’t want a hot war with Russia. And btw, I don’t even think Trump is making most of his cabinet decisions – they seem to be right out of the Pence/Koch bros. playbook.
I have been watching the Stein recount on some listserves with major election integrity activists who have been doing this since 2000 if not longer. As far as I can see, there is NO interference from Russia or China – but much interference from Republicans, from voter disenfranchisement of Democrat voters, to malfunctioning voter machines, to some large anomalies throughout some of these states. The Republican owned election system is a much bigger threat to democracy than the possibility of interference from outside this country. But as usual, I see few focusing on that problem.
I urge anyone here to google Jeff Bezos/Amazon/CIA. CIA is intimately involved with Bezos’ business and Bezos owns the WaPo. Who is a client of who there, I can’t tell. Just something to consider that this Russian propaganda/fake news story (which appears to be almost the very definition of fake news itself) is coming from WaPo. And, again, the vote hacking accusation has thus far produced zero evidence.
I have no idea where any of this deep state stuff is going but nowhere good that I can see. And for the record, I voted for none of the presidential candidates, having found them all inadequate (and being a CA voter where I could safely make that protest vote). I do, however, blame the Dems for losing this election for many reasons, most having to do with offering nothing to the working people of this country. After winning everything in 2008, the Dems proceeded to: lose the house, the senate, presently having one state more than one third of the goverships in this country, and have lost numerous state legislatures. The Dems keep offering up corporate Dem candidates year after year that the people will not vote for. The dogs won’t eat the dogfood. And the Dems are keeping in leadership those dogfood servers whose sell-by date has long passed.
This will not end well unless good people smarten up and fight for what they want – the bad people have been working consistently for over 30 years to dominate everything and right now they’re winning.
Kim,
Unlike you, I don’t mistrust all the institutions of the US government.
Someone hacked the emails of the Clinton campaign. There was nothing in them, but they were strategically leaked,drip, drip, drip, to do maximum damage to Clinton.
Why no hacking campaign to embarrass Trump?
All of our intelligence agencies identified the source of the hacking as Russian agents. Putin is very happy that Trump was elected.
Who do you think hacked the DNC?
I do have a lot of mistrust of the institutions of the US government. I think it’s well deserved and is a responsibility of my citizenship. On the other hand, I distrust corporations as the governing bodies they have become even more. I fight to make our government more transparent and responsive to the needs of the 99% – not the 1%.
I have no idea who hacked the DNC. For all I know, it was someone on the inside of the DNC. I have seen no evidence. I don’t think the Bernie supporters think “nothing” is in them. Enough was in them to make Debbie Wasserman Schultz resign, deservedly.
And btw, Trump does not use email so there’s nothing to hack there. His tweets are all in the public record. I blame the media for using him as bait to get eyeballs – and more money from advertisers – and giving him about $2 billion worth of free advertising.
Trump might not use personal e-mails but his companies do, and he is a known micro-manager for his privately held business empire, so he knows his companies’ management uses e-mails for business purposes. That means, those e-mails used for business purposes are his e-mails, they belong to Donald Trump.
“Over the course of decades, Donald Trump’s companies have systematically destroyed or hidden thousands of emails, digital records and paper documents remanded in official proceedings, often in defiance of court orders.”
No one will ever convince me that this was done without Donald Trump’s knowledge and permission.
http://www.newsweek.com/2016/11/11/donald-trump-companies-destroyed-emails-documents-515120.html
Kim,
Hillary now leads Trump by 2.7 million votes. You have been reading too much extremist nonsense. Hillary is a smart, wise, experienced woman who wanted to help solve the problems our society and improve our relations with other nations. She had no nefarious designs. I have met Hillary on numerous occasions, and I can tell you from my own interactions that she is a warm, funny, compassionate person who is nothing like the caricature created by the far-right crazies and swallowed whole by far-left extremists. We lost the chance for a president who genuinely cares about working people, about poor people, about expanding opportunity for all, and about making life better for all. Her loss is a loss for all Americans.
With all due respect, I don’t know what you mean by “extremist.” I read a wide variety of material and listen to a wide variety of opinions so I can see what everyone’s saying. I make sure and not depend only on corporate media.
I don’t know what you read. I’m glad you read this blog. I am sorry you have so much distrust for our government. I can be very critical but until this election, I always believed in this country and the essential goodness of the American people. The election of a charlatan has shaken me to my core. I conclude we need more education, more critical thinking, more readiness to fight to put our country back on track. Dont be a cynic. Join the struggle to get us through this next four years and plan for the future.
If the CIA provides the info they have, that could be marked to secret or even higher, that could compromise a source inside Russia who would soon vanish for ever or reveal a technology that they don’t want the Russians to know about. If Donald Trump knows this, then he is lying as usual, because as president-elect, he’d be privy to more detailed info than the CIA would share with the media/public. It doesn’t help that Trump isn’t attending many intelligence befriends, but Pence is almost everyday. It’s quite possible while Trump is running around lying to his supporters at rallies, Pence will be making presidential decisions on a daily basis. It’s obvious that Trump has already started his campaign for the next election, and he won’t stop while his cabinet and Pence do all the work that he’ll take credit for.
Kim
I wouldn’t be surprized if the CIA owned the Washington Post and many other corporations for cash to cover their operations. But the evidence for Russian tampering goes way beyond what the Washington Post has reported so far. For example look at this Dworkin Report that exposes Trump’s connections to Putin and Russia going back to the 1980s.
The best evidence for me however, is Putin’s political advisor’s, Alexander Dugin’s website. Here the Eurasian movement’s fascists leader openly explains what Putin and Trump are thinking to his followers worldwide. Trump may be keeping the Americans guessing, but in Russia, Dugin is keeping everyone well informed. (Google Alexander Dugin 4threvolutionarywar, my comment won’t post when I try to include the link.)
Amazon’s CEO Jeff Bezos secured a $600 million contract with the CIA. He also owns the WaPo. I wonder why the WaPo didn’t mention this conflict in their article.
https://www.thenation.com/article/amazon-washington-post-and-600-million-cia-contract/
Allen, your alleged list of war criminals is missing a few names: For instance, dig deep enough, and sometimes you don’t need to dig far at all, just scratch the surface, and they all are guilty. FDR (D), Truman (D), Eisenhower (R), Kennedy (D), LBJ (D), Nixon (R), Ford (R), Reagan (R), George H. W. Bush (R), Bill Clinton (neo-liberal), and G. W. Bush (neo-conservative).
I wonder what Donald Trump (Trumpist) will do to join that list if he hasn’t already done it. If he sold out the U.S. to Russia, then he is traitor.
The only president who didn’t make the list is Carter (D).
http://theelders.org/article/only-us-president-who-didnt-wage-war
Why are you only picking on Obama and Hillary Clinton, who inherited the mess all those other presidents left for them?
Lloyd,
Allen can’t answer you. I kicked him out. Uncivil behavior. Rude, obnoxious, shrill. And you nailed it. He hates the country he lives in. I think he misses Stalin. Everyone else is Adele-put.
To further the conversation, here is a petition that may be of interest to readers here. It’s from Harvey Wasserman (see more at http://solartopia.org/ if you’re not familiar with his long-time activism in anti-nuclear and election integrity):
ASK ELECTORAL COLLEGE TO NOT VOTE UNTIL RUSSIAN HACKS OF 2016 ELECTION TO HELP DONALD TRUMP ARE FULLY INVESTIGATED
Petition by harvey wasserman
To be delivered to Electoral College Electors, All Electors
We ask all Electoral College Electors to not vote on the presidency until CIA and other official investigations into the Russian government’s hacking of our 2016 election on behalf of Donald Trump are fully completed and made public.
http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/ask-electoral-college-1?source=c.em&r_by=17170808
Great proposal.
Appreciated the dialogue between you and Kim.
I signed and forwarded it to all my friends. Thanks.
I was talking to a friend about this subject last night. I was saying that I couldn’t understand why Obama hadn’t started up an investigation sooner. Congress is out of session now, after all.
He told me he’d read that Obama had wanted to start an investigation back in September when the issue had surfaced, but Mitch McConnell had stonewalled it.
Anyone else read/heard about that?
Trump is nothing but a pawn in a huge chess game.