A sign of sanity, common sense, and responsibility: Culver City schools require all eligible students to be vaccinated. Superintendent estimates that about 1 in 20 parents object. Why should their objection override the public health of all students?
The Culver City Unified School District has issued a COVID-19 vaccine requirement for all eligible students — believed to be the first such requirement in California — a move the district superintendent said has the overwhelming support of parents, teachers and staff.
Currently, children 12 and older are eligible for the COVID-19 vaccine, which remains under emergency use authorization by the Federal Drug Administration. The Culver City requirement has a Nov. 19 deadline, and district officials hope the vaccine will have received full FDA approval by then.
California has ordered all K-12 school employees to be vaccinated or submit to weekly coronavirus testing — and a growing number of school districts, including Los Angeles Unified, are mandating employee vaccines with no testing option. A spokesperson for the state Department of Education said the office is not aware of any other student vaccine mandate among California’s 1,000 school districts.
Culver City Supt. Quoc Tran said the student vaccine mandate was issued after safety protocol discussions with the school board, teacher and employee unions and parents — who agreed that the requirement would help protect their schools as much as possible. The district, which serves 7,100 K-12 students, has 900 employees, who also must be vaccinated. Students go back to school on Thursday.
Diane Ravitch's blog 
Sanity, finally!!!!!!!
xoxoxoxxoxo!!!!!!!
❤
What if Newsom losses the recall election and a Republican and/or libertarian ends up governor of California, will the state end up with another governor like Texas and Florida?
Reblogged this on dean ramser.
Culver City has a couple high schools. At those school, according to this article, every single student and employee in the building will be vaccinated.
Should students and employees also be required to wear masks at all times in those high schools?
So far I see one vote in favor of “masks should be required in school buildings in which all students and staff have been vaccinated,” on the basis that the vaccines don’t prevent the transmission of Delta because “fully vaccinated people carry the same amount of Covid as the unvaccinated.”
Any other opinions? Should masks be required in buildings with 100% vaccination rates?
“Any other opinions?” Thanks for asking, because we desperately need more opinions at this point, not rational discourse informed by science in the pursuit of best practices in managing the spread of disease. We are drowning in a sea of scientific findings! We must have more opinions!
FLERP!,
Yes, masks should be required as long as the pandemic is raging.
Honestly, I hear so many adults whining about mask wearing, but I don’t hear the high school kids whining about it.
Is there a big movement of parents in poverty saying their kid should not be required to wear a mask? On the contrary, many of those families are concerned about returning to school period. That is because the loudest voices against taking precautions are the privileged ones who know that they will get special medical treatment that the poorest Americans don’t.
The big irony is that if we had not had so many people in this country so angry about having to follow the same basic rules that people in this country followed for many decades — insisting that their own comfort was more important — schools with fully vaccinated students probably wouldn’t also need mask-wearing.
Masks should be a requirement.
Students also have to wear shoes, FLERP! But I’m sure if some right wing billionaire funded an “anti-shoes in school” movement, and paid “researchers” to show how damaging it was to some kids to have to wear shoes, newly elected right wing school boards would ban schools from requiring students to wear shoes.
Ted Cruz has not started a movement of parents in his private school asserting the right to send his children there without masks. Why not? Their liberty is being infringed.
You once said you are switching your kid to a private school, and I assume that private school is a mask-optional school full of like-minded parents who know their child’s rights not to be bothered by a mask are the most important thing. If you didn’t choose a mask-optional private school, you would be a hypocrite, like Ted Cruz.
Maybe doctors should be mask-optional, too, so that next time you take your kid to the pediatrician, or he needs to go a hospital, you can be in the special area with only unmasked kids.
Maybe the quick solve is for every American who doesn’t want to wear a mask to have special maskless hospitals manned by whatever medical personnel agree that masks are unnecessary because they are all vaccinated.
markstextterminal,
Did you notice that FLERP! did not offer his own opinion?
What kind of person would keep posting, as FLERP! does: “Any other opinions? Should masks be required in buildings with 100% vaccination rates?” and NEVER offer his own opinion?
FLERP! does this all the time. It’s trolling. FLERP! doesn’t seem to have the courage to just say “Masks should not be required in buildings with 100% vaccination rates.”
I think the idea is FLERP! doesn’t want to go on record supporting something that he can’t actually defend.
FLERP!, Should masks be required in buildings with 100% vaccination rates?
I suspect this will result in a 5,000 word diatribe by FLERP! about how I should not be allowed to respond to him, in which FLERP! appeals to Diane Ravitch for help and never answers this basic question and defends his opinion.
What is wrong with you?
What is wrong with you?
You had hours to offer your own opinion instead of trying to get other people to offer theirs and then demanding they defend it.
You didn’t stop until I called it out.
What’s the matter with you?
FLERP! opposes any mask requirements in any public school that requires vaccination (which of course is impossible due to real medical exemptions). Glad you finally went on record with that opinion.
Hey NYC Public School Parent: Yes, I did notice that. I have worked hard not to reply to flerp!, but I couldn’t resist responding to this latest piece of nonsense. I don’t know what differentiates me, in so taking flerp!’s bait, from other trolls. I was in no mood to read that comment this morning.
Incidentally, after three years away, I am about to return to being an NYC Public School Teacher–and I am excited about it.
Mark,
Politico Pro reported that incoming New York Governor Kathy Hochul will impose a mask mandate on schools across the state.
Good, Diane, and thanks. I’ll be working in the Prospect/Lefferts Garden area of Brooklyn and, I hope, living within walking distance of the campus on Kingston Avenue. I began stocking up on masks last week when I learned that the NYCDOE had appointed me.
Sorry you fee that way, Mark.
markstextterminal,,
Congratulations on returning to the NYC public school system. I salute you because I know you have signed up for the difficult task of teaching students who have been negatively impacted, both emotionally and academically, by this pandemic. Given how the right wing anti-public school folks have set and controlled the media narrative for over a decade, I know teaching can be a thankless task, but I thank you.
FLERP!, I don’t think I’m alone in these fora in finding your contrarianism tedious, reactionary, and, ultimately, intellectually vacant. If you could try a little harder to participate in the fact-based discourse that Diane works so hard to promote, I wouldn’t feel this way.
Just sayin’.
I definitely sense you’re not alone, and I have no harsher critic than myself, but even factoring that in, I disagree with your assessment. But you’ve always been a nice guy, so I wish you the best.
Fair enough, FLERP–and likewise. I wish you the best.
I appreciate the civility.
Least we can do here, Diane.
Thanks for your kind words. FLERP!. (Does the exclamation point in your name terminate the sentence, or do I need to deploy a period?)
Should students and employees also be required to wear masks at all times in those high schools?
Yes
Bob, under what circumstances should masks no longer be required?
No. You’re right, FLERP. We should just stop taking any precautions whatsoever and let kids die. No biggie.
That didn’t answer the question, Bob, and it was a sincere question.
And Bob, I consider vaccinations to be precautions, and far more effective precautions than masks. I assume you do, too. My question was, if we are going to require masks even in buildings where everyone is vaccinated, at what point would we not require masks?
Because wearing a mask is so onerous. Why, it’s practically as bad as dying from Covid-19 is!
Ok, Bob.
What, FLERP? No response to my suggestion about requiring masks only of red-haired kids for a small portion of the day on Tuesdays? I thought you would be all over this because it is in keeping with your principle: let’s ignore completely one of the things we might do to keep infections down. I know, I didn’t go quite as far as you, but surely my suggestion is in line with your “reasoning.”
Funny stuff.
“Ignoring completely one of the things we might do to keep infections down” might include doing remote school for another year, or two, or three. (Although I’m not aware of any data showing that actually would keep infections down.)
It’s a shame that every district didn’t really make huge investments in remote school technology last spring, because a lot of people want that option to continue indefinitely, and I think it’s going to be a growing feature of education in the U.S. But several very large districts have instituted centrally managed remote education programs, and others will follow. For a certain segment of families and teachers, remote education will continue to be popular, not just because of Covid, but also for new possible pandemic viruses, flu (very deadly for children especially), and plain-old convenience.
After all, if we relax all precautions and just let kids and teachers and their loved ones die, there will still be plenty of them left over!
And hey, we can always make more.
But seriously, FLERP, I think we should require mask only for red haired kids on Tuesdays between 10:45 and 11:18 AM.
FLERP!, under what circumstances should masks no longer be required?
Why do you keep asking questions of other people that you won’t answer yourself?
At a minimum, I think masks should not be required in buildings where everyone is vaccinated.
FLERP!,
“At a minimum…”?
Are you saying you support REQUIRING vaccination of all students in public schools and anyone who doesn’t — or can’t for medical reasons – should not be allowed to be there?
Your simplistic answer is basically that schools should find all kinds of complicated means (which you don’t explain) to figure this out, when a simple solve is to require masks – at least until this epidemic stops being in full swing.
Ok FLERP!, you are in charge. I don’t especially love that my kid has to wear a mask, but I prefer that to my kid bringing COVID home or – even worse – exposing other kids whose families are much more vulnerable to the ravages of this disease.
You haven’t explained what happens to vulnerable students? Your kid’s right to go maskless is more important than lowing the risk – even a little – for those kids?
I am fully vaccinated, but I double mask and try to maintain social distancing when in public. Why? Because vaccinated people can catch this thing, because people who have had Covid can catch it again, because it sends a signal to others to have some common sense, because I could have it and not know it and be a spreader. I know well, and I have posted about this here, how weak the protection offered by most kinds of masks is. But weak is better than nothing in this case. Obviously. It blows my mind that there are some who can’t see such an obvious point.
By the way, it is absolutely clear from science that vaccinated people can still get COVID and spread it. It is great news that the vaccine clearly lowers the risk of more serious illness, but with a raging pandemic where Texas is ordering extra mortuary trucks, why would anyone blow off science and still be so anti-mask.
The “when” for mask-wearing not being necessary is when hospitals aren’t overwhelmed and overburdened.
When it looked like COVID was under control, that was how people were proceeding, but opposing masks in schools now is indefensible.
And I haven’t really seen a rational FLERP! defense of why he believes so strongly that if schools require vaccines of students and staff, mask wearing should not be required.
My take: Let’s throw everything we have at stopping this thing: universal vaccination and mask mandates. K95 or equivalent masks for all people in school, teachers, admins, staff, kids.
Or we could take the IQ45, DeSantisss, Abbottoir POV: My Freedumb (e.g., liberty to be stupid) trumps your right to continue living.
I can tell you. I don’t want to get this thing again. It’s really, really bad.
Bob,
I agree! I was thrilled when it seemed like the end of having to mask up was nigh, but because – for purely political self-serving reasons – Republican politicians were pushing the false narrative that pandemic restrictions were an infringement on people’s liberties, we are again faced with a real danger. When hospitals start filling up, masks are the no-brainer, relatively easy way to slow this down. I know masks aren’t perfect. But when it comes to slowing down a pandemic, it is selfish to imply that it is people who believe in mask mandates who are selfish or science-denying.
I think FLERP is asking a reasonable question here. Corona virus is now a permanent part of our world, so there will always be a risk of infection. We can reduce the risk of disease by making masking a permanent part of our world as well. Do folks here think that is a good idea? Would it be better to allow people to be permanently remote?
If folks here think that we could stop requiring masking, what benchmarks would need to be reached for masking to be optional?
I have answered your question repeatedly: everyone should be vaccinated, as they are for measles, mumps, and smallpox, and everyone should be masked to minimize the dangers of transmission.
You know, I haven’t a freaking clue when we stop masking. But we don’t do it in the middle of another wave of a full-blown pandemic, for Christ’s sake, and I am sick of these smug comments what just encourage the morons who are prolonging this thing by refusing to take necessary precautions.
I have lost all patience with this nonsense. We have an epidemic of stupidity in this country, fueled by the likes of Trump and DeSantis, that is prolonging the worst of this pandemic. Wherever I go in Flor-uh-duh, the Bubbas and Bubbettes are maskless, or they are wearing a mask BELOW THEIR NOSES. And many are militant about this–witness the witless schoolboard meetings around the country. Enough. it’s time we took public health here seriously and started mandating vaccination and masking.
Such people put all of us, AND OUR CHILDREN, at risk. And so do educated people who ought to know better who make excuses for them and provide them with “arguments.”
I reasonable response is one that makes sense GIVEN THE CURRENT ENVIRONMENT of idiotic pandemic denialism.
Dr Ravitch,
I certainly agree that everyone should be vaccinated. Bob Shepherd argues the when everyone is vaccinated they should also be masked. Careful attention to my post would reveal that this is the topic I am addressing. Do you think that students, fore the next year or two, should be required to wear masks in class?
So long as COVID variations evolve, we should protect ourselves, our families, and our communities by wearing a mask in public spaces. The effectiveness of the vaccine declines over time. I don’t want to die and I don’t want to cause anyone else to get sick or die because of my failure to wear a mask in public places.
Bob,
I think getting a clue would be useful. This is the difference between people who are responsible for making decisions and those that simply throw rocks from the sidelines.
There has been a lot of irresponsible decision making of late. And when people make the wrong ones in the middle of a pandemic, others die unnecessarily.
Dr. Ravitch,
The virus will be evolving forever. Do you think humans should be masked in perpetuity?
So long as the virus poses a risk to life, it is my view that people should be masked in public spaces. That will be how I act. If you intend to throw away your masks, that’s your choice. I don’t make the laws and fortunately, neither do you. Don’t you think 600,000 plus deaths are enough?
It’s long been part of Japanese culture that during flu season, when out in public, many people wear masks as a sensible precaution. Who knows what the future brings, here, but if masks offer significant protection (and they do) and if the protection is still needed (and it is), then they should still be worn. Again, WHY IS THIS NOT OBVIOUS?!?!?!?!
Among the Flor-uh-duh Bubbas and Bubbettes, there seems to be the opinion that it is somehow noble–brave or daring or indicative of their love of “free-dumb” that they go maskless. Where did they learn this behavior? Well, from Glorious Leader Who Shines More Orange Than Does the Sun, with his posing for the cameras to tear his mask off defiantly, with his comments about “not letting Covid run your life.” From the guy whose self assessment was that he knows more about this than the scientists and doctors do: “They call me up. They say, ‘You really get this.'”
It is shocking to me to hear the same sort of blather from some educated persons on this blog.
Heedless is not what the times call for, and yes, I can imagine scenarios in which it never is again.
I ran into this in my own family. My daughter’s husband initially resisted getting vaccinated because he “didn’t want others telling him what to do.” Fortunately, he worked through this, for the sake of himself, his wife, his kids, and everyone else whom he knows.
Does my insistence on precaution make me less macho, less freedom-loving, than the Bubbas and Bubbettes are? than are brave Cadet Bone Spurs (IQ45) and Macho Man Mini-Me Desantisssss? Does it show me to be a sniveling coward, afraid of disease and dying, unlike my betters?
I don’t think so. If anything, I think that I have armed myself quite well, psychologically, against fear of decline and dying. That’s a whole subject that I’m not going to get into here, now. I think this just shows, rather, reasonable caution, responsibility, sanity, lack of heedlessness.
Obviously during lunch break and when the kids drink water from the fountain, masks will be removed or lowered. Otherwise, masks should be worn by everyone in the school unless a rare individual has some clear medical problem which would not allow for masks. Get vaccinated and wear masks when in public or confined spaces.
FLERP: vaccine efficacy is waning. One study shows protection against mild to moderate Covid has dropped to 40% in some. I don’t want moderate Covid, especially since we don’t yet know if “long Covid “ could follow that. I don’t want permanent brain fog. So I think the masks need to stay.
👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽 … MAKES SENSE!
“Should students and employees also be required to wear masks at all times…”
It should “help” considering:
“the current vaccines DO NOT prevent the transmission of the Delta variant, as a new UK study suggests, confirming the CDC finding in Provincetown of similar levels of Covid virus in the nasal passages of the vaxxed and unvaxxed in Provincetown:
Fully vaccinated people carry the same amount of Covid as the unvaccinated, scientists have found in a new study.”
CCSD refuses to be safe. Too many students in too small a space.
The only way out is vaccination. Otherwise Vegas schools are just giant super spreaders.
Sign and share petition.
https://www.change.org/p/governor-sisolak-ccsd-covid-vaccination-should-be-mandatory?fbclid=IwAR09fOKjk72wTBzttsWoeKrb3QaC4CTD5_owQbxhw5EXqLtRrzXicMCN8PA
Signed, Ms. Sullivan. Good luck with this!
Kudos to Culver City for caring about kids. Teachers and admin. standing up for kids makes me proud to be an educator of some 57 years. Besides, I was born in Culver city Community Hospital in December……of 1941:-)
They have 5 elementary, 1 middle and 1 high. It’s a very small district.